1.) Confidence is merely a good feeling about something. Drugs can give you feelings of confidence. This is why some people can't be social without drinking. Alcohol replaces anxiety with feelings of confidence. Similarly, some people smoke weed to relieve stress; the weed replaces feelings of anxiety with feelings of confidence. This is just temporary though. I'm not going to judge anyone that does this because I don't know their life and I don't know what they are dealing with.

2.) You fail to understand knowledge does not equate confidence. You keep talking about knowing your value you and your worth and all that. But, just because you know somethign does not mean you are going to feel good. For instance you know scary movies are not real but you still get scared. Its all emotional. Confidence is all emotional.

3.) Confidence comes from many places. It can come from your own attitude. It can come from your accomplishments. It can come from your friends. It can come from your family. I don't look to others to make me confident, but I do know that others can have an affect on me and sometimes that can be a great affect. I'm just aware of how things beyond me can affect me.

4.) Victory over myself. Pushing through the pain is a victory in itself. I know that. If you are scared to talk to a girl just approaching her is a moral victory. It shows courage. I don't have a problem with that. WHat I have a problem with is people not caring if they get rejected. What I have a problem with is people not protecting themselves emotionally. Its like a boxer instead going in with his hands up, just walks in telling the other guy to hit him thats crazy. Taking damage ain't smart. i remember when I read the game about 6 years ago there was a part in there where Style approaches these models and they say something and he says his self-esteem was affected by that one comment for months later.

Sometimes its beyond your power whether things will affect you or not. So protect your insecurities.

5.) Discipline is doing what you hate to do as if you love to do it. Without discipline you are nothing.

6.) A manager and a developer of talent are two completely different. A manger knows how to drive a farari. A developer knows how to create a farari. Big difference.

7.) Here are the four Greek words for love: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_words_for_love

Keep calling unicorns donkeys though.

8.) What you have to understand is this. Different people hae different pyschological make ups given their experience. Some people will inherently believe they can't do things given their background and experience. However, they can go through a routine of affirmations and rituals to make themselves believe what they should believe. This is why you have to tell yourself you are the shit.

This is essentially the importance of rituals in religion. Although reality may say otherwise, but by going through rituals on a daily, weekly basis you cultivate faith.

9. Whether you think you can or you can't you are right....is not true. If you think you can, you will try and find out if you are right. If you think you can't you will quit and never know what you could have achieved.

10.) You worry about what people think order to control what they are thinking. This is a very power skill, to control someone's perception. Since people are wht they believe. If you control their perception you control them. POWER!!!!!

The Ego is merely how you think of yourself. You would do your workers a service by writing them all and saying "You are the greatest workers of all time"

Big ego is just when you think grand things about yourself like you can conquer the universe.

Fragile ego is one where what you think about yourself is not firm. It is not strong or firm or solid. YOu are easily swayed.

You don't have to deserve to be confident. THat's just bullshit. I love. I love. I loooooove scrappy doo. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XG8dgN6x2EA He believes he is a big dog and that he can whoop anybody and he pushes himself to the limit because he has SUPREME CONFIDENCE. Supreme Confidence
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KhCvL6gxGI

Its those peopel that have the most reasons not to be confident that need confidence the most because the more you have to overcome the more you have to believe in yourself. A loser has to be more confident that a winner.

The underdog has to be more confident than the champion

what a long thread,

confidence = certainty or a state of being sure of something, it comes from experience in doing something, repetition creates competence, and when it is rationalized that you are competent doing something, you can feel ''sure'' about what you are doing

you can also start to become more ''sure'' of yourself in general (self confidence), you are a competent person in general simply by having a lot of different experiences to give you more of your own sense of self, more of an ideal of what you think, how to do/act in specific situations based on personal experience

self esteem = a persons own view of their self worth

ego (in the tolle sense) = your self perception of your whole identity, who your mind percieves you are, de-tachment from the ego in this sense is not defining yourself directly anymore or being self concious, it is relating through others and just ''being'' instead of being self aware and projecting your self perception outwardly on to others (aka losing/dropping your ego)

it is more realistic to try to tame your ego (in the tolle sense) rather then to ''kill it'' since it is nearly impossible to not project your opinions and self perception onto others, that would require you to remain present to the moment 24 hours a day, unless you are some master zen monk who has been meditating in some cave somewhere who has reached full enlightenment then this is not likely, and by that point you will probably have no attachment to anything

self esteem can have an impact on the ego (from the tolle sense) and is not a constant, if you are validated externally and are reactive (low on self confidence/insecure), then outward validation will have a larger impact on your self esteem, directly impacting your ego and what sort of identity you percieve yourself to have

you can be highly confident at something, with a low self esteem, you can be highly confident at something with a high self esteem, you can have a huge ego and be confident, you can have a de-tached ego and be confident

confidence and self perception don't have much to do with each other, you can be confident you suck just as easily as you can be confident that you rock

in the same way all these things are interchangable, being humble or being arrogant are two things that are not mutually exclusive to confidence

you can be either or and be confident in what you are doing, also being positive or negative have very little to do with how confident you are, confidence is about ''knowing'', when you have rode a bike a million times, you ''know'' how to ride a bike, if you have banged 100 girls, you ''know'' how to bang a girl and know when it is time to split and when it is time to move forward, you ''know''

being happy/sad/arrogant/humble/cocky/mad/irritated or what ever, don't have very much to do with being ''sure''

also, drugs don't nessicarily make you confident, they are more likely to raise your self esteem then to raise your confidence, it will have you thinking, IM THE BEST, I FEEL SO GOOD, this giant boost in self esteem can give you more temporary self confidence, but if you are using girls as an example, if you walk up and have no idea what you are doing but you are high, you will soon lose that sense of confidence when you don't ''know'' what to do, and just because you are thinking ''I CAN DO THIS'' doesn't mean you ''know'' how to do it, this sort of thinking is only really useful if you are secure in this belief that you ''know'' what you are doing, simply in terms remaining congruent in what you are doing

for example, lets say some guy is drunk and a police officer stops him, and he thinks he can get away with being drunk in public, and he thinks he knows he can outsmart him, he will remain congruent to the idea that ''he is not drunk'', how ever it does not mean he will be showing motor skills that indicate to the police officer that he is not drunk, because he won't be fully confident in what he is doing, but he will have more congruence with what he is trying to do, because he believes in himself, he is ''self confident'', but not ''situationally confident''

but the perception of the skill and confidence in executing the skill, will be relative to the police officer, not the drunk mans self perception

in terms of pickup, your confidence will come from a solid understanding of a game plan, even if you want to de-tach from ''routines'' in the say XYZ she does ZYZ sense, you still need a ''routine'' as in a way to do it, how you go about it, and what your general plan of action is so that you ''know'' what you are doing

also, negative as well as positive reference experiences build confidence all the same, the more reactive you are / the weaker your sense of self is (the more insecure), the more negative/positive experiences will affect your self esteem and ego, rather then your confidence, your confidence will only grow through repetition, you start to become more sure that if you do general thing ZYZ, you get XYZ result, repeat the motions and patterns become blatently obvious and you start to become more ''sure'' of what you are doing and the feedback you are getting, this of coarse will be filtered through your ego (in the tolle sense) and affected by your self esteem

The general view is that raising your self-esteem will raise your self-confidence as well. The thought being that high value gives you high power. However, this is not always true. I know people that feel like they deserve more than they believe that they can accomplish.

It seems like this definiton of ego means being self-centered.

You should always have a plan. That may be more important than alot of confidence. All you just need is enough confidence to execute a good plan.

Confidence expects to win

Confidence expects to succeed.

Here is Style talking about confidence at 9:19 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJhTQ1NxmN0 He says confidence comes from success. Which is true.
Our experiences form our expectations for the world. So by succeeding we expect to succeed.

If you learn the hard way or you don't care if you get rejected this will cause a problem. YOu won't be committed to winning. You won't prepare like you need to, you won't approach everyone, you'll give up on some situation before you have really lost and you will be reckless in your approaches...you'll kinda just be like whatever, blowing opportunities.

you can be confident you will fail, just as much as you can be confident you will succeed, and this self belief does not reflect actual skill level,

it doesn't matter how much a fat, balding, ugly, smelly, dirty, poor, 50 year old trucker lacking social skills believes he can fuck 18 year old smoke shows, he has a better chance of rigging his truck up to fly to the moon, then reaching a high level of consistancy with fucking model looking young girls, unless he has one hell of an epic con of a gameplan that brings value in exchange for sex (like a porn scam or something), if he is confident he can get them or not really doesn't make a whole lot of a difference, mate selection is just as much in the hands of women as it is in the hands of men, being dillusional doesn't really change this

confidence does not guarentee success, and confidence in a ''game'' is just as much knowing when to walk away and not pursue a set, as it is knowing how to capitalize on a good thing without cock blocking yourself, it is just simply ''knowing'' what you are doing, you can not create attraction out of thin air (your personality is a factor in how attractive you are percieved to be, but it is for the most part a constant due to habitual behaviors and will be seen differently by different people depending on the persons tastes), how attractive you are will be defined by the person in front of you and some variables will not be within your immidiate control, nor will they be constant from girl to girl, you have to learn to deal with this and become secure, or you will have a never ending loop based off external validation that lowers/raises your self esteem that will eventually lead to a depression, always thinking you are not good enough because everything is not perfect

confidence comes from both success and failure, both reference points help you learn what works for you and what does not work for you, you will not learn more from one then the other, that is why there is this saying in the community that rejection is just a learning experience

you also tend to use mystery and style and the mystery method for examples a lot, ever actually read their archives?, they are just normal guys like anyone else, and style is rich and high in social status and still doesn't seem to be pulling off anything extra special (he is millionaire with access to celebrity parties ffs, imagine the value behind ''let me take you to see motley crue and we will hang out with them after'' to a girl compared to ''lets go for coffee some time''), the vast majority of all their sets end up in no sex, but it is not the blown out sets that are highlighted, it's fucking and marrying a oneitis in ''the game'' and how mystery is the GREATEST OF ALL TIME... (in the book), just regular guys with game plans man... no magic super vodoo powers or anything, just some good social skills and know how and some good marketing from a new your times best selling book


it's lisa from the game!! hb10 game all day!

game improves your odds man, it doesn't make them

Rule #1: The sky is the limit. ANything is possible.

My point is I reference these other people so that its clear I'm not just pulling this stuff out of my ass.

Most of the things I think comes from the thinking of someone that came before me. Study history and it saves you a lot of time.

Success builds confidence.

Failure builds toughness.

Toughness expects to endure

Confidence expects to win.

You Play to Win the Game and To be all that you can be.

What I am worrying about is self-sabotage. I think self-esteem and self-confidence are directly related to your ego, how you think of yourself. When you get rejected you begin to accept rejection and you begin to expect rejection. What do I mean by this? When rejection seems awful, intolerable you want to avoid it at all costs. And when you believe you will succeed you can fully commit yourself to a situation without timidity, you can give your all. When you accept rejection and when you expect rejection this causes self-sabotage, where you simply talk yourself out of doing things and say you can't OR where you do things in a way that you really are not prepared to succeed. You think its okay to get rejected or that you will get rejected so you do things in a way that will get you rejected.

WHen you have self-esteem you think you deserve better than rejection. When you have self-confidence you think you will succeed, that you won't get rejected.

You want to fail so you can learn. Now think about this statement. Very well you may have to learn the hard way and you have to take risks in life, but wanting to fail that is sending the wrong message. It sends the wrong message subconsciously. Its not okay to fail. You don't want to fail. You may learn from losing, but you play to win the game. Hello? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W42iiCcFbxE

I wanted to apologize for being wrong about my eros statement, Eros was apparently also a word, not just a Greek God. Other than that I'm done wasting my time on this. You've undoubtedly made some points I agree with, unfortunately your mind isn't open enough to have an actual conversation regarding this. I feel like I can go talk to a cement block and get just as much as I got out of our conversation (perhaps more, at least the block doesn't spout ignorant remarks.)

Good Luck in all your future endeavors,

Peace and Love,

Vic


P.S. Thanks Pumpington for coming on and helping straighten out some thoughts. I always enjoy your wisdom sir.

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

A cement block of truth...


But, you do need to address the issue of self-sabotage. You have not addressed my point that trying "to kill the ego" creates self-defeating beliefs inside you. You have not addressed the issue that failing makes you lose your fear of failure. You have not addressed the issue that failing makes you expect failure. You have not addressed the issue that failure can really hurt your feelings, pierce you deeply and take energy out of you.

WHere does confidence come from?

Where does self-esteem come from?

You need to answer these questions. My answer is that confidence comes from thinking of yourself as good and powerful, and self-esteem comes from thinking of yourself as valuable.

one more thing about "killing the ego" and not caring about rejection. You have not addressed how negative experiences are haunting. Haunting. Have you ever been hurt or humiliated and then you feel that same way when place in that situation again? Thats the memory haunting you on a subconscious level. You have not addressed this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-0G_FI61a8

You consider what I said self-sabotage, I consider it expanding the ceiling on someone. I considering it making those things that really aren't a big deal, not a big deal (such as rejection). I consider it giving people an understanding that no experience should ever change how you feel about yourself. I believe in trying and learning, you know exactly as humans go through life(from the very beginning). My ideal is that you are limited by not trying more than by not succeeding(failing, rejection, wrong way, however you want to put it) this time(remember there is always next time).
Answered this already. WON'T do it again.
The confidence I'm talking about (confidence in yourself) is a form of self esteem.
I don't need to answer shit, you want me to, so we can argue about nothing forever and a day.
I agree killing the ego was a bad way to put it, controlling the ego a better way to put it.

Negative experiences aren't haunting if you were intelligent enough to understand anything I said, too bad to, I mentioned some good stuff.

An experience is neutral, your perception of that experience is not. You see rejection as negative, I see it as positive because it is something I can learn from.

Of course I've been hurt or humiliated, the difference is I no longer grant any experience enough value to be humiliated, an experience can not influence your value if you have what I'm talking about. You should realize you assign yourself humiliation, nobody else.

Hurt is based on how much emotion you invest in anything, that is something YOU MUST experience. If not why be human?

Nothing haunts you at a subconscious level with the Self-confidence I'm talking about. This is what I mean by you don't understand. You won't get it, you can't get it. You just aren't there, I can't help you if you won't open up and actually listen.


Peace and Love,

Vic

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

1.) No you never said shit about how to build confidence. You defined confidence, but you neve said how to build it.

2.) What you said is not self-sabotage, but killing the ego will lead to self-sabotage.

3.) My problem with people that think like you is that you put people down, to kill their ego which is just dimnishing their self-confidence, then you demand that those people do things that they have no confidence to do (because you took it from them)...then when they don't do it you look down on them some more.

4.) I get the feeling you understand nothing about the subconscious (The subconscious is the boss) and how experiences stay with you for the rest of your life. Confidence is more about what you think subconsciously than anything. It is troubling that you completely ignore this.

Subconsciously if you believe you can't do something you will avoid it and make up reasons not to do it. YOu will do things just because you believe you should subconsciously.

I care about what other people say to me, I care about my experiences, I care about so many other things than my own conscious thoughts because I KNOW those things have an affect on people subconsciously.

What I keep trying to hammer home to you more than anything is this. Sometimes the subconscious is supreme and no matter how hard you try you won't be able to overcome it. Now you can take the time and progress to building yourself up to a certain point to eventually overcome it, but you have to understand the power of the subconscious.

I misunderstood your question, my bad. Honestly if you want help with your self-confidence I will help, it doesn't seem like you do though. Though you had some solid thoughts in your other thread on building confidence it's certainly missing some very important aspects.

Note: I don't think I could help you with confidence, You wouldn't commit to the program I am developing that builds my ideal of self-confidence. You would likely think half the tasks are pointless, so why should I waste my time on you? The self-confidence program I'm developing will be over 60 pages with videos, an mp3, it's not a simple process, it requires a lot more then a post. It will assign you daily tasks. If you want help IM me respectably and I'll help you.

Letting the (spiritual)ego own you will lead to self-sabotage. For instance:

You see this sexy girl across the bar, you think damn, she's fly. I want to go talk to her she is sexy, but she might reject me and then all these people here will think less of me. They'll think I'm low value. They'll have think I'm a loser if she rejects me. I'm not going over.

Can you see how this is self-sabotage? This stops you from doing it. You think about perception of you and your value, questioning it, doubting it.

Now here is my "ideal" of Self-Confident Guy:

Damn she is sexy. I'm going to go chat with her. (Walks over)

I can't take away what someone never had. If they never actually had self-confidence then how can I take it from them? The (spiritual)ego makes you feel confident it doesn't give you self-confidence, Hence it's nick name as "The False Center". Self-confidences comes from within, not from how others feel about you. How others feel about you gives you temporary confidence until someone makes you feel bad, this is what I mean by ego (spiritual). Not your "self" that feels confident because someone just gave you some form of positive reinforcement(phone number, conversation, get laid, etc.).

My "ideal" on Self-confidence is feeling good about yourself as well as all those other behaviors I was talking about.

I've studied NLP and hypnosis, as well as some minimal psychology, while I'm not the most amazing I know quite a bit more than you realize about subconscious, including how to influence it. I'm not sure you understand the subconscious as well as me for you to be lecturing me on it.



LOL - This proves my point right here. You aren't self-confident, how confident you feel is in direct relation what people say about you. I'm independently confident of any person's judgment of me. As I said if I walk up and chat with a girl and get her number or if I walk up and chat with a girl and she gives me the cold shoulder I feel no different about myself. I feel no different either way, getting a number doesn't make my day.

Now can the conversation make me feel different? Of course but it was the conversation, it was the experience, it wasn't however the fact that I got a girls number, fucked her, or got rejected.

This is beyond your present development, it can not be explained, since you haven't felt it you don't understand it. It is an enlightenment beyond you at this moment, though you seem like an intelligent guy, I'm sure you'll find it when you are ready.

Peace and Love,

Vic

_________________
Just another guy from back in the day.

Blogging again living life: http://www.Scienceofnaturalgame.com

Dude what are you talking about? Self-confidence comes from within? Where out my ass? Self-Confidence is instilled. Instilled. That means it is put inside of you from others, your experiences and yourself. Its instilled.

You are supposed to care about what people say about you, anyone that doesn't is either crazy or a liar. Its really arrogant to say that you shouldn't care what people say about you; its the equivalent of saying you are all powerful and that no one can ever influence how you feel about yourself. No one has that type of strength inside of them. Now, notice I didn't say be dominated and controlled by what people think you; it just should be a part of your analysis.

I know how to build self-confidence and I have stated how. You haven't.

I don't know if you're confident or not. I would have to see where you started from. I would also see how you challenge yourself.

No one is completely independently confident. No one. This is why every one should care about what other people say to them. To often people have people in their lives talking to them any kind of way and they have no confidence because they refuse to admit (no doubt out of pride) how others treat you affects you. People talk about independent confidence like its some grand thing, but most of the people that seem independently confident just had good friends, good families and good experiences that strengthened them...its wasn't an independent attitude. They were raised that way, raised to think that way.

You talk about working out for yourself and making money for yourself, but subconscsiously you have so many motives pushing you to do things that you really never will be able to say why you are doing something. You don't know more than me. I don't think you understand the subconscsious at all.

A big ego would not sabotage you from talking to a girl. If you have a big ego you think "I am the shit and the girl should give me her number. Something is wrong with her if she doesn't." Now Lets say you have a fragile ego, you need to consider whether this girl is going to reject you because if she does she will shatter your self-image. You need to protect yourself. Thats just common sense. You need to protect yourself.

Honestly, I feel that you don't realize the value of being self-conscious to protecting your reputation, to protecting your self-confidence, and to helping you to behave judiciously. You fail to undertsand all your feelings have legitimate purposes.

I think you dont care about your reputation. I'm a stand up guy and I want everyone I interact with to believe that.