It also reminds me of people who think its is only moral to earn the living the hard way through sweat and toil... or working on a 9-5 job... any easy money they consider immoral...

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You make some good points nameless hero.

I can certainly relate to the 'work hard' for your money mantra. ie. Sacrifice time. It is a load of shit and I now make a ton more money doing LESS then I made while 'working hard'.

Each to their own, but one-size-fits-all rules are generally ridiculous. ie. You should not enjoy your work and you must work 40 hours a week OR you must 'settle down' and get a wife

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There is absolutely nothing bizarre about monogamy being promoted as a moral directive in a stable society. Generally societies are stable when they are guided by value systems that promote stable families and child rearing in the context of two parents, etc. Soddom and Gommorah would not produce functional societies because the upbringing of new generations would be fucked, and thus so would society.
However, we are not obligated to live in a way that is best for society. By all means, sleep around. I'm not judging. I've done it too.. However when people who are poly/players sneer at normal average members of society, it's pretentious and short sighted. Your grandparents were probably those people, and there's a good chance your parents were too. I know that settling down and raising a family is not for me, however my parents did just that, and so did their parents, and so do a lot of respectable people. I don't judge them for it or look down on them. It's simply not my thing, so I do my own. I see several people here who are militantly against anything monogamous or committed, and sneer any anyone who is. It's just as ignorant as those who preach about jeebus and punishment from godd for anyone who doesn't live their life according to an old book of folk tales, and horrifies god almighty if they so much as kiss someone out of wedlock. Live and let live, guys. Most of those family types you look down upon have nothing against you.
PS. Nobody has a problem with EARNED easy money. A lot of people have problem with UNFAIR gain of money. Society and the economy is ridden with parasites that leech off without producing anything of value (aka. investment bankers, marketers, professional athletes, pop musicians, patent lawyers, speculators, and pretty much the entire financial sector), and they are rightly disliked by many of those who earn what's theirs.

You have missed the entire point of my comment. You are assuming I 'look down' upon people who practice monogamy when that is not what I said at all. I was referring specifically to monogamy being promoted as a moral directive. It can be an option, sure. But the stats in the current western social climate just aren't there to promote monogamy as 'the thing you SHOULD do'. It is flawed and an out of date social construct. But like other old fashioned ways and values. For some it may still be effective. So in essence I am arguing that while it shouldn't be idolised I in no way suggest that individuals who practice monogamy should be condemned. But nobody should feel obliged to follow that model!

And on the comment about money. How the hell do you differentiate between Unfair gain of money and Earned money? I am a marketer. Does that make me a leech? Of course not. I alert people to valuable services or products. BUT I treat my time as a very precious commodity. I am not going to put in 40 hour working weeks when it is simply unnecessary. I would prefer to get double done in a 1/4 of the time by simply choosing tasks that move the needle more then others.

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Oh God! I so beautifuly hitted the nail on the head by making this connection... it was so obvious... its was a signature of the same prejudiced & confused mind...

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I wasn't singling you out in my comment, just a noticeable subset of the PUA crowd. I explained why monogamy is promoted as the thing you *should* do, just like child rearing. If a society promoted free love and no child rearing, it would die out in one generation. Nobody is obligated to follow that model, however this isn't a western phenomenon, and don't expect it to disappear. Permanent monogamous and polygamous (1 man multiple women) marriages have been the gold standard in pretty much every civilization since Mesopotamia. The reason is because it maintains stability and produces functional offspring. At no point in time did "free love" exist as a norm, anywhere, to my knowledge.

As for marketing, this isn't personal, but saying you alert people to valuable services and products is adorable. I would have at least hoped you weren't lying to yourself. You promote the services and products that you are paid to promote. There are already armies of people promoting "valuable products". They're called apple fanboys, and they don't get paid. Marketing stopped having anything to do with actually promoting a product based on its merit since the god of modern marketing, Edward Bernayes, realized he could convince people to buy things they don't need with money they don't have, by playing humans wants and insecurities.

I hope that when you finally leave your parents basement and the real world "hitted"s you, you'll have the foresight to put down Atlas Shrugged and smell the coffee.

[/quote][/quote]

Edward Bernays was the man. He was the OG of marketing. PUA, Sales, and Marketing have a lot of parallels.

Once again you have missed the point. Pay attention! Class is in session!

Of course child rearing is a thing you should do. And you also seem to think that there is simply the monogamous model or the 'free love' model as you put it. Whereas I personally practice something in between. There is a few girls that I truly adore that I see on a regular basis. But I am not going to pass up experiences with other women at the same time. I am very happy.

AS for the arguments for the kids. Daddy has to be fucking mummy and only mummy for him to be classified a good father? Please!! You have your head in the sand. Who you fuck has no BEARING ON THE QUALITY OF FATHER YOU ARE.

Should dad live with and spend time with his kids? Sure.
Should dad just fuck mum to be classified a good dad?? Wait what???? Why the hell does who you fuck have anything to do with raising kids. He shouldn't be out every night trying to hook up perhaps but not being monogamous could mean just seeing a couple of people on the side infrequently.

Your arguments are ludicrous and you would be better off to educate yourself before you discuss such things in a public environment.

As for your lack of understanding about marketing. You are again way off. Here is what happens; Person A creates valuable product but can't get it in front of the right buying demographic. Person B (marketer) puts Person B's product in front of the right people and increases sales. How is that not valuable? The people who want the product get to see it. And Person A gets help to move more of his/her product.

How are you saying that is less valuable then a person putting through items at the cash register? How are you quantifying that? You can't! And your bias is nothing more then that. Bias against those who invest their time more wisely then yourself!!

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^I don't take lessons from marketers. I have a real degree from a real university. One that can land me a real job that pays real money. More than you'll ever see.
Let me know how many "mummies" you'll find that will be cool with daddy running around with his dick out. The moment he is caught, a self respecting woman will file for divorce, and thus the family is finished, and the kids are stuck being raised by separate parents. If she doesn't divorce, the kids will learn that its ok for daddy to betray her, or whoever he wants to, because all will be forgiven, and will grow up with a ton of baggage.
You are a pseudo-intellectual. You know nothing about education. Take your University of Phoenix degree and teach class somewhere else.

Because I'm so very eager to see all the pills out there that will make my micropenis grow 4 inches. Oh and I wish someone told me I should run down to my local dealership and buy that new Dodge Durango I desperately need before they all ran out. I wish you let me know earlier.
You and your kind try to stuff shit we don't want down our throats with a vigor worthy of being called "harrassment", but since its corporate, its all good, since individuals don't have rights anymore, only corporations. You know what I do when I see an ad forced on to me? I avoid the product, and I tell my friends to avoid it. I don't need deceptive condescending bullshit pumped down my throat.

A cashier is a very low value worker that will soon be replaced by machines. Nonetheless, cashiers performed a critical function in retail. A retail transaction could not be made without a cashier until very recently. However, the world did just fine before advertisers decided to make themselves comfortable and shit all over our internet, airwaves, and cities.
A cashier is also paid minimum wage. Unfortunately, because the bulk of the public is dumber than a herd of cattle, your profession remains very effective in generating revenue (but so does Justin Bieber) and you will be paid slightly more than the cashier.
If you want to create value, maybe you should try making products instead of trying to force them on to people, or performing services that people actually need, like medicine.

No way! Are you one of those people that makes 73$/hour just working on your computer from home?

Professional athletes do not leech off of anyone. Society pays a lot of money to see these people play their sport and as a result, they get a lot of money.

Everything is judged by scarcity. Very few people can dunk a ball and show world class speed while performing under pressure with millions watching. Many people can do the basic blue collar jobs.

Investment bankers have to work 70 hours a week, if you knew anything about what you speak of, you would not speak idiotic comments like that.

Pop Musicians have to make a good record and find a way to make it sell millions. You have to be one in a 100 million to have the success that Justin Bieber has had with his fame and fortune (not that I look up to him).

You have absolutely zero idea of what you are talking about and are so sheltered from reality that you should not be the person giving advice.

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I just come on here these days to give advice and read interesting threads. Gone are the days when I came to seek advice and validation.

Ok a few points to make here.
Firstly;
- I also have a degree from a 'real university' as you state.
- There is nothing superior about having a degree. In fact, formal education is flawed in so many ways that for it to be idolised is ridiculous. Results matter, letters next to your name don't. Sorry!
- You are implying that anything that isn't earned directly from a job following tertiary study isn't 'real money' is absurd. Get off your high horse.
Here we go again. You are implying that daddy is 'running around with his dick out' which is the extreme angle that many take. As if you are 'faithful' or out fucking a stranger every night of the year. I said nothing about him running around every night. The point is not to avoid being 'caught', the point is for there to be an agreement between consenting adults. There is nothing wrong with that. No matter what you think! To say that a woman's self respect is linked to her ability to make a man fuck her and fuck her only is so offensive to women that I wouldn't be surprised if you have never touched a woman in your life. Hence, having more then one sexual partner is not a 'betrayal' as you put it. It is understood by the parties involved that it is better for everyone. You are completely missing the point again and looking at this the wrong way. But out of interest; If a woman is in a sexual relationship with a man and he makes it clear he will have sex with other people if the opportunity arises, how is that woman 'disrespecting' herself? She could do the same if she wished.

And the kids will grow up with a ton of baggage? Where the hell do you get off? How many people do you know that have grown up with a ton of baggage because of the circumstances I described? Those circumstances being, that the kids biological parents love and care for their children but occasionally have sexual relations with others WHEN the need/opportunity arises? (NOT EVERY NIGHT) I know countless kids who grew up with tons of baggage because their parents tried monogamy and it FAILED. And failed in a big way. To say that parents being 'faithful' to each other is such an important variable in child development is radical and unsubstantiated. Happiness, love and warmth in the family home are what matters. NOT MONOGAMY!!
Your problem is that you think of education as something being taught in schools and universities. Let me explain: Education is a CONCEPT. School/University is a PLACE. I think there is no greater investment then in your education. But your REAL WORLD education. Not that expensive paper you get because society says, 'well done, you conformed'. Not that formal education has no value. But the value it has is grossly exaggerated. And it has no value for entrepreneur/businessmen who can only truly learn through real world experience and expert mentorship. FYI, I am actually an expert in meta-learning and love education. There is no greater investment in my opinion then learning/education. But before that, it is wise to learn HOW to learn effectively for optimal retention, skill acquisition etc.
Who said anything about marketing penis pills or cars? And there is nothing wrong with that if the buyer and seller are happy. I don't market such things and don't intend to BUT I have nothing against people who do. Just because YOU don't want a certain product doesn't mean it is immoral to sell that product.
Actually you are very very wrong again. I don't work with ads at all. I somewhat agree with you here in that traditional advertising is not the way to go about promotion in the 21st century. But typical of you, you are making baseless assumptions again. I don't work for or with any corporations. You are completely wrong in every assumption you made here. But the thing is, if you don't want a product DON'T BUY IT and quit bitching. Nobody is making you do anything. A very low value worker? Who are you to say that? Once again we are back to the dumb 'advertiser' argument. Read above for my response to that. And also who are you to judge Justin Bieber? I don't personally like his music but he provides value for a lot of people. Just because it doesn't suit you doesn't mean it isn't valuable to others.

How ironic that I should be told to A) Make my own products and B) Go into something like medicine. I DO make my own products and I actually have a pharmacy degree so anytime I want to get into that game I could. But I am not interested. It doesn't allow the freedom I need to prosper. Once again, dumb baseless assumptions.
Sometimes

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Well put Paramount. Bitterness is going to get this guy nowhere.

There is only one Kobe Bryant and one Justin Bieber. But there are tons of blue collar workers. Do something unique for the world and you will be rewarded.

Keep bitching and it will get you nowhere.

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Believe me, you are debating with a fool and a bitter personality. At first I thought it was my threads but that guy is a lunatic. I have read his posts on different threads and he has given some of the worst advice on these boards. I really don't believe he belongs here.

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I just come on here these days to give advice and read interesting threads. Gone are the days when I came to seek advice and validation.

You are a product of McEducation.

The fact that athletes can throw a ball while you watch, and the fact that it entertains you is a credit to neither of you. They produce nothing of substance, and them disappearing off the earth tomorrow would do this world no harm. I'm certain, that very few people in this world are able to suck their own dicks. This scarcity makes them of no worth to me, and to civilization in general. The fact that fools find it entertaining and pay money to watch, does not make them any more important.

Justin Bieber, along with every pop "musician" is an abomination of music, and a product of a marketing machine. Want proof? Ask a 12 year old girl today about the backstreet boys.

Investment bankers, some of which I personally know, are some of the biggest idiots I have ever met. They have no idea how statistics and probabilities work, they play casino with the economy, parasitizing off of common people through usury. The fact that they work 70 hours a week to steal my money gives them no claim to it.

You make the common fatal assumption that circulation of capital in a self serving system somehow contributes to it's prosperity. That is wrong, and that is what is causing economies around you to crash spectacularly. When a populace becomes so stupid that their entire course of existence is "servicing" themselves, and they forget to produce all that they consume, they are doomed to a humiliating downfall.
A person's worth is not determined by the amount of revenue they generate, or the size of their bank account. It is determined by how history values their contribution to this world. The inventor of penicillin, who is infinitely more important than any of the brats you worship, made much, much less money on it, but he will be remembered 200 years from now. Isaac Newton will be remembered and known as long as books exist. Alexander the Great will be remembered as one of the world's most successful conquerors. Neither you, nor any of your idols will be remembered as anything, because your impact on this world will always be zero.

Maybe if you took a little bit of time out of your liberal arts education to read about history and economics, from somewhere outside your 11th grade Alabama class textbook, you would have a tad bit of insight in to how the real world works. You, just like 98% of society are idiots, and smart men behind the curtain play you like the fiddles you are. Take your worthless liberal arts degree and make me a coffee. Now get back to chewing popcorn to your iron man masturbation session.