So if no one saw my other post about a girl who flaked on me with sunstroke last Wednesday she initiated a reschedule for Friday (yesterday).

I told her it was a surprise and we went to a theme park. She was really excited when we got there. No hug or nothing like most of me female friends would have done if they were excited.

Started the date the same level as the first one ended. Kiss on cheek and a hug. So I didn't go backwards in a sense but haven't moved forwards

Anyway I used kino so much all day (arm around her, touching arm/leg, playful punching). Conversation was great. Almost 13 hours together and not one awkward silence. Made her laugh etc etc. But not once did she respond to the kino by touching me back. She seems comfortable with me touching her but just doesn't respond back.

Thing is I'm not an afc and I've kissed/f-closed woman before. This one just seems like work though and is giving no signs. Thinking about it I could have just been alpha and challenged her when playing crazy golf saying something like if i won you'd have to kiss me or something. She doesn't drink alcohol so I feel the resistance is higher than someone else if I was dating. There is something there. We constantly tease each other and flirt.

When I dropped her home afterwards she didn't invite me in just gave me a quick hug and kiss on the cheek and said thanks bye and we should do it again sometime (generic stuff). It was as if she knew I was going to go in for a kiss and she got nervous. There must have been some interest for her to agree to a second date. She tells me personal stuff about being bullied in school (maybe she is self concious becuase of this so is scared of commiting) and family issues etc. I normally like to kiss on the first date so this is a bit out of the ordinary for me. Have I screwed it up?

How should I handle this. Is there any hope? Should I just wait for her to contact me and take it from there?

Thanks for any advice

As a side note we met on POF. don't know if that's any relevance.

Do YOU think you screwed? If so, why?

I guess it's the whole stigma 'must kiss on first date' really. To go the second without a kiss surely I've blown it for any chance of a third date. Unless she is just shy to move forward as she gives no opportunity (like rushing out of the car last night).

I like to progress so to end it with just another kiss on the cheek. Not so sure.
We both get on and have great conversation but the fact she doesn't respond with any touching hmmm. And even though the conversation would turn sexual on times she'd end up talking about her dog or cat again within a short while

I mean there has to be some interest there for her to agree to a second date but I just don't know anymore.

The reason why I think she rushed out of the car is maybe because she felt pressured. you know that, "kissing on the end of the date" is kind of kliché. If you go out again try building some sexual tension, do the triangular gaze, then try moving in making it look like you're going to kiss her but then stop, and continue your conversation or whatever. It's like "hey im going to kiss, no im not" kind of tease. after you do it a couple of times she'll be desperate for a kiss and the *close will be as easy as anything

Best of luck

The Don

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Cowards die many times before their deaths;
The valiant never taste of death but once.
/J. Caesar by W. Shakespeare

In case you didn't see my response to your other thread, I said she flaked because of her pms, not sunstroke, and the fact that she didn't respond to your kino at all just confirms my suspicions that she's still in her cycle and refuses to let the interaction turn sexual. Don't get discouraged. Just keep gaming her, she'll come around.
Cheers

Stop being a pussy and make your intentions clear.

You are headed straight for the friendzone if you don't act. In fact you could already be in it. You should have been the man and made your intention to kiss clear. "Damn, I can't stop thinking about kissing you right now." Then gauge her reaction. If it's good go for it.

You're not AFC? You acted like one. Your caring too much about how she feels. Of course she is going to feel pressured. She is supposed to! Stop thinking that her feeling pressured or nervous is a bad thing, it's actually a good thing. It's natural, especially if she's attracted but doesn't initiate.

You must go for it. Did you expect her to just kiss you? You said she doesn't touch you back, or doesn't initiate touching. That means you must lead the physical aspect. She was probably expecting it and you didn't deliver.

Take her out again and go for it then.

Cheers for all the advice.
Will more than likely give her a call tomorrow. I only ever text so will be a bit of a change from the norm as she's probably just expecting a text again.

Just hope I haven't screwed it up. I know full well what I have to do if I'm lucky enough to get a third date. I guess it's just about getting one now.

I didn't expect her to kiss me no but it was hard to try and get any solid eye contact or any hint signal anything that I was good to go. I know I should just go for it but it just didn't seem right last night at all.

Also know I shouldn't have waited till the end too The day was going well and I knew if she pulled away the vibe would have been ruined (acted afc here).

Maybe she's just taking it slow herself. I don't believe everyone is the same. I know people who are now married who didn't kiss until their fifth or even sixth date. I don't intend on leaving it that long but it's that hope I'm clinging to that hopefully it's not too late ha

Just need to man up, sexually escalate and go for it! It boils down to the fact she didn't return any kino with me. If she had I would have gone for the kiss 100% hmmm.

Hey
Didn't want to start a new thread so thought I'd just post here as you then have the backstory above.

So she seemed a little cold after this date. She made first contact by sending a video on fb about something silly we talked about (she also always brings up things in text that we talked about ages ago. IOI by showing that she's been listening?). I sent her a text later on and she's warmed up again. We seem to be back to the playful teasing where we left off.

I've somehow managed to get a third date this week. So on the one hand she must hold somewhat of an interest in me to go on 3 dates and text/fb often through the day replying instantly to my texts. But my other half is saying why does she show no signs for me to go ahead with a kiss? also she still goes on POF (Where we met) so she must still be looking and chatting to other guys. I am too, got a date next monday with someone else but that's another story ha.

I feel if I don't kiss her on this 3rd date then it's over. We're only going for coffee (That won't take long so I'm going to mention maybe hit an art gallery or museum on the day once we've met). When is the best time to go in for a kiss and how do I escalate towards it? I feel if I'm holding both hands and can get eye contact I can go in for it but I've never been in that position with her.

People say half way through the date is the best time? Seems unnatural for me

Any advice much appreciated

KISS her. again, KISS her.
even if she is "passive", KISS her.
I remember this passive shy girl who felt pressure and everything, and seemed a tough call. after I went for the kiss, next thing you know, I was sucking her tits (first date!)

I like to k-close by the second date. third date is borderline. anything after that is friend-zone.
unfortunately it is not another story. you are seeing other people and so is she. my GF and I were doing the same before becoming exclusive.
why she ended up choosing me over the competitor? the competitor was an AFC who drove all the way from South Bay to SF to see her, never went physical, paid for dinner, and just chatted about random stuff. a "nice guy". I had her drive from SF to South Bay, I cooked her dinner on the first date, and we ended up spending the night together (she was on her period so I could not f-close, but we went very very physical that night), and I fucked her on the second date.
you probably have a competitor, or two. it does not matter, as long as you are the best option she will end up in your arms and in your bed. don't be Mr. Nice Guy or in a few weeks some other dude will laugh at your AFC-ness while banging the chick.
no randomly change plans on her - drive her to some random fancy funny place. she will love you for it.
escalate, triangular gaze, and then when you feel like it, lock eyes. her looks will give you green light. if so, kiss.
if not, say you look anxious. why? she will deny it or say she does not know. try to be helpful. "how can I help you relax.. let's see".. act like you're thinking for a while. then say "found it. just close your eyes for a sec". have her close her eyes. kiss.

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nice guys don't get laid
"It's disrespectful not to bang them when they sleepover." (Hellhound)

All great advice in here so far so no need to add anything and complicate things!

Just providing some moral support, every little helps.

She is definitely there for the taking bro, make her yours

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TruthLoveLaugh

Cheers for all the replies and advice.

So had the third date. She paid for the coffees. Went back to hers to watch some films. Started off slow but I escalated the kino. From just our bodies touching on the bed to arm around her, playing with hands and hair, touching her leg etc.

She was cool with it all but I still pussied out from kissing her there and then. I couldn't get eye contact from how we were both lying next to each other on the bed.
When I was about to leave, I think she got nervous again and got up from where we were lying and started playing with the cat. I had a pussy way out (becuase there was no way I was NOT going to kiss her on the 3rd date ha) and I planted a seed earlier saying 'I have a surprise for you later, remind me'. She reminded me, said close your eyes and hold out your hands. Went in for a kiss. She enjoyed it and re-initiated a second herself.

I left, she said she had a great time and was really glad to see me again and we organized to go on a double date with her friend soon. Not sure how I feel about double dates but hey ho. Anyway she text me this morning but since then she hasn't replied after about 2 texts back and forth (normally replies instantly). Not sure if I'm reading in to it too much or whether she is genuinely cold.

Any ideas on how to progress from here. Should I just chat for a bit then invite her out again some place?

Thing is she told me some things last night about how she used to have Bulemia and that's why she's on anti anxiety meds. Yeah yeah I know most guys would say do a runner now but she's awesome. I'm sure she wouldn't tell anyone she wasn't comfortable with that. It seems she says a little more about herself each time we meet which is good I guess from a relationship point of view.

Just unsure really how to respond with her from here. Thanks for any advice.

How to respond? Be non-reactive to her coldness. You still have a great time. It shouldn't phase you.

Just go with the flow for now. Don't force anything. You don't NEED her. You want her, yes, but you don't have to have her. This is the mentality.

Watch out that she's not friendzoning you. She's comfortable with you. Great. But you MUST go sexual. Kissing is still comfort. Kissing doesn't mean shit a lot of the times. Not that your kiss was for nothing. It was awesome you went for it and she reciprocated. But sexuality is where it's truly at.

You "organized a double date with her friend soon." Is there a specific date? A time a place?

Just be the fun you, you don't need her, but you're awesome to be with. You have a great time with or without her. And either she'll come around or she won't.

Just like anything you need to build it up! You build up sex with foreplay, you build up a relationship by dating first, you built up a date by communicating, so what do you do with a kiss? Build it up!

How this is done? There are many ways. Invent your own, or look up ways. But when I say build up, I mean create a situation so it would be WRONG to NOT kiss, rather than wrong TO kiss. So talk about kissing ("on a scale of 1 to 10, how good you are at kissing") or something else. Kino, so touch her shoulder when you talk (all natural not weird), kiss her neck, why does it have to be so formal and be on the lips? Things like that, I'm sure there's loads of better ways, but the important thing is your attitude towards it.

Cheers Tr@veler.

At the moment it's for Monday. Don't know what we're doing yet becuase the girl I'm dating doesn't drink alcohol and is a veggie

It just feels like I'm loosing her, It's NOT oneitis, Ive had that before and know what it feels like. It's more a 'I've put somewhat of an effort in to meeting up with her and it just feels like it's starting to fizzle out even though we kissed'. She's really hard to read too. What would I like from this? Maybe it's a relationship I'm looking for. I mean we did both find each other on a dating site after all and her needs were a relationship too. Any way I can bring this in to the conversation when we're alone about finding out where we both stand?

Thanks Zelda some good points I'll be taking on board.

Anyone else have any ways I can sexual escalate in a smooth way? This whole dating thing is new to me. Normally I meet girls at bars and clubs where we're both way drunk and it's usually a one night stand thing.

Can you even sexually escalate on a double date? To me it feels like a wasted date opportunity. Am I looking at it wrong?

Thanks

2 dates, one kiss, and you wanna have the relationship talk?
DO NOT.
first thing, fuck this girl.
second thing, keep fucking this girl.
third thing, she will come to you and say she can't do this anymore and needs a commitment.

_________________
nice guys don't get laid
"It's disrespectful not to bang them when they sleepover." (Hellhound)