It sounds to me you are buying in to the "looks DO matter" routine, meaning that all you need do is fix your hair, and dress well, and then you will have the looks women want.

If you go to a wedding everybody there is well dressed and looking good. That doesnt mean women want to fuck you, they just think you look nice.

And again, why is it always the best looking guy with low social status, yet the ugly guy always has all the social status?

Your making extreme examples to try and prove that looks dont matter. Good looking people can and usually do have higher social status than the fuglies.

Just like good looking guys CAN and DO have game, and fuglies DONT have game.

Any guy going out sarging knows he has to look nice, nice doesnt cut it. HOT is what motivates women, at least at the start.

Just cause one is ugly, it doesnt mean that they can learn all about the other things women like, and that the good looking guy doesnt know anything about that.

I know looks matter, not looking nice, but HOT LOOKS, get it? Ive seen women fall over themselves for a real good looking guy. He has to be REALLY good looking though.

I know women dont always go for the best looking guys, but thats because they see a future in this guy. For one night sex, being a nice dresser and good conversationalist, wont get you laid.

1) There will always be people better than you. Be it looks, game, money or status.
2) Different people want different things. Some women would hate dating a millionaire, male model.
3) Looks do matter. So does everything else.
4) Nobody is perfect, people gloss over imperfections if there is enough to attract them.
5) You are the sum of all your qualities and flaws, attraction will occur if non of your flaws are deal breakers and she finds your qualities attractive.

It is not a matter of the looks you were given, almost everyone around average, but the people who are above average have done things to their appearance that correspond with their look. Looks do matter in many cases, but many girls are so insecure that they put looks out of the picture. You can go to the gym and workout to get a better body, go to a proper stylist and higher designers to improve your appearance and these are simple things that you can give you HUGE gains in confidence; essentially a boost in your entire game. It's about the energy you project, you gotta be positive and confident; these traits lead to better game. when I dress up in a designer suit, I feel better and I am more likely to slay some poon than if i were in a t-shirt. Simple dynamics.

This friend of yours was clearly doing what you and your buddies neglected to do and that was to not give them the attention they desired (just going off what you said).

Well said bro

Exactly, so if you dont have looks, money, power influence, wit, charm, charisma, your not getting hot women.

Regardless of what you try to do.

All the statement is saying is looks matter, we dont want ugly women, they dont want ugly men, unless they
got something as important as looks are to us, like money.

If your a 6, load up on 6's, you wont get an hb 10

yes it IS a matter of what you were given. If a woman has big tits, she has an advantage over a woman who is flat. If a guy is tall he has an advantage over a short guy.

If a guy is handsome he has an advantage over a guy who is ugly.

The first impression thing comes into effect. You wont get a shot to demonstrate your other qualities if a handsome guy moves in on your game.

And you can fuck up your game and say stupid things, and a woman will still like you cause of your looks.

Its already been proven, people like good looking people by default.

I didn't mean it like that, you're assigning meaning to things people say, which means you're not seeing things how they actually are, you're interpreting things based on your own feelings. Ask yourself are you seeking the truth or are you just looking to validate your feelings on this matter.

The way somebody dresses and being well groomed can make a huge difference to a persons attractiveness, for both men and women, I have seen loads of examples of this, mainly with women, again it sounds like you're making excuses not to make the effort. The way you dress says a lot about you, it will also increase confidence, I advocate dressing well and developing good social skills and game.
There is a difference between looking nice and looking smart and presentable, to look nice is the same as looking good. If you look good, you look attractive.
Nobody is saying that all good looking guys have no game, you're twisting words to suit your own beliefs. a good looking guy with good social skills will do well with women, but that doesn't mean they have good game, good game is about strategy and tactics using things like disqualification or qualification, even the best naturals will probably never reach the level of skill that a good PUA will, for one good reason, he's already doing well with women and he doesn't need to learn that stuff.
I agree but a less good looking guy with good game could steal women away from him.
Being able to build attraction will get you laid and that is where having good game comes in.

_________________
"All that we are is the result of what we have thought. The mind is everything. What we think, we become."
Guatama Buddha

Please post pictures of you with your women, if you have any at all, i wll concede the argument,

If you dont, we'll dismiss your thoughts as wishful thinking

I strongly suspect you've read some PUA books and have never met actual PUAs. Most PUAs have nominal success with women(at best). There is not one PUA anywhere, that can reliably pull 8s. Much less 10s. Have you seen the pork that the RSD crew tends to bang? And they're more successful than Style's crew, Mystery's crew, Ross Jefferies's crew, etc. There are a handful of PUAs that are good with women. And all of them are nice looking.

Mehow is about the worst looking one that actually gets nice looking girls. And he pretty much lives and breathes this stuff.
You look at guys like Arash and Bravo and all they bang are ugly/fat whores. And even they're in a better position than guys like David Wygant and David DeAngelo who are damn near to being virgins.

PUA is like a prosthetic limb for someone missing a leg. It'll help you get around like a normal person and you can even push yourself beyond the average. But it's not an advantage and the best in the community will never exceed the best outside of it.

_________________
RSDTyler

He's just reading the stuff and liking what it says. Thats what most pua stuff ism, a feel good set of instructions that makes the afc feel as if they have control over the competition for women.

Untill I see somebody actually succeed in the real life situation with pua material, and it couldn't be explained by the pua guy just having balls to talk to the girls, i remain dubious.

I know from my own experience that the times ive hooked up with women, I didnt have to work at it, it wasnt something I had to do, it just came naturally because the girl showed interest.

You cant create attraction, this is what the pua works is centered around. Shes either attracted or she isnt, nothing you can do about it.

If she is attracted, most idiots can get somewhere with her just being themselves. AFC"S being the exception

Yay! Someone who's of like mind ^__^
Stick around, dude. We need guys like you to fight the Kool-Aid brigade.

I think it's nearly impossible to create attraction where there was none, but it can be amplified. I've never had a girl go from total disinterest to interest, but I've certainly had mild interest go way up.

I have actually seen a guy go after a chick who had no interest in him and blew him off and persistence resulted in getting the girl. But I've seen it maybe 3-4 times out of literally hundreds(if not thousands) of failed attempts. I think most of these ideas are born from real situations. But it mistakes random chance for something repeatable.

I run probabilities and go with my best shots, in relation to my preferences. Sure, I'd like to bang the hottest chick I can find, but she's very unlikely to be into me. And even in the rare case she will be, I probably won't like her all that much. I'd rather actually get a 7 that interest me and I can spend time with, than fail dozens of times with a 9 and never get one I want.

_________________
RSDTyler

I agree with just about all of this. Most people in general are average, so it's likely you will get average looking girls without doing anything special. As long as you can talk to a girl, you have a chance with an average chick.

I knew a guy who met a hot chick, and her mother,,,, not even her, but her mother thought the guy was
too plain for her. LOL. Thats gotta sting when a girls mother doesnt think you are handsome enough for her daughter.

I too have seen hot women with ugly guys at very rare times. Usually he has money.

There are leagues, even if we dont want to admit it, some girls are out of our league, unless we have some serious value like looks, money, power etc.

"Game" is a bunch of shit. Theres no such thing, just the users imagination.

Sounds like many of you have just fallen for the over the top marketing techniques, and now you're disappointed.

This is a business for these guys, they're trying to make money, so they say things like "any guy can get any girl" it's not true, I would of thought this was a very obvious thing.

Much of pua when you look past the BS is just common sense and good technique.

It's only ever been about reaching your potential, a fat ugly guy is going to struggle to gain attraction even with the best game, I am not disagreeing with any of you on that.

The guys that will get the best results are the guys that are fairly good looking with no game or poor social skills, I think that's who pua was created for in the first place, it was designed for those that weren't doing as well as they should. I myself would fit into this category being 6 foot 2, 210 pounds with 10 % body fat, I was able to gain attraction but often I wasn't able to capitalise on it.

_________________
"All that we are is the result of what we have thought. The mind is everything. What we think, we become."
Guatama Buddha

I agree. I think it's all about ratings. If most women rate you as a 5, that is what you might attract. Unless you got money or power.

If women immediately rate you as a 9 or 10, you are not going to have any problem attracting women.

I think PUA works for the 7's more than a anything. There are some good looking people who are shy and afraid of women, that is what it is for.

It's hope being sold. Im not against improving oneself, but you have to ask yourself why you are doing it.

Id say most people who get women using pua, probably could have done it without it. They just didnt know how.

I just feel bad for the guys who go out and change everything. Their bodys, their look, their language, their lifestyle, their friends, etc etc etc, and it doesnt do anything for them.

I think alot of women will find pua guys annoying. I always find people who try to be confident annoying, it's obvious they are putting on a show.