Guys, I have a friend of mine who claims "There's not such thing like pickup. "it's numbers game', "Take shower and groome yourself", "Tell jokes". It is all common sense bullshit"

And I can't really come up with a sound argument against this- I just blabbered something about how pickup consists of outer and inner game and his examples only cover some of outer game aspects. How would you give an insight on pickup and explain that it is truly a transformational path instead of a bunch of techniques and theories?

Thanks!

Call it self development.

You can become a better man.

And it is absolutely possible to have a better sex life with some of these mindsets out there.

Now self development can mean any area of your life

and "pick up" is a sub-category of self development.

You can improve your game with certain mindsets , and there are definately do's and dont's in seduction.

So its existance is a fact.

Part of being a better man also involves realizing when you dont need to explain something to someone, in this case your friend. Go on, improve yourself, he can sit and watch, one day he'll ask, how did you get that girl? and you tell em "Numbers game"

lol.

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Effective pickup(as it's commonly defined as generating attraction) basically doesn't exist. And the "inner game" stuff is mostly nonsense. Unless you're suffering from unusual mental issues, your "inner game" has very little to do with getting laid.

The community commonly teaches things that are the exact opposite of reality and set you back. Looks don't matter. You can "create attraction". Self amuse. Be outcome independent. Learn "frame control". Be an "alpha male".

Most of the areas that will actually help you(looks maxing, logistics, screening) are de-emphasized. There are people who teach them, but they are the extreme minority. The most prominent PUAs are scam artists who preach bullshit that doesn't matter.

It isn't strictly a numbers game. You need good screening(including logistics) and sexual escalation skills. But if you're set on those and have normal social skills, it pretty much is a numbers game. Trying to attract women doesn't work.

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thank you for responses! The link was excellent

I personally like to think the pick up arts are just a tool for those who need them. Sure all you really need to do is look your best, be confident and charming and you bag a girl, and that comes naturally to a lot of people. But to others it doesn't come naturally, therefore pick up theories are there really to allow access for these people into a different lifestyle. Yes a lot of it is bullshit and people are out there making a profit, but the concept as a whole can be very beneficial to some individuals. When I interact with women, about 10% or less is an actual game plan or a routine, just a couple of tools in my bag to help things along. And simply knowing i have the knowledge at my disposal gives me the confidence to carry a good, natural interaction.

In many ways pickup theory and teachings are almost a placebo.

pick up is conveying and maximizing your attractive behaviors, getting better odds of your actions working based on hundreds-millions of live field testings etc... In other words is based on experience what behavior is likely to give better result than other, simple example:

If i go to a girl an open:

psshhhh pshhhh i likely but get 0 out of 100

hey mami come here i will eat your pussy 0 out of 100

hi maybe 10 out of 100..

Some dude base on field testing writes a post or book etc... Saying hey try not to open saying "psssh pssh" is unlikely to work, better probability of success based on 10 girls i open successfully saying "hi"

then the dudes read that and goes OUT ON THE FIELD, and try "hi" with 500 girls and see for himself if it works or not...

That is what pick up and the community revolves around...

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Is there anything called game? It's like asking wether you can learn how to be around women. Yes, of course there is! But it is an extremely wide spectrum of things, and a single word like "game" isn't really enough. Many of these things are common sense. And even if they are, very few people are able to improve in all those areas. Some are simply losers and will never break their negative thought patterns. Others have some diagnosis. Still others are simply too ugly. And so on and so forth.

Let's take it further... All those people who don't learn, or can't learn, "game" (whatever it is), will very often do just fine anyway. They will succeed in attracting some girl, and stick with her for the rest of their lives. They won't care about pickup, and won't bother about it.

So, what IS game? Except from all attractive features that come from something external, like good looks, nice clothes etc, and only focusing on behaviors, attitude and mentality, I'd say that game is:

1. Self acceptance. You need to love and accept yourself for who you are. In CBT acceptance is a rather new tool they work with, so this isn't just some figment. Accept your feelings, whatever they are. Accept if you are out of state, accept if you feel AA, accept if you feel bored... You get the point. This makes you RELAX and relieves you from all your pressure and stress that you "have to" feel in a certain way. It helps you to not give a fuck. It's all okay.

2. Awareness, on all levels. Including knowledge. Know yourself, be aware of yourself, what you feel and what you think. Be aware of others. Be aware of how you affect them. Be aware of how they affect you. Be aware of your role in a group. Know why someone reacts the way she does. Understand her psychology. Know what's in your power to do to change things to the better. Also know when things are out of your control.

3. Self control. With all the above in your backpack, take control of your thoughts and your emotions. Do things, or avoid doing things, to become more positive, more energetic and happier. Take control of your life, basically.

Now, use all the above to make the best possible impression on people, and you have game, or awesome social skills. Can anyone do it? Definitely not! But that's what it is, to me at least. And what you will realize if you think about it is that there is no such thing as pickup involved. Maybe we could add a fourth point to include seduction:

4. Show sexual intent.

That link at the end is really interesting. I especially found it at the end of it that you can make it.