i still a newbie at pua even though i known about it for a while. but i mainly use this forum to us as a diary and to look back at my progress. so i post lays reports but only so i can look back later on and reliaze how much i improved

I completely agree. Unlike most people I have come across in the community, I have never struggled with confidence. Maybe is was how I was raised, or the perceptions I hold about reality. Either way, through out my life I have always had an abundance of confidence. I couldn't imagine what it would be like to walk through life lacking it for even a day. Which for me anyway, solidifies it's importance in leading a happy life. I am not trying to say that I am great at everything I attempt. Of course I have my shortcomings. Only that I know, with a little patience, knowledge, work, and practice that everything is achievable for me. I have always told people that the key to life is having a big dick, women included. Only because "Having a big dick" is a metaphor for confidence. Which I always make sure to explain to them. Once you find that one thing you are great at, and gain that confidence, no one can take it away from you. Since no one can take it away, the only thing left for it to do is to grow into other parts of your life. enough of my random musings. Great post. It's something I think the community needed to hear.

This is refreshingly honest.

However you do have realize getting laid is primal. Its the natural result of a deep relationship between a man and a woman. When you have a good set, its ripe for sex. So Does that mean when you do have good set you choose to not have sex? Or perhaps you are not feeling the desire to have sex because you might have a sticking point in seduction.

Dont get me wrong I like your insight. I dont obsess over sex. Thats how i sarge, I open because i want to. I escalate because she is fun. I build rapport with her because it feels right to do so. I flirt with her because as i get tO know her my primal Instinct as a man is to go to 'in'nout' with her. This desire of mine gets reciprocated with her flirting back. At some point you sex is the natural thing to happen.

At some point sex is the natural thing to happen.

Pretty much spot on most of things. However, i have a lot of sex and the difference for me is that it doesnt decrease my enjoyment of sex. Its actually increasing.

I agree. I dont think you should obsess about sex WHEN you are not in the act of it, BUT if your dick is in her pussy, i dont really think about "hey personality sucks i wont fuck her well." Otherwise you wont really enjoy sex. Sex is steamy hot release of all the bullshit. You are a man and she is a woman. Dick pussy. Fuck. Thats it.

I do agree with the fact that its about how attractive one's self is, improving our confidence but you shouldnt forget that we are at this because we like fucking beautiful women.

^^This guys is the attitude I was referring to.

Phangan I appreciate you proving my point. There was no reason for this mention, you even mentioning means you missed the point of the entire article. Your belief that I don't/can't get laid is your belief. I'm not here to qualify for you or anyone else.

Where it doesn't own your entire life. You Phangan go out every night to get laid, your life seems to revolve around getting laid, why? Does your life really need to be about getting laid? Make no mistake if you go out 7 nights a week to get laid you need to get laid, otherwise it wouldn't be a big deal to get laid. You'd be able to pick up tail where ever and you wouldn't need to stress it, you need it like oxygen, going out every night gets stale for me, I have fun but it loses some of it's appeal.

Just by saying this you qualify yourself.

1) This post is 100% stolen from Tylers RSD videos.

2) But to answer your question - I go out almost every night mainly because I love dancing and meeting new people, and I've been traveling for the past 1.5 years. I enjoy dancing as much as I enjoy sex with young beautiful girls I'm also more or less retired so I have tons of time to do other shit I enjoy doing, like learning Spanish and Russian, Salsa, flying planes, and write screenplays, to name just a few of my many hobbies.

If I could I'd fucking LIVE in a night club and be out 24/7. Being out in a club, dancing, meeting people, being social... it's just what I enjoy doing, like some other guy enjoys playing golf or whatever. And as I like dancing, I'd prefer not to dance alone but with some hot girl, and it's nice at the end of the night to be able to pull her home too

Look, what I did in September, in Ayia Napa, was insane. I was on a "mission" to perfect my dance-floor game and tried pulling every single night. I'm working now on posts about it and I think I got my counting wrong, I think it was 8 girls in 11 nights out, not 8 in 12. I agree that it's "unnecessary" but after 18 months of "learning game" and "paying my dues" I wanted to see how far I could take it.

For me it really is a GAME, I wanted to see how ridiculous I could get, and it was tons of fun. Now I'm resting in Israel and don't go out at all, for a week now, and I'm starting to feel the itch again... It's just a period. Soon I'm flying to Cuba to learn Salsa for a month, then I'm planning on going to Milan and learn how to sketch (yes, SKETCH, pencil on paper) because it's something I feel like doing. It's just a period. That's how Ayia Napa was. I mix game, the little work that I do have to do, and my hobbies. What's most important is that I'm a freaking happy person and that's what really counts.

Kapish?

This whole Ayia Napa month... and before that London.... ridiculous ridiculous ridiculous. Only now when the dust settled I realize how crazy it was and how much fun I had. Whenever I think about Cyprus or London a huge smiles spreads on my face. I did in these two months shit that most people don't do in a lifetime.

Anyway......

Peace and Love

VoV

The Post-PUA Life



A topic that came up from a number of different guys in the feedback section of the reader survey was to cover how to transition back into “civilian life” after one is happy with his skill-set with women. I’ve already covered extensively the deleterious effects of obsessing about women well beyond the point that you need to. So how does one make the journey back? The transition back to “being normal” again was slow and painful for me, particularly because I do this as a job, but I eventually got there.

The best way to think about this process is in terms of 1) personal goals and 2) where you’re choosing to receive your validation.

Back when we started this entire journey and committed ourselves to this path, an aspect of that dedication was to choose to objectify and validate ourselves through our social lives and through women. To improve at anything, you must quantify and measure it. To quantify and measure something you must objectify it. And when you objectify a part of your emotional/social life, you’re effectively disconnecting yourself emotionally from people in a certain way.

You see this objectification and quantification in all sorts of forms: rating women, measuring difficulty of approaches, amount of girls in a set, lay counts, number closes, etc. There’s nothing morally wrong with this, and it’s particularly useful for an inexperienced guy to keep tabs on because he’s able to measure his improvement.

But two things happen when you get good with women. The first is that the numbers and scores begin to mean less and less to you. When you’re a virgin, laying two girls over a six-month period is a huge deal. When you’ve been with 55 women, laying two more in a week is cool, but not exactly an identity-shifting occasion. Your first so-called “10″ will give you the biggest high for a week straight. Your fifth may just annoy you because she always has bad breath and complains a lot.

Getting good with women offers diminishing returns. The difference between being excellent at picking up women and being very good is usually not worth that extra effort; whereas the difference between being decent and being absolutely awful definitely is worth the effort.

The second side-effect of getting very good with women is that over an extended period of time, objectifying your social life will make you miserable. I found this out the hard way, as a lot of other guys in the PUA community did as well. Truth be told, we’re not meant to objectify and measure our emotional relationships and friendships. It’s disastrous for our emotional well-being. I still see this as an epidemic in that entire scene. You’ll see honest-to-god, serious threads discussing the reconnaissance opportunities presented by female-friendships and analyzing their group of friends in terms of social proof. You’ll see posts from guys who research charity organizations in order to calculate the best female/male ratio. It’s sickening. It’s very, very, VERY important for every guy getting into this stuff to remember to let go and simply enjoy the company of people every now and then. Not everything needs to be a measuring stick or a new process to learn.

With that said, here’s my advice to those guys who would like to “return to normal” after they’ve achieved a lot of their goals:

First, stop putting all pressure on yourself to perform or to achieve. This will probably be by far the hardest part. It took me years to undo myself from this, to get to the point where I could go sit in a bar and have a beer and see a hot girl and not feel the need to approach her. Passing up lays is another big one that fucked with my head for a long time. I would be in a situation where I knew I could probably sleep with a girl, but I knew it would take hours and a lot of time and effort. Or I could hang out with my friend and go home and get a good night’s sleep. Choosing the mundane option of going home and getting some sleep was really bizarre for me at first.

But ceasing to pressure yourself to pick up constantly will slowly remove it as a major source of validation for you. At first, it will feel strange and you’ll feel guilty or lazy for not pushing yourself in social situations. But eventually, you’ll reach a point where going out with some old friends and watching a ball game, having some beers, this will feel just as valuable and satisfying to you as picking up that blond on the other side of the bar would. It frees you up to enjoy the social/emotional aspects of your life you were so busy quantifying before.

This, in turn, will reattach your emotional involvement in your social life. You’ll begin to see just as much value, if not more, in just hanging out with some good friends and having fun, than you would in approaching a bunch of women and making out with them.

The beautiful thing about this, is that there’s nothing ever stopping you from pursuing women again. Your ability with women will always be in your back pocket. You can go out with no intention to meet a girl, hang out with your friends, and then suddenly see one and decide to approach her. There’s no pressure either way. And the best part? If she rejects you, you really and truly will not care. That’s no longer your purpose, that’s no longer where you derive your validation.

I recommend also stopping reading most or all pick up related forums and websites. This seems to be more significant for some guys more than others. Some still enjoy reading about the subject and learning more and thinking about social dynamics, whereas others really feel like they need to mentally tear themselves away completely to feel free to act however they choose.

And finally, I recommend shifting your focus away from banging tons of women to actually finding one you really enjoy a lot and dating her. Being a player and juggling four girls is awesome and everything, but it requires a lot of time, effort and energy, and in the long-run it’s not exactly a healthy way to live… both physically and emotionally.

Probably the biggest shift I’ve noticed since not really putting any pressure on myself to go out and improve anymore is that one night stands and casual sex seems to interest me less and less. It makes sense. Fast lays and casual sex are easy things to quantify and measure. Relationships and dating someone involve emotions, icky feelings and subjective situations where success can’t be defined. When you value improvement then the easy quick lays make sense. When you value general life well-being and emotional fulfillment, relationships make more sense.

This also plays back into the validation thing again. You’re eliminating your need to objectify that area of your life and you’re opening yourself to more emotional interactions. Think of it as shifting the hunt to quality instead of quantity. Emotional connections are always far more enjoyable and enriching than purely sexual ones.

These shifts, both psychologically and physically, will free up your motivation and energy to pursue other areas of your life. It’s typical that guys who leave the PUA scene generally see improvements in other areas of their lives: work, friends, hobbies, etc. Ironically, a lot of guys also experience an INCREASE in their results when they leave the scene for this reason: they have a healthier and more well-rounded lifestyle, AND they’re not nearly as outcome-dependent as they used to be.

When exactly you’re ready to leave will always be a personal question left up to you. It’s a question of diminishing returns. There is always room for improvement in every one of us. And hey, just because pick up isn’t your main focus doesn’t mean you won’t continue to still improve. But at some point you have to look at your life as a whole and make a reasonable judgment. Unfortunately, focusing very hard on this stuff over the period of years has major negative side-effects. When those side-effects begin to out-weigh the improvements you’re making, then it’s time to move on.

Poetic this what we privately were talking about, this is by Mark Manson again: