Do less attractive women make better long-term partners?



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 4:56 am 
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Original post by Pimpy of City-Data The below post is not my opinion.

“If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife. From my personal point of view, get an ugly girl to marry you.”
-Jimmy Soul, 1963

Every red-blooded boy dreams of growing up and marrying an attractive woman. As we grow into red-blooded men, those dreams don’t change much. For some of us our goals regarding marriage itself evolve (or in my case, disappear), but the broader dream of snagging the most attractive women on the market stays intact for just about every guy.

The draws of an attractive woman are many. By simple human nature and evolutionary biology, our eyes are drawn to them first. For most of us, being intimate with an attractive woman triggers a much more intense sexual arousal, everything else being equal. Lastly, and perhaps most importantly of all, having one on your arm is a surefire way to launch your social standing into the stratosphere. Everyone looks up to the guy who is cracking a dime-piece.

But are guys who achieve our universal boyhood dream of tying the knot with the hottest girl in the room sacrificing a lifetime of happiness for occasional physical pleasure and bragging rights?

I’ve been single all 29 of my years. In that time I’ve experienced a lot of women, and those women have spanned a wide gamut when it comes to physical attractiveness. Non-discrimination has long been my practice when it comes to hook-ups. I fondly refer to the light switch in my bedroom as “the great equalizer.” I would be lying, however, if I told you that my more attractive conquests never inspired a more spirited victory dance the next morning.

Back in college when I would bed an 8 or a 9 (the elusive 10’s always managed to slip from my grasp), I would encourage them to stay long enough to have breakfast in the morning. Sometimes I downright begged. Ostensibly I was just being a gentleman, but in reality I wanted to make sure my roommates got a look at what was naked in my bed the night before.

My less attractive attainments, I’m almost ashamed to say now, were ushered out the door before anyone else in the apartment was awake.

With 30 just around the corner, most of the guys I spent the last decade chasing dimes with are becoming real adults. Every other entry in my Facebook news feed is either a picture of an engagement ring or an ultrasound. While I have no desire to join their ranks, this shift in social dynamic has inspired me to look back through the women in my past (the ones I can remember, at least) and think about what I would look for were I ever to get into the whole “monogamy” thing.

What I found was eye-opening. There is pretty much a straight-line inverse relationship between how physically attractive my former flames were and how good of a mate I think they would make.

I’ll go a step further and say I’d rather go snorkeling at a sewage SPAM plant than spend the rest of my life with any of the eye-candy of my past.

The reasons why less attractive women make better life partners haven’t been difficult for me to wrap my brain around. Hot women know we feel lucky to be with them, and they act accordingly. Most of the ones I’ve known have acted like I should feel privileged to wait on them hand and foot. They want to call the shots all the time because in their minds, I’m lucky just to have them around. Why wouldn’t you be thrilled to skip poker night and go watch “The Vow” with me? Can’t you see how hot I am?!? Guys always feel honored to be in my presence, even if it’s watching a terrible movie based on a terrible book by a terrible author! What’s wrong with you?

That’s the other problem with the hottest ones. If you won’t put up with their crap, there are a million other guys who will, and they know that. Not only do they know it, they let YOU know it every chance they get.

With less attractive women, the roles are reversed. If you’re a decent looking guy, well-educated, in shape, with good conversational skills and at least an average sized tool, they feel like they’ve died and gone to heaven when they earn your attention. Their life mission becomes to please you and keep you around. The less attractive the girls I’ve been with were, the more like a king they treated me.

There was one I had a fling with in the summer of 2008 who had a somewhat cute face but about 40 extra pounds on her. She would come over and clean for me at least twice a week, though I never asked once. The only thing she wanted in return? For ME to let HER give me oral sex. You think you could get that kind of arrangement from Megan Fox?

Another one came from a wealthy family, but she had a double chin and small breasts. Her arms were a little hairy too, and not just the standard acceptable female peach fuzz. I can’t remember a time she came over without bearing gifts, even though the span of our relationship covered no holidays or birthdays. The best looking girl I ever dated never gave me a damn thing except a headache, though she got mad at me for making it to the one-month mark without buying her flowers or jewelry.

The history of my dating life is chock full of such contrasts. The finest women were fulfilling to the eyes, the least fine fulfilling to the heart. (Aside: You’ll never again hear me say anything that gay on this message board. If you do, please come through my monitor and knock me out.) Even the sex was way better with the less attractive women. They wouldn’t dream, for example, of receiving oral and not reciprocating. Women who are hot and know it, on the other hand, don’t feel the need to reciprocate because in their minds, just going down on them should give a guy all the pleasure he needs.

The most stunning realization I’ve made during my introspection on this topic is that most of the women I’ve hooked up with who weren’t blessed in the realm of physical beauty weren’t better partners only because they felt they had to be to keep me around. If they were, obviously they failed, because here I am still single. I got to know a lot of them pretty well, some of them I still keep in touch with, and the truth is that on the inside -- they are more attractive people.

When you go through life without being constantly fawned over for something as superficial as your outward appearance, you develop inward qualities to compensate, and those qualities begin to emanate outward to those who take the time to get to know you. Realizing this honestly makes me feel bad about all the women I have known over the years who were beautiful people on the inside, that I used for sex but had too much pride to let my friends see me with.

As soon as I’m ready for a meaningful relationship, those are the girls I’m calling first -- assuming they haven't already been snatched up by other guys who were smart enough to learn what I'm just now learning.

Until then, it looks like I’ve found a good reason to use only hot girls for sex!
---------------

What are your thoughts on this matter?

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Last edited by Versalis on Sat Jul 04, 2015 7:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 5:42 am 
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Where was this post when the forum was kicking out errors? Probably one of the most interesting in quite a while.

I sort of used to think like you do currently, but at the same time my experiences brought me down a different route. I spent time having to figure out how to get the hotter women while being armed with with average looks(maybe slightly above average on a good day).

What I've come to understand is that hot women are way more insecure than your average and below average woman. So insecure to the point that they are afraid of actually revealing who they are to a guy and because of that they put walls up. Most of those time those walls are walls meant to scare you away before you can form an opinion of the real her. Some of the walls are to keep you focused on the physical aspects of her. The point is that she is usually trying to keep you out because her real vulnerability is below the surface level and that's the part that fears rejection.

Average (and below) women have less to lose because it's not the physical attraction that's their main feature. Therefore, she has to reel you in with personality and substance. It leaves you believing that the average looking woman is better than the hot ones.

I wrote all of that because if you want to get a hot woman to treat you as well as the average woman would, you have to get the hot woman to reveal her personality. The way to do that is to be more revealing of yourself. They're used to every other guy trying to put on a show to impress her and make her feel like they're lucky enough to be with him. The mistake is that these guys avoid getting to know her and allowing for her to open up. Once a woman opens up to you and feels like you're not going to be judgemental of who she is, she is going to treat you the same way as the average women you speak of.

That's my two cents for what it's worth.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 7:09 am 
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I sort of used to think like you do currently
To be clear, this isn't my thread. I cross posted it. I've actually found the exact opposite. I find that most pretty girls are nice and seem to just be higher quality all-around. The most nasty, cantankerous, bitchy women I have ever met, were all fat.
Every fat woman I have ever met, has serious mental issues. To the point where even if they lost the weight and started looking good, I couldn't imagine dating them. Most fat girls are absolutely head cases.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that looks directly track over all quality, but I will say that the best women I have ever met have overwhelmingly been at least "cute". And most of them have been pretty. The knockout personality quality does seem somewhat lower for me, but part of that is probably different interests. I'm honestly not that interested in consumerism, diets, skin routines, hair routines, etc. So we don't have a ton in common. They seem like perfectly good matches for guys who are into that stuff.

Now there is one caveat. I have always screened *people* for intelligence. If I talk to you for a half minute and determine you're probably average to below average, I politely excuse myself. From what I've seen(casually), it does seem that the dumb, but super hot chicks ARE bitchier/more entitled pains in the ass. But I honestly have next to zero experience dealing with them. They're mostly on the outer edges of my social periphery.

The only thing I've noticed towards the "Hot girls are worse" front is that when it comes to very beautiful women, their personality basically doesn't matter when it comes to their social pecking order. A cute girl who's a bitch, is not going to be as popular as the cute girl who's cool. A homely girl may stand a shot, but she's going to need a very charismatic personality to hang out with the better looking people. But when you go up to the top %2-3 of girls, they basically can get away with anything. Thus leading to the perception that they're bitchier. I don't think they are. It's just that you see her around everywhere, and notice her. The plain looking bitch is more likely to be at home watching the tv due to lack of friends. And even if she is out, you're not paying her any mind, because you don't like her and don't care that you don't like her.
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I wrote all of that because if you want to get a hot woman to treat you as well as the average woman would, you have to get the hot woman to reveal her personality. The way to do that is to be more revealing of yourself. They're used to every other guy trying to put on a show to impress her and make her feel like they're lucky enough to be with him. The mistake is that these guys avoid getting to know her and allowing for her to open up. Once a woman opens up to you and feels like you're not going to be judgemental of who she is, she is going to treat you the same way as the average women you speak of.

That's my two cents for what it's worth.
I think I mostly agree with this. Though not about me needing to open up. Honestly, no girl who has ever dated me knows all that much about me. And they never actually seem to care to. What little I do tell them, they seem to mostly forget.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 7:36 am 
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To be clear, this isn't my thread.
Ha! I read that in the beginning, but I got caught up in the meat of the post and forgot.
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I think I mostly agree with this. Though not about me needing to open up. Honestly, no girl who has ever dated me knows all that much about me. And they never actually seem to care to. What little I do tell them, they seem to mostly forget.
Like I said, I'm an average looking guy...so my value really comes out when a woman feels like she knows me. If I were one of those good looking guys but still had my mentality, I think I'd be unstoppable.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 11:16 pm 
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IMO there is no relation between "hotness" and the level of how good of a girlfriend a girl is. I wasted 10 years of my life with an ugly girl, just because I was needy. Today I'm married with a "hottie" and couldn't care less about her looks. I'm not "happy to be with her" because of her looks. In fact, I've asked her to fuck off several times, almost hoping she would break up with me, due to some argument we had. But she sticks to me like a little plaster, and it turns out she's a really good catch. We fight less and less as time pass and we get to know each other better and better.

Yes, I'm happy to have her, she is a really wonderful person, but I wouldn't hesitate a second to throw her out the front door if something happens. And that's what makes her stick.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 9:10 pm 
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TL;DR tbh.

Point being who cares if one girl is more or less attractive than another. It's mental masturbation. I only approach and get with women if I find her attractive. How attractive doesn't really bother me as long as she gets me going inside, it's god enough for me.

This is just mental masturbation...it's irrelevant if I am honest.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:06 pm 
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Did not read.

But to answer the title question, no.

Statistically speaking not being in high demand makes you inclined to settling. So she may be a more reliable long term partner in the sense that she's less prone to leaving yo' ass, but the quality of the time spent together will reflect that.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 4:35 pm 
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Yep, a lot of mental masturbation and blanket statements here. There is a spectrum of looks and there is a spectrum of attitude - and they are completely independent. You have to realized your experience is limited compared to the entire planet. IE you're likely experiencing something that's local to the city you live, or not accounting for other factors.

Either way, a high value male/female will not settle and will always have options. I can have sex every week with almost anyone I want simply because of money. I'm not necessarily proud of that, but it means at this point I'm almost guaranteed not to enter a monogamous relationship because I can have any girl I want. I also go on dates that go very well then never hear from the person again. So I am very selective about who gets my time.

And an attractive female will function the same way for other reasons :/


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:12 am 
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Yep, a lot of mental masturbation and blanket statements here. There is a spectrum of looks and there is a spectrum of attitude - and they are completely independent.
I really don't think that's true. Fat people are disproportionately losers. They accomplish less in their careers, and tend to be more socially awkward.

There is also scientific evidence that more attractive people have IQs that are 13 points higher on average. IQs are a lot like decibels(only at half pace). Whereas every 10 decibels represents a doubling of volume, in IQs, it's about every 20 points to double intelligence. So the average attractive woman is about %75 smarter than the average plain women. Ugliness and stupidity are also tied together. They're about 15 points dumber on average. So the the average pretty women is well over twice as intelligent than the average ugly woman.

It's just simple genetics. Being pretty is a genetic marker of reproductive desirability. It's not perfect, the same way a woman with big tits is not necessarily more fertile than a flat chested woman, but on average, she is. Most millionaires have IQs over 130. Does everyone with a 130+ IQ make it? Nope, but it's a very useful indicator.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:32 pm 
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When you see a girl as a "conquest"... You're bound to be miserable for the rest of your life. You're constantly going to be "chasing" every girl.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 1:09 am 
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When you see a girl as a "conquest"... You're bound to be miserable for the rest of your life. You're constantly going to be "chasing" every girl.
So very true

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 9:13 pm 
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Yep, a lot of mental masturbation and blanket statements here. There is a spectrum of looks and there is a spectrum of attitude - and they are completely independent.
I really don't think that's true. Fat people are disproportionately losers. They accomplish less in their careers, and tend to be more socially awkward.

There is also scientific evidence that more attractive people have IQs that are 13 points higher on average. IQs are a lot like decibels(only at half pace). Whereas every 10 decibels represents a doubling of volume, in IQs, it's about every 20 points to double intelligence. So the average attractive woman is about %75 smarter than the average plain women. Ugliness and stupidity are also tied together. They're about 15 points dumber on average. So the the average pretty women is well over twice as intelligent than the average ugly woman.

It's just simple genetics. Being pretty is a genetic marker of reproductive desirability. It's not perfect, the same way a woman with big tits is not necessarily more fertile than a flat chested woman, but on average, she is. Most millionaires have IQs over 130. Does everyone with a 130+ IQ make it? Nope, but it's a very useful indicator.
Correlation is not causation.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 1:18 am 
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Yep, a lot of mental masturbation and blanket statements here. There is a spectrum of looks and there is a spectrum of attitude - and they are completely independent.
I really don't think that's true. Fat people are disproportionately losers. They accomplish less in their careers, and tend to be more socially awkward.

There is also scientific evidence that more attractive people have IQs that are 13 points higher on average. IQs are a lot like decibels(only at half pace). Whereas every 10 decibels represents a doubling of volume, in IQs, it's about every 20 points to double intelligence. So the average attractive woman is about %75 smarter than the average plain women. Ugliness and stupidity are also tied together. They're about 15 points dumber on average. So the the average pretty women is well over twice as intelligent than the average ugly woman.

It's just simple genetics. Being pretty is a genetic marker of reproductive desirability. It's not perfect, the same way a woman with big tits is not necessarily more fertile than a flat chested woman, but on average, she is. Most millionaires have IQs over 130. Does everyone with a 130+ IQ make it? Nope, but it's a very useful indicator.

This is by far some of the nerdiest shit I've ever seen. Wow.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 2:18 am 
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This is by far some of the nerdiest shit I've ever seen. Wow.
Yeah, I am pretty smart. Probably why I'm nice looking.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 1:34 pm 
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Quote:
I sort of used to think like you do currently
To be clear, this isn't my thread. I cross posted it. I've actually found the exact opposite. I find that most pretty girls are nice and seem to just be higher quality all-around. The most nasty, cantankerous, bitchy women I have ever met, were all fat.
Every fat woman I have ever met, has serious mental issues. To the point where even if they lost the weight and started looking good, I couldn't imagine dating them. Most fat girls are absolutely head cases.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that looks directly track over all quality, but I will say that the best women I have ever met have overwhelmingly been at least "cute". And most of them have been pretty. The knockout personality quality does seem somewhat lower for me, but part of that is probably different interests. I'm honestly not that interested in consumerism, diets, skin routines, hair routines, etc. So we don't have a ton in common. They seem like perfectly good matches for guys who are into that stuff.

Now there is one caveat. I have always screened *people* for intelligence. If I talk to you for a half minute and determine you're probably average to below average, I politely excuse myself. From what I've seen(casually), it does seem that the dumb, but super hot chicks ARE bitchier/more entitled pains in the ass. But I honestly have next to zero experience dealing with them. They're mostly on the outer edges of my social periphery.

The only thing I've noticed towards the "Hot girls are worse" front is that when it comes to very beautiful women, their personality basically doesn't matter when it comes to their social pecking order. A cute girl who's a bitch, is not going to be as popular as the cute girl who's cool. A homely girl may stand a shot, but she's going to need a very charismatic personality to hang out with the better looking people. But when you go up to the top %2-3 of girls, they basically can get away with anything. Thus leading to the perception that they're bitchier. I don't think they are. It's just that you see her around everywhere, and notice her. The plain looking bitch is more likely to be at home watching the tv due to lack of friends. And even if she is out, you're not paying her any mind, because you don't like her and don't care that you don't like her.
Quote:
I wrote all of that because if you want to get a hot woman to treat you as well as the average woman would, you have to get the hot woman to reveal her personality. The way to do that is to be more revealing of yourself. They're used to every other guy trying to put on a show to impress her and make her feel like they're lucky enough to be with him. The mistake is that these guys avoid getting to know her and allowing for her to open up. Once a woman opens up to you and feels like you're not going to be judgemental of who she is, she is going to treat you the same way as the average women you speak of.

That's my two cents for what it's worth.
I think I mostly agree with this. Though not about me needing to open up. Honestly, no girl who has ever dated me knows all that much about me. And they never actually seem to care to. What little I do tell them, they seem to mostly forget.
Quote:
The most nasty, cantankerous, bitchy women I have ever met, were all fat.
To each his own. But those fat/large girls I've dated have ALL nearly worshipped the ground I walked on.

I'm short, BUT slightly above average looking. And confident. These bigger women would cook for me, have sex, volunteer to give me blowjobs, and in GENERAL expected very little from me back.

Meanwhile the "hotter" ones that I dated were on the other end of the spectrum - did little for me, and in general they were always receiving attention from other guys and showed some willingness to leave etc.


Just for the sheer hell of it, I MAY end up wifing a bigger girl. I have no problems with her being slightly overweight as long as she's CUTE. The whole "beauty" thing is massively overrated and to be honest it doesn't matter if she's beautiful but treats you like shit.

Just my two cents anyway.


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