Well when I first started out, my username was 'Syx' cause I wanted to go home with Six women in one night if that answers your question!

Nah but seriously, i'm the kind of guy that wants to do it all. PUA is so damn attractive to me. Not only do I get to live an interesting life, I get to learn how to get my Dick pounded by the hottest women on the planet. I'll work for that :]

Magnum- That's Sick buddy. I do not find any of the women in my family attractive. I would pick apart what you said but there's so little value in it I won't waste my time lol.

EDIT: Oh I see what you mean when I said 'all'. Come on. Really?

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Two words: Carpe Diem

Oh man let me stop you right there. I was reading an article on Sosuave.net title "The plight of African Americans in game" and thought it was funny. I agree with it, only because I do find white women a bit harder to game down here in the south as a black man, but it doesn't mean I'm not trying. I see what you thought, but you misunderstood.
Nope! Their just another on the path to the perfect game. The problem is when one says they've reached the peak, but their not there yet (Even though with hard work, Tiger woods and Michael Jordan have become the best out there, probably?). I've never heard them say they were the best anyways, so using them as examples is really pointless.I'm sure if they could, they would continue to try be absolutely perfect.
As we have already seen You thought I was Semi-trolling(With this post, if I was trolling, wouldn't I go all out? ), but you misunderstand my intentions. I'm just a student Warped. I game almost every weekend and chance I can get, alone most of the time because I have no wings around me with my level of dedication that flake. Just a student, getting an annoyance off his chest as he learns.

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Two words: Carpe Diem

This needs clarification. I have no problem with giving advice, how could I, I wouldn't learn anything if I didn't have experienced people telling me how I could improve.

The problem is when you say you've done it all, you've reached the peak, the highest point you could possibly get in game, or at least lead others to believe that.

And as Games pointed out, im not talking about natural game, I'm talking about Unnatural game, game based on Skill, not chance.

You have to realize by saying you're at the stopping point, realize that people are going to take your words as tried and true, when in all reality, they could be BETTER. We should ALL continue to strive to be the best if we love doing one thing, to BE that perfectionist. Why the hell shouldn't we? Never stop, and don't convince others to stop. That's what I'm trying to say to the Teachers and Advice givers out there.

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Two words: Carpe Diem

Really? I taught black dudes have it easier, they are so cool and have big dicks, lol just kidding.

Sage, you're a cool guy, I could agree with a bit of what you're saying.
Although, you have a fatass ego.

Yes, most guys at one time are another got tired of being denied, they found pua and it became a way to have control over factors you had no idea were possible. You have the opportunity and skill aptitude to go out and bang several women. Who wouldn't want that?

Still, you're missing the fact that two people are still individuals apart. We could both talk to a HB9 for 5 mins, You could look at her tits while I'm looking at her eyes, I could be checking out her ass and while you're seeing her smile. I'd next her cause she has an awful personality, you could lay her cause she puts out.
See what I'm saying?
Right, but wrong. I agree, hone yourself, push yourself excel at your skills but not everyone runs the same style, some guys go for banging girls others next 5 because 1 seems most worthwhile.
Be YOUR "Natural" Mindset because whether you like it or not people do things their own way and you have to accept and follow your own skillset and beliefs instead of focusing on other's.
On another note, GamesSN that really stood out to me. First starting into PUA I did alot of Mental Masturbation, eventually I started browsing alot of topics from pages and ages back. I read alot of stuff that kicked me out of the AFC mentality: 'Man up, do it for the experience, take what you learned from it and fix it next time' small things that worked on a much higher level.
It stopped me from trying to be a natural to becoming the natural.
Yeah, anyway, I agree; What there needs to be is like the old days that slap that knocks you into working for better results instead of just expecting them.

The problem with the mindset is astounding....

The problem with the old advice is that it was putting a band-aid over a tire leak, not really going to do shit. I can tell you to freeze out this chick. Or to text her exactly this, or exactly that but and this is very important: me telling you what to do won't help you past this moment. What happens next time? You come to me and I tell you what to do again? This is a waste of time.... teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime, give em a meal and he eats but a meal.

The most important thing to do when you get into the community is to get rid of your needy behaviors, improve yourself, improve your self-confidence, your self-esteem, and clarify what you want out of your life. Those are far more important things to happen for you as a person and for your life in general than how to get this chick.

Men come to the community and must be broken of their previous negative behavior which include believing they can listen to some bull shit marketing guru and get any woman they want.

Strive to get as good with women as YOU want to get but know what you are getting into.... those who end up amazing with women are chameleons that adjust and adapt to every situation... when you do things like this you lose who you are.... you truly lost what means most and that is you. The moment you are constantly doing things for everyone else (for woman so you can get laid) is when you start gaining a serious issue with happiness... you become lonely because nobody ever meets you. They meet a smoke screen you create to be attractive to other people. It's true some of these are basic behaviors, but when you like what they like or don't like it because they like it bla bla bla more bull shit manipulative tactics just to get a girl we have problems.... this is a hole we are trying to steer the new youth away from.... happiness doesn't lay in fucking 2000 women... If not one of them actually meets you... it's a lonely experience.

I've done the chameleon style, it works, dress the right part for where you are going or want. Know the right music, etc. Tell the right lie about things to make her comfortable. That is all bull shit that doesn't make you better with women it makes you a sociopath good at lying to women. You need to have more integrity than that so you can be good with women... not good at manipulation. My body language knowledge gives me a responsive style of game where I can come in at her emotional level and relate... but this style is by no means a manipulation of lies that kills your self-esteem...

A lack of personal integrity means a lack of self-esteem. If you continue to lie and manipulate to fuck women all you'll do is prove your insecurities and have shit come tumbling down on you.

Work to get good with women and respond to them but don't claw your way to the top, then realize you really have nothing and have to claw your way to the top again when you realize your entire reality is false and you weren't really shit.

Build the life you want, and don't advertise bull shit to fuck women... Don't be manipulative but become charismatic...

You're not seeing the reasoning behind what many of us do, perhaps if you'd open your eyes you'd realize pick up has become about a lot more than just fucking women, it's now a lot more focused on self and life improvement...

Peace and Love,

Vic

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Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

I agree, PUA should be considered one of the better methods of male self help and perhaps one day it actually will be seen that way just as women have their numerous websites, magazines and groups men can turn to PUA as it has evolved into that except better. A lot of PUA is founded upon social psychology and behavioural science. This is something that really stands to PU as a form of self help. It's studied, tried and tested and if you share the same goal as PUA promises you'll follow it and see almost immediate improvements in most regards. However, this won't come to be if it's advertised as Pick Up. Instead it should be branched out more and be known as it's own sub-genre within the PUA community and perhaps more mainstreamed.

As is PUA isn't so much about actually Picking Up women or becoming an Artist of it, it's more self help. It's basically telling you to "be confident, look this way and act that way" to have a chance of gaining attention from women. The frustration is what PUA stands for and what it has now become. It was billed as a means to seduce any or most women you wanted and depending on the kind of morals you had you could either lie and cheat your way into their pants or you could just be very suave and pluck the right chords through a series of routines at each stage of the encounter. Now it's essentially show boating yourself with confidence and to a certain degree looks. There's not much technique in looking confident and working up the balls to say hello to someone and have a 50/50 chance you'll make it or break it. It's especially annoying to have gotten in under the guise of Unntaural game only to be told by the vast majority that you should be Natural only to realise that Natural is just a numbers game, not really a perfectionists game where you actually have control over the situation and know exactly how to sway a conversation, where to pick up when things seem to loose traction and how to keep this woman's interest high, have fun with her and show her a good time both emotionally and physically.

It just feels the community has taken to Natural game as the be all end all because so many have seen improvements yet -- as has been mentioned by numerous others -- it all just boils down to approaching as many women as possible and realising out of 20 women the probability is that you will score one of them. It's essentially throwing away most of the theory and foundings of what PUA is at it's core. Hell, I haven't even seen many people mention body language and how to study it or even give advice on it and Unnatural was great for that breaking it down to simple bits of information separated to IOIs and IODs and ways to test for interest and what not.

Honestly, I think the OP is rightly frustrated and I think a lot of people are too such as the old vets that have disappeared from these forums and then the slew of actual PUAs giving out about public forums in general, complaining that a lot of it is just bad advice from newbies who seen some improvements but not actually enough(Not sleeping with anyone) to warrant being a Pick Up Artist themselves.

I think a healthy mix of natural and unnatural is ultimately what people should aim for. The mannerisms, posture, confidence and self-help(Fitness, mental health and income) from Natural Game compliments Unnatural Game really well as well as provides a general improvement in your life as a whole. It gets your foot in the door, creates an air around you and gives you a certain amount of control based on the attraction you've created simply by being seen. Unnatural game is golden for when you talk to women, know how to treat them, what to say, read their body language and react accordingly to make them feel comfortable and attracted to you. It's fun and depending on how you use it you can make it a great experience for the woman and yourself without hurting her or lying to her(Well, not too much... sometimes it's just fun to tell stupid stories).

Also, I should mention that this is the key difference in Natural and Unnatural game: Naturals will sooner tell you to next someone or some other ego-patting advice than tell you to man up and how to handle the situation. There's no "You fucked up here. This is what you did wrong. This is what you do in the future." There's no learning from your experiences because you're told to NEXT a chick and move on, basically give up and don't really learn much from it but save your ego which is only temporary(What when it happens again and again?). Unnatural is more precise, as to follow an exact guide where people will criticize you and tell you what you did wrong and how to improve in future encounters. Natural, when troubleshooting, just seems like a lot of guess work because it is. Natural is entirely down to you, you may have a loose guide to follow an Alpha pattern but you've room to deviate from it and fuck up any which way. So, you'll get to a certain point and then hit a brick wall where very little advice will actually work or help you improve without someone being there with you.

But dude, some of the best gurus turned to natural game like Tyler Durden, of course by natural i mean saying whatever comes to your mind, it seems like PUA was always more of a course on what to not do then what to do, yeah there are some stuff around that is useful but the most useful stuff i heard were not canned routines or procedures, but things that showed me what i was doing wrong.

OP is very optimistic. I love it.

However, you need to be optimistic and realistic to achieve success. If not, you'll just end up disappointed.

You can't get every women out there, broski.

It depends on the situation, sometimes the guys here get extremely "needy and invested" in a girl that is not receptive or just attention whoring, or are ignoring the disinterest and/or have been friendzone, most of these guys you will see have mild onitis=kills attraction anyways, and dig the hole deeper. In those cases is better to move on, and game other women. It would have been better if you would have posted an example, and trust me there are 100s in the forum in the general section.
Because you refuse to waste time in a girl that is CLEARLY, not into you or not receptive to you, does not mean you are settling. On the contrary if you waste a lot of time with a girl like that trying to sell her, or manipulate her into being with you or a fake alpha version of you, that is the worst settling that you could possibly get. I know you are probably brain washed by the FICTIONAL, stories of grandiosity, from the game. But if you read the book objectively from a seduction point of view, it is a poor and pathetic display of seduction.

Totally agree with the skills part(i like the way it sounds as well, skills is the name of the game), the rest is beyond none sense and not worth even respond, since is so ridiculous i don't know where to start.

Do you know what is skills is???? Besides my awesome nickname... Glad you ask, lets look at the definition:

*A skill is the capacity to carry out pre-determined results often with minimum outlay of time, energy or both.

Now let me clarify something to you cause you move on from an unreceptive girl, does not mean you will "settle" for a receptive girl. And this is were i think you are having a confusion....

The point is to move on to find a better or equal girl that is receptive to you and into you. This is more efficient, than your suggested approach.

If you want to get more insight into approaches and the different philosophies in seduction i break it down here:


http://www.theskillsmethod.com/differen ... seduction/

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Learn the proper way to maximize your results in a dancefloor/club environment, check out my blog and youtube channel:
http://www.dancefloorseduction.com

Dancefloor/Club game youtube channel:
http://www.youtube.com/dancefloorseduction

The only thing i've learned from this thread is that some people still have no idea on what "natural game" really is and that some people are still brainwashed by the pua community.

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Never get broken up with again: the-addiction-formula-never-get-broken- ... 88794.html

The PUA community is a bit too obsessed with "nexting". If you chase a girl WELL and CONSISTENTLY how many other guys in her life do you think are doing the same, yea, probably none. Oneitis is not necessarily a bad thing aslong as it is handled well. PUA is currently in 2013 too focused on getting ANY girl rather than THAT girl. A true PUA will get THAT girl.

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It came to me in a drreeeaaammmm

You could chase after some chick consistently for days, weeks, even months (and still probably not get her) or you could spend that same amount of time meeting many awesome high quality women.

Its all preference but for me personally, I'll have some self respect and not chase and get many as opposed to one.

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Never get broken up with again: the-addiction-formula-never-get-broken- ... 88794.html

+1 to this, and its not even really about chasing(I actually prefer the term 'Pursuing'). It's about creating SOMETHING from NOTHING, it's an art. Creating that interest, that spark of attraction from seemingly nowhere, not JUST waiting till you see a girl come on to you. Thats what PUA mastery of old was, with all their little magic tricks, routines, and geeky terms. Geeks getting the hottest girls in the bar through practice.

It's depressing to know that 'PUAs' these days pussy out early just because there are more girls out there. This mindset actually caused me to lose a girl this past week. She told me she wasn't going to put out, I told myself "Fuck that, there are more girls out there. NEXT" When I should have been wondering on how to be so sexy and attractive I get her clothes off regardless.

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Two words: Carpe Diem

onitis is a bad thing, and the way to handle it well is to get other women. A true pua "will get that girl" is so ridiculous i don't know were to start, what if she is not interested in you????????? What if she is madly in love with her bf?? I can go on and on and on...Finally, Onitis kills attraction. best video on onitis here:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNovswAlmio[/youtube]

_________________
Learn the proper way to maximize your results in a dancefloor/club environment, check out my blog and youtube channel:
http://www.dancefloorseduction.com

Dancefloor/Club game youtube channel:
http://www.youtube.com/dancefloorseduction