Recently someone ON site claimed that you shouldn't read or understand PUA and that you should just approach. So I made this to explain the different levels of "pick up" and to show the importance of knowledge and awareness.

White belt:
He never take the initiative to start a conversation with a girl. He doesn't realize girls that flirt with him. He is afraid to be embarrassed, rejected or to make a fool out of himself. The thought of actively initiating a conversation with a girl is inconceivable. This type of guy is the typical guy that stays single and or as a virgin for his entire life without wanting it.

Yellow belt:
Sometimes dares to initiate a conversation with a girl but usually does it too late or too poorly / wrong. Typical a guy who meets a girl but doesn't dare to flirt or knows how to do it. He behaves pleasant and well but he doesn't create any tension or excitement. Example: A few months later he asks the girl out on a date, most of the time the girl will be surprised and answer that she looks at him as a friend. This guy will at some point get a girlfriend, but in periods or parts of his life he can feel very lonely and frustrated. A lot of men is on this level. They usually have a lot strong and declared opinions and thoughts about women and pickup that prevents them from improving. (Example: Men who gets a lot of women are idiots, and the women are sluts and whores. There is nothing called "pick up" everything is just luck and it can't be taught).

Orange belt:
The same as yellow belt. He is not smooth. He can be a bit shy, uncertain and insecure, but he doesn't care about that. He goes to women and talk to them and asks them out for a date, eventually it will work. And do you know what? He's absolutely right. This guy is about the same level as the "yellow belt" guy in terms of "pick up skills", but he gets better results and meets way more women mainly because he initiate conversations more often. Mentally, orange belt is more open and curious on "pick up" than yellow belt.

Green belt:
This guy got some knowledge about pick up. Just like orange belt he usually initiate conversation with girls a lot. He dresses up well and makes him appear as attractive as his genes let him. He understands that you need to behave and act differently around women you wanna flirt with and women you wanna behave nicely to. He also has an idea of how the flirty behaviors should be done. He understands that he has to initiate physical contact and show the correct amount of interest. Even though he knows this, he may happen that he misunderstand and he struggles with seing the "whole" picture. He can do mistakes such as not showing enough interest when it would've been enough to just not be needy. He still don't have enough experience to believe in his own judgement. He tries to follow what he has read and what people has told him. It can still occur periods when he has noone in his life (women). Green belt is a bit special, it rarely occurs "natural" and is most of the time the result of a guy from a lower level making it to this level by improving his "pick up".

Blue belt:
This is a player. He knows that a lot of women likes him. In opposition of green belt this guy get a real feeling of abundance. When he is with women he thinks: "hm, she is cool.... we may be together in 6 months, but we may not be together in 6 months as well, so I'll met someone who's even cooler". He always has a lot of women that's interested in him at the same time. At this level they tend to have had a lot of sexual partners and really get a lot of women and knows how things works. This can be natural, but people who's learning can still get to this level under the circumstance that they get RESULTS. To get here you need to experience that women are interested. You also need to experience to be with women to that degree that you start to feel like a very attractive person and you start to trust yourself.

Black belt:
This is the real deal. This guy is the boss! The people with this belt has done what people have just seen in porn videos. They can go to any night club or bar and get a girl. They can arrive at a foreign city or country and get a girl to get the stuff going the small period of time they are going to be there. They can get laid day game on occasions. At this level people tend to get too much of the "good stuff". A lot of the people who operate at this level will get traits to their personality that helps them picking up women but can cause problems in long term relationships.

What belt do you have?

Importance of knowledge:
Approaching a lot can get you a good way as confidence is very important, but you can't get further than green belt if you have no PUA theory and you don't know what you are doing. Blue belt can be naturals, but it doesn't mean that you can get to that level by being natural. These guys were "born" naturals. They are the ones that gets LOTS of women in high school and college without having much or any research on PUA. You can't get to this level unless you were born this way, or unless you do thousands of thousands of thousands of approaches and start to see patterns. (This is a slow way to improve).

The best way to increase your level or "skill" is to combine reading and knowledge with pick up. Have you ever heard the saying: "Practice doesn't make perfect; perfect practice makes perfect"? This basically states that you have to be practicing correctly in order to improve the fastest. If you wanna get good fast, you can't just approach. It's like typing. You have the touch typing techniques where you use all fingers and you have the people who uses other typing techniques (not 10 fingers). They will never progress and increase their typing speed as fast as a guy who's doing it correctly. (I have a real life example of this if you really wanna know)

This is equal to PUA, because if you don't have the knowledge you can't analyze and see what how or where you did wrong so you won't learn from it. Awarness is key. You will keep approaching without getting a lesson from the failed attempt. You don't know how it's supposed to be done, you talk to women wrong, you don't treat women correctly. If you just approach and hold a conversation and she leads the conversation it is going to be a fail and without you being aware of it and knowing how to lead the conversation the way you want it and without specifically trying to improve this with your game it's going to take years to get better. You're going to be stuck on the orange level. The one that just approaches.

Advice to new member: Dedicate a day or two to reading before you approach, but if you have to pick one of them, go out approach as the increased confidence will benefit you the most in the start. Confidence gets you from white to orange belt. Knowledge + confidence gets you better.

In reality, pickup doesn't work like that. I have some nights where I'm killing it like a pimp and other nights where I'm in a bad mood and I go home without any girls or phone numbers. I know guys much better than me who go home alone without numbers too. I've fucked 80 women in the past 10 years and I still get AA once in a while. I simply feel the fear and do it anyway.

The other side of the coin is, a white belt could fluke it on a good day and fuck a 10.

^^^^^This is all bull shit mental masturbation... there was no point to all of that dude. You're complicating this shit by adding all these layers to pick up. It's not this complicated... You boldy approach women, dress well, charm them, you don't rate your abilities with women by belts.... this is just stupid dude.

And your last paragraph, well that a whole nother bunch of bull shit. DON'T FOCUS ON READING BEFORE YOU APPROACH. The problem with reading before you approach all the time is you have too much going on in your head trying to force bull shit. You need to create habits, you don't create habits by constantly thinking about what you are going to do every time you pick up women.

Amazing1, I've had several conversations with you about women in chat, and I'm not trying to put you on spot but you're a virgin dude. Stop giving advice or adding your own spin to women, you don't have the right... you're lack of skills with women means you shouldn't be focusing on any of this bull shit. You need to be focusing on self-development and straight fundamentals... just keep approaching women... and yes that means keep getting shot down... get used to just keeping on trying not adding all this complicated shit to this man.

Again as I told you before, focus on learning to love yourself. It's very important, don't however focus on creating levels of pick up, it's just a waste of time because it doesn't matter whether you are bla bla or bla bla... all that matters is your own development.


Peace and Love,

Vic

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Da! You seems to get it man! Spot on!

There is a reason of why approach machines will never improve from the orange belt, they can, but its' going to take them so long they've thrown away half their life. It turns into a number's game for them and they relay on luck.

They make the mistake by working on their confidence and becoming more confident. They will get a bigger ego. They do this before they actually get good. What that means is that they don't take feedback seriously, they don't take it in the way they should and they think that what they are doing is right and if things are not working with the girls then it's the girls faulth or they think that it's just a number's game. Instead of doing this you should leave your ego aside, think about what you could do better, think about what went wrong and how you could've improved (this is where the research and knowledge helps you improve faster than the approach machine). If you have the expecatation in the beginning that it's your faulth and not theirs it's actually something that will help you improve and make the changes that are neccessary.

How else would you explain a guy who's approaching and approaching and approaching without improving? He gets the confidence but he's missing the knowledge and he's improving slower (he gets stuck in the orange belt level and relay on luck). (I'll take that typing example. Well, I'm in a typing "community", where people practice their typing speed... There's a guy in the community who has typed 50,000 texts and he still only types 100 words per minute on average, while I type 130 words per minute and has typed less than 5,000 texts. We started out at the same speed. The difference is that this guy is typing with 2-5 fingers which is why he's not improving and getting stuck on 100 wpm (words per minute). He is unable to improve above this point because of it. This would be equal to the guy who's just approaching. I'm using the touch typing techniques. (The right way to type), which is why I improved 10 times as fast as him and why I'm as fast as I am today. Heck, I'm confident enough to say that there is not 1 typist in the world that types faster than me without using the same technique. You just can't get to this level without it.

How do you explain why less attractive men can get more girls than men who's better looking even though their confidence is the same? Theory and knowledge, that is the difference. The worse looking guy is using psychological techniques that works, and he knows what he's doing. (Note:There has of course been studies on the techniques and the effectiveness of them that didn't measure up, but some of it does, and the things that doesn't still puts you ahead of the other guy.

Of course, you have the theory that you can't cause attraction, but let's be honest with our selves... Your looks need a minimum for doing this. But what you do is that you create the personality that the girl would be attracted to, which makes you appear more attractive than the guy who's better looking. You need to be able to treat women, talk to women, eye contact(theory....).(It's all genes and biology, you can do this and women will find you way more attractive because they want a dominant man and a man who knows what he's doing. The guy talking about how bad he's gonna fail on his math test on monday is not going to get laid, let's be real guys... (The knowledge you take in use will become second nature, you will naturally be more attractive to girls instead of a guy who's just building his confidence and ego).

When this has been said. Poet got a point. Approaching a lot will get you a good way and it might not be that bad advice to give to a beginner especially if he's starting on white belt level. Confidence will go fast to improving meaning that he would benefit a lot from it and surely make it to orange belt pretty quickly.

NO DISAGREEMENT ON THIS.... but we have a virgin who has no experience with women trying to explain and classify... it's a waste of time and shit load of mental masturbation.

You reading rather than interacting isn't helpful... going out and approaching women will make you more skilled socially then sitting at home reading alone.... wouldn't you agree?

You have to learn to approach... when you learn to approach you learn to socialize... you get better at it.... you start naturally learning how people take to you... but focusing on learning all the pick up aspects is simply a waste of time if you can't even walk up to a person and chat.... you know what my advice was to him in a chat room because he was bitching so much? I said go talk to a cashier at a grocery store get used to just saying hi and just talking to other people.

IF YOU DO NOT LEARN TO APPROACH THEN THERE IS NO POINT TO THE REST OF THIS. Start at point A and move from there... Don't start reading calculus when you're learning basic arithmetic... you'll simply overwhelm yourself put yourself in an awful situation. Reading every time you go talk to women is only going to hurt you.... it's information overload and you won't be able to be a part of the moment when you talk to women... this will turn the woman off and thus blow your chances with her.

Peace and Love,

Vic

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Got to agree with Vic. Noobs with social anxiety just need to hit the clubs and goof around, learn from their mistakes, learn how to self-amuse and party for their own pleasure, not study pickup / girls like a scientific subject. Reading every PUA book out there won't help you if you cannot even have a conversation with a stranger.

UMMM YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE FUCK YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

EGO IS NOT SELF-CONFIDENCE.... Ego can feel like confidence but it's simply not self-confidence...

This is the problem here dude... you're sitting here lecturing people on shit you don't have a clue about.... Remember how I said in the chat room shut the fuck up and listen... that is now extending to the forum.

What is one of the most attractive features to women? SELF-CONFIDENCE... what did I recommend? Self-development... This is very important... you need to improve your self-esteem and your self-confidence.... because women are more attracted to attractive behavior then to physical appearance... though it can be argued that physical appearance can be strongly influenced simply by attractive behavior (such as how you hold yourself). Why else is that fat guy or ugly guy getting that sexy girl?

A big part of gaining confidence with women is experience... reading doesn't give you shit for experience with women.

Self-confidence isn't just important for women though... it's important because it makes you happier, healthier, more whole, and more you... this isn't just about women dude. In fact whether you realize this or not, those guys out there fucking women by the hundreds are often times incredibly unhappy and lonely.

Women will always be a numbers game... there isn't nor will there ever be a guy who can fuck every woman he tries for (unless he never tries for a woman). You can't make every woman like you... You know how good a master seducer is? He fucks about 2-3 out of 10 women... That's it... You have to remember that getting a number is only a step... getting a hang out is only a step.... there are no guarantees after you kiss a girl you'll be inserting penis in vagina.

YOUR RIDICULOUS THEY MAKE A MISTAKE BY WORKING ON THERE SELF-CONFIDENCE ONLY SHOWS YOU TO BE SUPER CONFUSED.... listen to people who've went through this shit... listen to people who did this shit the hard way man.

It's good to look to improve and write a journal... I highly recommend it for improving at ANYTHING.... whether that is poker, pool, women, etc. However regardless of all that... you still can't control everything when it comes to women... you simply can't fuck em all... sometimes you don't get a girl and it literally has nothing to do with you... she could find you charming, sexy, etc.... but she is faithful to her boyfriend. This is what I mean by you have no right to say shit dude.... you don't have the experience to advise anyone on the development of skills with women. You don't know nearly enough to state a word.

Peace and Love,

Vic

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Pick up does not work like this, this is none sense...

More important is your level of personal satisfaction...

Pick up is a skill set and a numbers game, as long as you can lay 1 in 10 girls or better you are doing great.

Also a lot guys can get laid a lot, can not hold a relationship together...

_________________
Learn the proper way to maximize your results in a dancefloor/club environment, check out my blog and youtube channel:
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As rude as I may sound, I vote for the permaban of Amazing1. He is a virgin with no experience with girls, SPAM advices on the chat and forum left and right. I've seen him tell new guys to not go out and read instead.

I'm not even going to comment on the content of this thread. I've tried to help him, he is too stuborn... Until he drop down his ego, realize he sucks and need help, and stop trying to help other people on something he can't do.... I say he can't be here, he is destroying the quality of this forum (even more).

1 vote to get rid of the rotten apple.

_________________
Dear Optimist, Pessimist & Realist,

Just to let you know that while you guys were arguing about the glass of water...... I drank it!

Sincerely, the Opportunist

Serious question. Are you a troll? Are you actually advocating NOT working on your confidence?

Message to any new guys looking for advice, there's "nothing to see here!"

.

No Hunter_Foxe, I'm not a troll. I agree with the quote and I don't tell people to not approach that's nonsense... As a matter of fact, I told them to approach as you will improve the quickest from doing that because increasing confidence is one of the quickest things there is because it's so simple. You can go from being the awkward virgin with a white belt to orange belt and get laid in just a few months probably.

It's just that I see that a lot of people here just approach and approach without knowing or seeing what they do wrong. You need to try to learn from your mistakes and see what you do wrong. A guy who don't learn from his mistakes won't improve until he has approached enough women to figure it out himself(takes forever), a guy who got sources will improve way faster because he will know what he did wrong, how to change it and how to improve it.

MrMatt, why do you want me banned off the forum? I haven't done anything against the rules. My advice is not misleading.(You can't reach the highest level of skill by just approaching which is the moral of the story, you improve faster if you see your mistakes and learn from them). You can't say that there's anything wrong with this argument. I'm applying logical structures based on learning speed and psychology which does not make it a fallacy argument and/ or a "weak" argument. Even though I'm not that skilled I might know a few things that you don't know from watching how it's actually done and from reading.

skills360 what do you mean with that pick up doesn't work like that? Just look at all the questions we get on the forum, look at all the things people are wondering on. This happened, what should I have done etc. You've read a tons of them. How do you answer them? Knowledge. Already right there you have the importance of knowledge. What I reacted on was that a guy on the forum told another guy to JUST approach and totally ignore theory and knowledge. He told him to not understand it and to ignore it. He was told that he should just fuck that shit and go out like an approach machine. When I saw this I reacted with what I've seen and with psychological researches on learning speed. Just as Da said. Combining them will make you improve the fastest. What this guy who gave this advice was forgetting was that the guy he gave the advice to had zero knowledge about PUA. It's easy to forget your own knowledge, him himself is using a lot of techniques naturally, so he forgets that they are actually techniques. What will happened when this guy go out with no basics? It's gonna be a fail. I may have mentioned something along the lines that you should dedicate 1 day before you approach to look through the basics so you know how women works but if your confidence is on the bottom you just approach and do that later.

poeticlyskuac, I agree with everything you said. "women are more attracted to attractive behaviors then to physical appearance". This is right, as I mentioned earlier. Who gets the girl, the confident one that talks about how bad he's going to fail on his math test on monday or the confident one that knows how to talk to women, knows how to lead a conversation, knows who to treat them... The type of guy women are naturally psychologically and biologically attracted to? I think the answer is clear. Heck.. even flirting is PUA and theory, you won't even know how to flirt correct and when to do it without reading which will make you progress slower than a guy who's practicing both at the same time. (confidence + flirting, other theory etc). I know that reading doesn't give you experience only approaching does and that it is why it's very important to approach as you would find your own style and strategies based on your knowledge. But as I said earlier, the point of this is not that confidence is bad, it's beast, but just approaching without theory or knowlege is going to suck for you in the long run. And if you wanna go above an x given level, where x is high it's going to take effort on reading and understanding your approaches.

You don't understand the quote because you contradicted it in your earlier post. You criticised guys who rely on luck. Jefferson was saying luck, in that sense, doesn't really exist and it is you who creates your own opportunities in life.

As for your critique of the "approach machine", only an idiot would do the same thing again and again and expect different results. You class him as an "orange belt"? I class an idiot who is incapable of learning as a white belt with an IQ of 70.

The bulk of your learning should be out in the field, not with your head stuck in a PUA book. That's the only point I'm trying to make. Real confidence (not ego) comes from real interaction with humans, not from reading words on a page.

The human ego is fragile, that's why it's so dangerous. Ego relies on approval from others / validation from others. If you were the only person on the planet, where would you get your validation? Nowhere. You would get very depressed because you'd have nobody there to say "you're awesome" or "well done" or "I love you!"

This is why self-amused confidence is the only way you will ever become a pimp with women.

Answer me this: Did you or did you not just say that focusing on confidence is a mistake?

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Hunter_Foxe. The approach machines doesn't change things up because he believe what people are telling him. "Do not read, just approach, eventually you will get a lot of confidence and be better". He keeps that mindset even after 10k approaches". It doesn't mean that he's stupid, it's just that he don't read, even if he were to change things up it would take years because of all the different ways you can change things up, you would become a self-claimed PUA by making your own strategies and techniques because at one point you would've tried everything.

The bulk of your learning should definitely be out in the field, the field is 99% of the learning. The reading and the research doesn't take you long at all, can be done in under a week but you need to remember things if you don't immediately apply it or possibily reread it over at a later time. The point is that this 1% of the learning is critical to take with you into the part of the learning that consists of the remining 99%... (if you wanna progress fast ofc). You can go far by just building confidence first, but eventually, this 1% has to be there if you wanna improve.

My theory is just that if you just approach like a machine like people tell here. Even if your confidence is well above average and you have no clue on PUA you're not going to get far. The main reason for this is because you're not practicing for learning fast. You don't look at your mistakes and tries to fix them. I heard a woman who was a 10 say that the most impressive thing a guy can do is to have very good eye contact but sadly she had just met 1 who could do it propperly. What happens if you just approach and approach and approach and don't focus on those small things because you don't know of them? Sure you're going to be confident, but can you hold real eye contact? Can you seduce women with your eyes, do you use your eyes correctly in different situations? Heck.. even flirting. Most people don't even know how to flirt, when to do it and the most successful flirting techniques for different situations. If you tell an above average confident man to fuck PUA theory, he don't have to understand it and he should just approach? That's nonsense to me. These guys who has the knowledge apply these things into their daily approaches so it becomes like nature instead of the guy who just approach and approach. They will fix these details in their game that the guy who just approach won't which is why the guy who just approach will learn and progress slower.

To your question: Focusing on confidence is not a mistake but going "all-in" on confidence only is a mistake if you actually wanna get very good.

It's like poet said. If you have knowledge and theory you will naturally be more attractive to women and therefore get laid and succeed more.

Let me ask you this: Why do you think less attractive men can get more women than very attractive men even though their confidence is the same? It's because someones behaviors can mean a lot on how attractive someone is. A guy who has 0 theory and talks about how bad he's gonna fail on his math test would have a 1 / 10 on that one. A guy or a PRO PUA would have a 10/10 on behavors. Lets say His looks is 7/10, confidence 10/10 and behaviors 10/10 vs a very attracitve one who's 10/10 looks, 10/10 confidence but 3/10 behaviors. The first one will have a total of 27/30 attractiveness points vs the other one who got 23/30. Meaning that the less attractive man interms of looks turned out to be more attractive to women.

The reason I said earlier with that approaching is 99% of the job is because you have to use the theory and knowledge with approaching meaning that the actual research and theory won't really be any "work" compared to all the approaching.

skills360, if that's kj then I'm not doing that.