Hey guys,

This is the back story. I met this girl who's a friend of a friend at some party and we chatted a bit. I made plans with her and we went to see an exhibition at a gallery. We had a nice conversation and after that when she had to go we talked for another 20-30 minutes on the street. I asked her out again, this time to go somewhere for a drink in the evening, but she invited me to play some game (she likes board games) and was with her friends. I accepted but, again, she was with her friends so nothing really happened. When I was leaving she started apologizing for not wanting to go for a drink and made some excuses. I told her she will tell me when she wants to go for a drink. Since I can see she's into me (she wanted to show me more games) I wanted to punish her a bit and let her contact me next but it's been 3 days since that and I'm not sure if I this was a good move and whether I should wait or contact her. I haven't used any PUA stuff, just general teasing, I wanted to leave anything more interesting for when we are alone in a more appropriate setting. What do you think?

Get her to hang out with you alone. Don't trip over her not contacting you, it's good that you didn't hit her up over the last few days as well.

Hit her up and get her to hang outside, not board games. This way you can still escalate even if you guys are in a group.

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"Don't put the pussy on a pedestal"

Thanks for the response, kingmack07. That's my goal, of course, but what excuse can I have to see her? I contacted her about those other board games but she said she had a lot of work to do and she didn't feel emotionally well. We had a really boring conversation but still she kept it up. How do you handle such a situation, especially a response like the above?

A small update on the situation. I went out with her again, she was very willing to do so. We had a nice and smooth conversation and she responded well to my touch. However, when I went for the kiss she refused. I used Mystery's "Would you like to kiss me?" and then recovered by saying I didn't say she could. After my attempt the conversation was still pretty much the same - nice and smooth. I had promised to lend her a book and invited her home. She agreed and came over. Again, however, when I tried escalating she refused for no apparent reason. It wasn't awkward afterwards, I asked her to stay but she left. She even said she could see me again to return the book. We hugged when she left. I'm really confused here. What do you think I should have done? What do you think I should do next?

Another thing is I didn't have her number prior to going out with her today. I mentioned that at our date and she gave it to me after my attempt to kiss her. It's very weird.

I really need some advice here, guys. Although nothing happened when she came to my place, she keeps talking to me on facebook and she is the one to start the conversation (she did it 3 times). She told me she finds me very interesting but that that is all (I didn't ask her). I'm teasing her most of the time and she seems to enjoy it but still refused to see me again (I asked only once and only because she said she's bored). I also always end the conversation first. This is getting really annoying. Do you think it would be a good idea to tell her to decide what she wants and then contact me? How do you handle such a situation?

May I ask how old you both are?

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e for effort

Look, this is just as ridiculous to me as it appears to you. I'm 22 and she's 21.

Ok, I'd say it's because she's inexperienced. But she's a bit older and sure she's had relationships. Dude, best advise is to start getting more aggressive and start applying some PUA techniques. You mentioned in your first post, you had not been. You got to get her to crave you and feel comfortable to take things all the way. From your posts, you sound just as resistant as she is. As the master Jedi Yoda once said... Control, control, you must learn control!

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e for effort

Do you have anything in mind?

I tried to use something I learned from Ross Jeffries where I ask her where she would like to be or what she would like to do if she wants get away and just relax and then have her include me in her description. However, she said something extremely boring like being in her room. I guess I might be making excuses and there was probably a way to direct her but I didn't come up with anything on the spot. I'm also using a lot of push/pull (but more conversational). I touch her a lot when we talk, for example to emphasize a joke or when I (contextually) change the topic. I know there is a lot more I can do but I'm still new to the game. What I've described so far, however, has worked for a few k-closes and f-closes.

I know it's probably not what you want to hear bud, but i really would suggest moving onto your next target. If she's not into you she's not into you.

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I'm a God, and women are atheists.

might be too late at this point, but here are two ideas to consider

-the hail mary, she has given you two chances to make something happen, probably has been laughing at your shit, asking you about yourself, maybe even touching you a bit, what ever, showing interest and you have not moved things forward, so, throw the hail mary, instead of being needy and ''punishing'', you just toss out the hail and give her a sign you will deliver if she comes out with you again, just be honest and send the message straight from you 100% how you feel, then move on and leave it up to her to reciprocate or turn it down

-stop trying, move on, try again for an invite in a few weeks after she has had some time apart

either or, start focusing on other girls, never game 1 girl at a time, it will leave you needy

I really don't mind moving on, it's just that her behavior seems strange to me.

pumpington, I think you didn't read all the updates. After my initial post she invited me to go out on a Friday night. It was all very nice, kino, she asked a lot about me, but when I tried to k-close she said no. Then she continued to ask a lot about me and then I suggested to go to another pub to which she agreed. Since it was full I suggested I gave her a book I had promised her. She came to my place but still resisted (took my hand off when I got to her bra). Since that night she has messaged me every day on facebook. It also seems to me that she is throwing shit tests at me, although I might be wrong, by saying I'm not that interesting anymore and then contacts me again the next day. I don't think I have presented myself as needy at any point. [/b]

the neediness thing is not for her and how you are ''presenting yourself'' to her, it is for you

needy = cares
indifferent = opposite of needy

sometimes I personally get needy after knowing a girl for like 2 days, say I make out with her and all of a sudden I want to bang her, I want to call her, I want to get her, she matters to me, I care, I want to ''get her'', this is the start to getting needy, it happens to nearly every guy, doesn't mean you are stalking some girl or anything or can't live without her (although that is needy in extremes), just that she has become your focus and it is no longer a ''meh I can be with her or with out her makes no difference'' scenario

^ this is not necessarily a terrible evil thing, it just leads to emotional attachment, and until sex, you want to avoid ''caring'' so that it is easy to move on if you have to and has less of an impact on your life and your self esteem, if you find yourself saying, how do I get this girl?, or I have to get this girl!, chances are you are starting to care, what tactics should I use to get XYZ girl?

signs that you are becoming ''needy'' include approval seeking, reaction seeking (trying to punish/put her down/plan out you say in the future instead of just being present with her), and oneitis (focus on one specific girl)

it's cool she invited you out again, that's a good sign, but you should cut her off when she is interested and flaking, to

1) stop yourself from caring
2) make her miss your attention so how much she wants to see you increases (show her that you can be without her so that she doesn't want to lose you)

if she is flaking in a pattern, then it is time to move on, and cut contact short, only offering her nonchalant invites out and trying to lead her back to your house


when she is out with you, turn her on more man, touch her, talk about sex, get her more horny, build more tension, let her know that she is turning you on, keep your sexuality private between you and her, turn her on a bit, then give her some space and be normal, then turn her on a bit again going even further, then normal, over and over and over, keep going further and further until she can't take it and you two are all up on each other, escalate with both the vibe and the physical rapport at the same time, when she is compliant out with you, just get her back to your place, when she is at your house, she wants to have sex, it's just a question of how patient can you be, and how much tension can you create to turn her on

if you are getting lmr she either is too anxious and doesn't trust you enough, or she is not turned on enough, so just try not to pressure her, make it as easy as possible, be persistent in trying over and over again, but don't push way too hard, instead keep turning her on then backing off, then turning her on, then backing off, over and over until she is soaking

there could be more too it then that, but judging by your post from your point of view, she gives you the logistics and is definitely interested, just a matter of resistance towards escalation and getting that compliance up as well as having her trust you

Then I guess I am needy to some extent. But, of course, whatever the girl rejection never is completely painless (rejection of any kind).

Can you suggest something specific for turning her on verbally? I'm not particularly good at talking about that, as I said I'm new to the game. This is one area I really need to improve in. I usually escalate physically while keeping the conversation going and taking her silent consent.

ok, before the logistics are good for sex, you don't want to have her like super wet or anything, save the foreplay type shit for isolation with good logistics, but on the date, you can...

use sexual innuendos

so for example, one time going to the movies, pay for the movie, date tries to buy nachos, I refuse, tells me she has to at least get something, so I pick a hotdog, later on we are watching shitty movie, she tries to feed me a nacho, and she says, ''c'mon eat the damn nachos'', so I move my head to the side and put my half eaten hot dog in her face and say, ''shut up and just put my wiener in your mouth''

stupid jokes like that, ''wow you're hot, so sex now?, or sex later?''

test her out, more social and flirty at first, get more and more serious and horny as you progress

when it is blunt and it seems like it needs a reaction, or she cringes at something, cut the thread immediately and move on for a re-frame, so for example

wow, you're hot, so sex now?, or sex later?... ahh must be later, anyways blah blah blah (back to normal like you don't care if she answers or has a reaction)

keep this shit between you and her and out of reach of other ears,

also, you can sexually qualify her, just don't go too far if you know you don't have the logistics, you can bait her with qualifiers starting with things like

''what is your favorite place to be kissed besides your lips?''
''where is the craziest place you have ever had sex?''
''what was your first time like?''

if you are sort of nervous about talking about sex with a girl, you can qualify her into qualifying her, just say, ''you mind if I ask you a personal question'' (this is gay, but if you are nervous, and need some training wheels)

you give and take with this, let her open you up to and don't be super tight in controlling the frame, let her get some back from you so she doesn't feel like she is being grilled on her sexuality while you stay safe, you can use this opportunity to frame yourself as sexually non judgmental, and you can frame sex as no big deal, just simply qualifying her and encouraging her answers is any easy way to accomplish both, as well as your frame your stories/answers

there is plenty you can do with the qualification, just don't get to crazy until you have the logistics, you can also say things that project future events to her so that she anticipates what would happen,

''if we weren't here right now, I would be kissing you very softly against a wall''
''you don't know how bad I want to do things to you''
''god you are turning me on soo bad, if we weren't here I'd find it hard to control myself''

you can get more into it, the more she is ok with it, you ''escalate'' the amount of compliance it takes from her, and if she seems uncomfortable, you just back off, be normal for a bit, tone it down, and start building up again all the way until you are telling her about how you want to fuck her bent over your couch, or you could eat her pussy for hours, or what ever you are comfortable with, what ever suites your style, push and pull, don't keep going and going and going, and don't just sit there not moving forward at all, give her some, then give her some space, let her reciprocate and take it in

you can also just make her feel sexy and more comfortable so that she can feel more ''trust'' that you admire her, rather then having her feel insecure, just basic shit like

''you look so sexy''
''you smell nice''
''holy shit nice bum, those pants really show off your butt, you will have to put some clothes on that's distracting'' (calibrate with takeaways for takeaways also, if she seems insecure from you going too far with some sort of dis-qualifer, just re-qualify her ''on second thought, I like being distracted'' you can do this without even thinking, qualification/dis-qualification is the fun part of being verbal)

all the time keep the vibe swaying back and forth, sexual to social and back and fourth, over and over, too much intent = creepy, not enough = dry vagina, she either should feel it with your vibe (eye contact, being close, touching, sexual voice tone), or it should be blatantly overt, either way get horny and flirt

you don't even have to verbally escalate if that is not your thing, you can turn a girl on almost purely with touch if that is your thing, but sometimes it can be hard to close the distance, there are certainly more and less tactful and more evasive ways, but personally, seeing if a girl can handle the pressure is part of the fun

also, you obviously have to be able to lead, when a situation is heating up too much, go for the kill, I know sometimes it can be nerve wrecking as fuck to risk blowing a date to lead a girl home, but sometimes you won't see her again if you don't, you just never know unless you test the compliance (you did this already, continue to do it when the chance arises, also finding her logistics early can help you with this too), if it is dieing down too much, move her to a different spot that isn't boring, you want to have her interested in her time with you and getting horny, pay attention to how she is acting, what she is saying, what she is doing, how her body language is, how open and receptive to what you are doing she is, unreceptive, take it back down a notch or two, receptive, crack it up a notch or two

just know that if you take things too far and she really gets wet and you are basically beginning foreplay, you best try to get the logistics to close, because if you even make out with her or it becomes blatantly obvious you are trying to fuck her, the chances of her flaking all of a sudden become higher when she has a chance to dry up and logically think of what might happen if she meets you again

if she is flaking in a pattern, just hail mary her, or let her chase before you get at her again, in both cases, forget about her and move on, let her come to you

also, after reading this shit, plz don't just memorize the words, word for word, when you do that, you will come off incongruent, take the idea and run with it, rather then the specifics, be present with her and say what you feel, don't censor yourself, be horny yourself and horny thoughts that lead to words should just naturally come to your head, but for fucks sakes pay attention to her and how she is feeling, if you are getting all these signs she is closed off and uncomfortable, escalating further will only make her more uncomfortable and she will get turned off rather then turned on, so remember, don't memorize shit unless you are willing to practice it first at least a few times, you must find what is congruent with you, do what you feel in the moment and pay attention to her, feel her out and keep moving forward