So about eighteen months ago I went out and approached four sets at bars. I was terrified before doing it and they all went badly. That was a long time ago and I guess I had a lot of work to do on myself in the meantime. Two nights ago I went out and approached four sets. The first went well enough, the second I did a lot right but didn't hook, the third was poor on my part and the fourth just didn't respond. So still and improvement. Last night I went out again and approached six sets. I wouldn't say any of them went badly. Two nights ago I'd been a mixture of nervous and excited. Last night I didn't feel anything adverse. I just felt in good spirits about going out and chatting to women, and I chilled out and had a bath and just took my time about getting ready to go out.

First set were two women who were married with kids. I said to them "so I'm wasting my time for anything but friendship then". It was cool though, I didn't say it in a dickish way, and we had a good chat. Second set one of the women really didn't seem to like me, and they all conveniently got up and went outside moments later. Third set I was quite proud of, I was walking past a bar and saw four women and shamelessly walked in there just to talk to them. I stood there and didn't say much initially. I'm finding that allowing social tension and letting my presence speak for itself initially is working well for me. They were like "do we know him?" and I was saying no, you don't, but they didn't ask me challenging questions like the third set had the other night (where are your friends? So you've come out alone? Just to hit on women?) which I think shows my frame is getting stronger. One of them seemed to quite like me and the others were all fine with me approaching. However, they are had tattoos (hot) and I made what I considered a harmless remark, something about "do you have to have tattoos to be in this crew?" This woman seemed to be actually offended about it and not to like me saying it. I was just playful about it and said she was right, what a bigot I was, but she kept on with it so I was like "okay, I guess my comment touched a bit of a nerve" (i.e. her responsibility, not mine). I asked if I could join them (probably should have tried something a little more aggressive than that to be fair as they'd responded okay to my approach) and they said no, it was a girl's night. So there was that.

Next set in another bar, I approached two women and had one of them laughing her ass off. The other one didn't respond so well. I asked her if she liked men and she said she didn't. I was like "yeah, you've got a bit of anger going on there, haven't you?" I asked them "how many guys have hit on you today?" or "how many guys hit on you?" and the hot one said "none" which I found hard to believe. She said she had a boyfriend though. I left them and told her she was gorgeous. Then spoke to a woman at the bar. She was hot. I saw her texting and read what she texted. She'd written something about being on a "leaving doo" and I opened with "there's only one O in do". She was fine about it and laughed and we chatted a little, but she had a boyfriend nearby. Then this old guy was chatting and being social and he introduced me to this hot young woman who told me I was really handsome and was standing quite close to me. I was a bit bolder with her. She said she had a boyfriend but seemed hesitant somehow and I said something about there was no chance of us having a snog then. Weirdly she seemed like I could have taken her home, but then her girlfriend appeared, I was thinking what the fuck, why didn't you just say you had a girlfriend? This was a typical scenario of a lesbian woman who would have no chance if she was a bloke of similar attractiveness pulling a stunner and it's a little hard to grasp to be honest (maybe a lot of lesbian women can offer a masculinity that a lot of men these days can't, combined with an added tenderness?). It was weird though when she told me she was gay, because she'd seemed like she was very flirty with me, but maybe it was just she liked me in a platonic way? Anyone else had a similar situation?

I approached one more and had a chat and one of them had a boyfriend and the other was a lesbian. However the lesbian was the kind where you meet her and think "yeah, you're obviously a lesbian" and it seems cool, like you kind of couldn't imagine her being anything else and want to go out on the pull with her and help her get laid. We had a good chat and at this point I was just relaxed and felt like I'd probably done enough for one night. Then these group of young lads, all around nineteen came along, along with a super hot young girl (9 for me) and sat at the table I was at. They started making banter and I joined in and we were all getting along. They invited me to come out with them and it was a laugh. They kept chanting my name and shit, making me feel like the man. At this point I saw another couple of women coming to sit near us and I was really confident at this point, I was just like "come here" in a playful but assertive way. I chatted to them for a while and you guess it, they were lesbians. Does anyone else feel like meeting four lesbians on one night out is too many? I wasn't super bothered about pulling either of these two, I was just enjoying chatting to them, but still it gets a bit annoying.

We went out various places me and this group of lads (and one hot girl), and I didn't pull. I'm still not so comfortable in club/dancefloor environments but I think I'm starting to see that women are just humans that you can interact with. If on a night out you see a guy you don't know you can go up to him and slap him on the back or put your arm round him or playfight or do anything the mood dictates really. Everyone's out to have a good time. Similarly if you want to go and dance with a girl or even dirty dance with her, you can do it, as long as you're about having a good time. I'm just aware that I'm not super comfortable with being physical at the moment. Partly sexual inexperience and partly emotional issues, but just going up and getting physical with a girl is something I need to get comfortable with doing. It shouldn't be a big deal. I just need to know the moves really, to have the skillset of creating a physical interaction with a woman in a club (although part of it comes down to practice I'm sure).

So it was a cool night, and a tipping point for me I think, in the sense that (a) I was in good spirits about doing it and not nervous and (b) there was no real awkwardness created in the sets I approached, or if there was it was of the funny kind. The frustration is though that every one of the women I approached either had a boyfriend or was a lesbian? Where do you go to meet quality single ladies? Is it worth paying for one of these singles nights? I'm sure I could do well at this point if I went to one of those. Not sure what kind of women you'd meet there though and if they'd be decent. I'm wondering if as a guy's game improves, the "I have a boyfriend" or "I'm a lesbian" shit tends to come up less, that these are the responses the average guy gets but the guy with real game tends to break through barriers that other guys don't. However, that's an ethical quandary, so meeting women who are hot and legitimately single might be better.

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing

I used to game girls in gay bars. (Met my ex gf there too) Los of straight girls. You can tell who are lesbians by the way they dress and how they move.

There was this one girl i met told me she had a girlfriend but she needs some penetration. So I was a nice guy and helped her out with that. If the friends disappear from a girl you like. Always go for isolation/bounce to a new bar/home- it's a mahoosive IOI.

Sounds like a productive night. I get the feeing you didn't know you were meeting girls in gay districts perhaps? No idea where you live, can't help you there.

For me, I escalate from the open so that pretty much filters the girls straight away and I always manage to find a bite from a single and straight lady.

Single nights, hmmm, I don't like them. But maybe you may get lucky. I kinda have this sixth sense from being this a long time and I can tell if she has a boyfriend or not. If I'm not sure I will simply ask her directly as I open.

_________________
USER HAS BEEN BANNED FOR REPEATEDLY IGNORING MOD WARNINGS AND MULTIPLE RULE VIOLATIONS

Good job for the approaches Don. That's the way to do it until you become desensitized to hot women. Unfortunately, it's quite rare for me to get the "I have a boyfriend" line but instead I usually get the "I'm single" line even when these girls actually have a boyfriend (or husband).

Now, you might be shocked at this recommendation: Accentuate your cock. You can start with something conservative like this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebel_Without_a_Cause

Look at the James Dean poster where he points his right hand fingers at his crotch.

Try it out infield and let us know if the incidence of the "I have a boyfriend" line actually becomes lesser.

_________________
Approach. Open. Escalate. Isolate

Here are my two essential rules on texting that will save you tons of time and money:

general-questions/topic137931.html

Nope, just your standard high street Wetherspoons pub, two of these girls talked about going on to a gay bar which I know and have been at, and yeah it's cool. Had a guy and a girl coming up hitting on me in tandem depending on what my sexuality was

As you were saying, escalation is key, I'll need to get into that. I think as I keep approaching my instincts will become sharper and I'll start to take more risks.
I don't see much unfortunate about that. And yeah that does confirm my instinct that if a girl hits you with this line, especially early on, she's probably just not that into you.

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing

You'll know why it's unfortunate when you get to that point.

By the way, lesbian or not, try to always be escalating. I have banged lesbians and they are as cock hungry as the non-lesbians once you get them horny.

_________________
Approach. Open. Escalate. Isolate

Here are my two essential rules on texting that will save you tons of time and money:

general-questions/topic137931.html

Nice

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing

Just to get things grounded, listen well to Dragula. He specializes in night game in the UK. Meanwhile, I specialize in day game in Asia.

_________________
Approach. Open. Escalate. Isolate

Here are my two essential rules on texting that will save you tons of time and money:

general-questions/topic137931.html

Yeah, I like Dragula's posts.

Another situation you guys might like to give me a perspective on. I went out last night with a mate and after my recent efforts I felt totally relaxed, like I had nothing to prove and it didn't matter if I talked to any women or not. It was a great feeling that I've not had before. So I get to the bar and say hi to a girl standing next to me, she says she's alone and I'm thinking bingo. I ask her if she wants to come and join me and my mate for a drink and she says "I don't mind". I responded "that wasn't very persuasive" but I think honestly I should have just said "okay, have a good evening". Her appraisal of me by that remark wasn't good enough in my opinion and I should have just let it go.

Anyway, we hung out with her and some other people for the rest of the evening. For about the first two hours I was being very cool, I was just looking at her and not feeling anything, just observing her in a detached way and chipping in with comments as and when but letting others take the burden of keeping the interaction going. But then a point came when I realised that she wasn't hooking due to this cool behaviour and I started becoming willing to amend it. There was one point when I overshared something that didn't necessarily sound that good on me and from that point onwards I felt like I'd let myself get hooked emotionally. I was fighting it when we were at the club, and trying to maintain my personal space and not be affected by her (I should say she had a boyfriend, hence why I didn't want to get drawn in if it wasn't going anywhere), but she was getting in my personal space at times and touching me in ways that I didn't feel were entirely respectful which made it harder.

I told everyone I was going to go and grab some food at some point and I was a little surprised when the girl wanted to come with me and suddenly needed to catch a bus as she had shit to do the next morning. However, she also sounded like she might be open to getting food with me. I've got to admit this girl was getting to me. She was walking at a faster pace and I kept telling her to slow down perhaps because I wanted a different mood that maybe she didn't. At one point she mentioned something about her boyfriend and I grabbed her arm and tried to turn her towards me and I said "fuck your boyfriend". She simply said "ow" but then otherwise acted like nothing had happened. This just drove me crazier. We walked a bit further and I just started being honest. At one point she put her glasses on and I was asking why, she said she needed them to see, but she hadn't needed them so far that evening. It just seemed like she was messing with me (she looked sexy in them). I said to her "you're driving me crazy". She again reacted like it was just a casual remark and my next remark was more explicit. I said "do you know how much you're turning me on?" At this point she started saying that she had a boyfriend and I should respect that, which is fair enough. I didn't capitulate though but kept the tension in the interaction. She said "I just thought I'd met some cool people" which kind of made me feel bad, cos I had been cool and I definitely wasn't being cool now. I just said "so you're saying I'm not a cool person then?". That might sound like a butthurt thing to say but that wasn't how I said it, I was maintaining the tension and keeping it somewhat confrontational. Around this time she just said "okay, I'm going to go" and I let her walk off.

Now nothing about this belongs in any textbook. I can't say I did anything right here. I let myself get affected. And I did feel bad that I went from being a cool guy to a guy she perceived as disrespectful. But at the same time I owned my desires and I feel good about that much. It's a shame I can't be friends with this girl after that but I don't know how well I'd have done at that anyway. Anyway, does anyone have any thoughts?

(Btw sorry my posts are so long, I'm not great at expressing myself concisely )

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing

Stop thinking too much. It's like you go into every micro detail of the dynamic. Do your thing and the girls that dig you will stick around. You are doing the whole 'Convincing girls to sleep with you' .

_________________
USER HAS BEEN BANNED FOR REPEATEDLY IGNORING MOD WARNINGS AND MULTIPLE RULE VIOLATIONS

That's about the most challenging thing you could say to me Dragman but you're right, thank you

(EDIT: You got thanked, happy now? )

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing

Girls change their mood from moment to moment. This is what you learn from laying your balls on the line infield. One moment she says, "I have a boyfriend" then after a little while, she's rubbing her breast against your elbow. When out on field you shouldn't be thinking how to react. You just need to condition your mind and body that ONCE you feel a breast on your elbow or arm, you covertly rub on her nipples for quite some time.

And then when you feel her skin getting warm and you hear her clear her throat, you just have to say (whatever or wherever the conversational thread is going):

"Let's go."

Play this scenario in your head several thousand times until your reactions infield becomes reflexive:

1. Breast rub from a girl.

2. You covertly rub on her nipples.

3. Her skin gets warm and she clears her throat.

4. Say, "Let's go."

_________________
Approach. Open. Escalate. Isolate

Here are my two essential rules on texting that will save you tons of time and money:

general-questions/topic137931.html

Great work! Sounds like you're relatively new to the game so here's my advice:
Yes, good game will reduce these sorts of disclaimers, BUT a large proportion of good looking women (and women in general) will have a significant other, so keep that in mind.

Your posts are fine. I actually like the detail.

Above - you got desperate. You sniffed an opportunity and pursued it. For the future, never, ever, act like that again. If she's continually bringing up the boyfriend and saying that you should respect that, then you should actually respect that and leave her alone.

I won't.

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing

Thanks for the detailed feedback Chocolate (I didn't see the previous post before responding to your shorter one)
With you.
She was the only one who paid me much attention. She was looking at me quite intently and seemed to want to interact with me but this comment I made about tattoos seemed to become a sticking point.
I was playing by shit test rules, and I'm assuming you don't think this was a shit test.
Fair. And yes, what you said about wanting to verbalise my intent is probably a bit too true.
I wasn't interested in her either as it happens, her friend was the fit one. But yes I was being a dick.
Can you explain that last sentence? Yes, I'm sure you're right. And again there was a need to verbalise intent. Some of the explanation for that might be found in this thread general-questions/need-liked-everybody-vt192730.html Perhaps some bad habits I need to shake off.
I'm a little dubious of that. They told me they'd been in a relationship for four years. But who knows?
Cool. As a huge introvert that's the most challenging environment, but yes.
Indeed. I approached 10 sets the last week which is the most I've ever approached, which is a landmark in itself. And I still feel good as shit about it. But yeah, I appreciate the stuff you've said. To be honest, Dragula's last post has made me realise that I need to revolutionise my approach, a lot of this stuff just comes to me walking around with the wrong kind of head on my shoulders.

_________________
If something's not fun, it's not worth doing