LOL! 85% of the girl you talk to? I don't even think the best pick up artist gets 85% percent of the girls he opens. Were talking about a another human. Hell, best player in baseball is only averaging like .300 % and all he has to do is hit the ball.

And if your using Mystery Method, you got no game. Is newbie shit to help guide them and help them learn step by step which is great. After practice, you should already know what your doing.

Warped, you are one confusing dude, one moment I think damn this guy knows his shit, he is a PUA. Then you make a statement like this ^^^^ You post on another thread about quality men, and how women complain about the lack of them, you post on other threads about creating a great image, dress well, work out, smell nice...all stuff that is completely accurate, the better image you create the more successful you will be. Then on another thread you pin point what the typical DTF women is in a night club. I've seen a photo of you and yes you are one good looking dude, so with all the post you have made about style, posture and image. I have an image of you being a "quality man" A smooth operator. All that being said, you still see 85% as delusional?

Are you telling me WARPED! that you see pick up as just a numbers game? Are you telling me you worked that hard on creating an image of a quality man, yet you are still approaching random women, are you telling me you haven't created enough of an image to have women approach you? Are you telling me you haven't the ability to pre-screen and identify the women that are showing interest in you before you approach? To think 85% of approachable women are not attainable is to tell me you are not a true player, and tells me you are still just randomly approaching women, without getting any reads. A true pick up artist does have an incredibly high ratio, but not just because he is smooth and looks the part, but because he can identify the appropriate women. A true pick up artist takes pride in having an extremely high ratio. Just because the woman show's interest initially does not mean she is 100% DTF but that's where the game comes in. It's still up to a person to talk her panties off, but if you are working the appropriate women, it sure is a hell of a lot easier.

You mock the OP and call him delusional, but I'll tell you this much, it is his desire to become an artist rather then a pick up monkey, that will one day make him a true player.

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Seduce their mind and the rest will follow.

How many of the best pick up artists do you know. You "LOL" like you know better, pick up is not baseball...and yes we are talking about another human being, one that will tell you a million things with her body language alone. Even if a woman acts as though she is not interested, her body and unconscious mind will tell you different if she is in fact interested.

I have bitten my tongue for too long, I thought I'd sit back and see if I could actually relate to the general mentality of this forum, but truthfully, it's a bunch of haters, or people seeking validation. I see post of guy's preaching their skills and how to do this and that, yet at the beginning of the thread they will say shit like I have been a PUA for 3 yrs WTF! You bash a guy for actually wanting to be a pick up artist rather then a fucking pick up monkey. If you guys wanna run around and approach every woman you see, then yes expect a lot of rejection. If you want to frequent a club and hit on every hot chick you see, then go ahead, but dont expect to pick up any of them.

Lets say you play the numbers game and on average, 2 out of 10 women you can pick up. Now lets say, you approach the first 8 that you can't get. Do you honestly think your state of mind is gonna be the same as if you found the 2 that are down first? Of course not, no matter how much confidence you have you are going to be affected. Not only that, if the 2 women that you can get have been watching you try to pick up the other 8, there's a great chance they will no longer be interested. And trust me, if a woman has interest in you, you can sure as hell believe she has been watching you.

When i first came to this forum, i talked about how i take a good amount of time to pre-screen women and look for women that show interest before I approach and I got mocked and laughed at, in my mind i was like wtf? OK i'll shut up, maybe these people know another method, maybe they can show something I don't already know. Maybe there is something to all this PUA mental masterbation.

A good majority of this forum are full of shit, and need to open their eyes. It's not rocket science, it's interacting with another human being, but if you are playing the numbers game rather then having a true passion for women and the art of pick up, you are never gonna get anywhere, sure you may get laid a lot, but if you are not learning from your seductions, learning about women, about their desires and needs, learning to identify the obtainable women, learning to identify the woman that are showing interest as opposed to the ones that have zero interest, then you will never evolve and you will be stuck in a revolving door.

If you don't believe me, ask a dude like Poeticlyskuac, ask him what his pick up ratio is, I guarantee you it's extremely high. Why? Because he is learning the most important things about pick up. How to correctly interpret IOI's and body language in general.

@ Tygynasty, dude I know you think I am full of shit and a virgin, and that's your choice. But stick to your belief, don't listen to these haters. 80+ % is obtainable
If you believe enough in yourself, and take the appropriate steps in bettering your image, and learning about women and how to identify the right ones, instead of this PUA BS. It will all come together. Your mentality is in the right place, keep the passion for the art and it will all come together. Don't be a pick up monkey like half this forum appears to be.

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Seduce their mind and the rest will follow.

just to make it clear, are you saying that in order to get better people skills that you need to do MM? surely going natural would help your skills further so you arent relying on canned material?
it seems a bit like you are looking at an either/or mentality. id say there is definitely a middle ground between the two, and going a more natural way can make it easier to go straight into a more physical, sexual interaction, rather than having to go through all the stages of MM. This way both your social skills improve, and you cut out the shit when you actually want to get laid!

Man. Am I tired of this old story.

Every once in a while there is a "battle of the methods". Normally it is Mystery method against "naturals".

Naturals: Mystery method users are so scary and scripted. It is weird.
Mystery method: You guys arent naturals, you are just stupid.

There, that is what the discussion is gonna sound like.

The worst thing a PUA can do is to get stuck in one method and basically swear allegiance to it. Which is what a lot of PUAs do. Defining themselves based on what method they like best. Frankly, all of the methods do the same thing. They get you through the problems you have, the barriers you have to break in order to go where you need to be. The only difference is that people have different problems and need different kind of help. Thats why we have different methods. In the end, the best thing you can do is to just stop following a method and replace it with your own version.

Telling people to change methods just because you yourself prefer another method just shows that you have a problem understanding other people and put yourself in their shoes.

Pissing all over the methods others prefer also means disrespecting their background and their own personal problems. It isnt nice.

This forum could be so awesome if people would start to see similarities instead of differences. We could all benefit from listening to people who have a different point of view, this gets you out of your little bubble and broadens your horizons. Plus the ones we learn the most from are people who disagree with us and not people who agree with everything we say.

So swallow your pride and stop this "Im right and everybody else are wrong" attitude.

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I'm not trying to be a dick Ezo, but you're being a Pick Up Snob in my opinion.

bbardot: you just reminded me about porn

Yeah right on top! A true player knows that rejection doesnt exist. Stop saying: a true pick up artist doesnt get rejected. Bro the best PUA's in the world get rejected over and over again. What makes them get laid? It's their ability to not take it seriously. It's their ability to know that it's normal for someone to say no to you and that things dont go according to plan. There are different styles and methods but doing over and over again indirect..as your cousin which went super indirect..well your basically telling yourself over and over again that you're not a man. You're not a man will not invent stories and search for excuses like "my phone died take a picture and send it to me" to get a women's number. A man is unapologetic for going after what he wants and he moves forward wathever the outcome is. He is unaffected by any outcome because he knows he's an attractive male from the bottom of his heart. He doesnt need validation when he approaches because he doesnt see rejection. Not seeking validation and approval will make girls not reject you so often and then you start to have game. But you need to remove this mindset of: a pua gets 90% of girls..that's advertising and bullshit bro wake up to the real world. I used to think that too at the beginning..if you practice you'll see this is all mental masturbation..

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Greatness is never borned

This is not BS it is possible, this is what any good player can reach with experience and know how, if you have the appropriate looks, style, game. It is possible. In a club setting it is very possible. If you are cold approaching every woman you want, then yes it's virtually impossible to have that ratio, but if you are trained enough in identifying the women that have genuine interest and you can properly take them through the gauntlet of seduction, then fuck ya, its completely possible.

It takes time to get to this point as does anything in life, but to assume this isn't possible is to be blind. Pick up is an art, seduction is a craft, if you have the right willing woman, you can close every time. This forum needs to start putting more emphasis on how to identify the right woman. I am not saying all men can reach that 90% level, but if you have the proper looks, style, game and attitude. It is very possible.

If you can't believe it is possible, it never will be.


By believing passionately in something that still does not exist, we create it. The nonexistent is whatever we have not sufficiently desired.-- Nikos Kazantzakis

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Seduce their mind and the rest will follow.

You're right about the numbers game taking the "artist" out of PUA. However, I think it has a purpose in developing higher level skills. The only way you learn is by practice in a realtime, unpredictable field. Even if your social skills are crap, they must be used and won't get any better reading material or reciting lines in front of a mirror.

If a guy approached 100 girls with no game, he's gunna learn something. Whether he knows it or not. He may enhance his development by analyzing the interactions better and adjusting his strategy, but most of what he's doing is still approaching. Even the pros who can boast an 85% success rate likely got to that skill level after years of grunt work.

Genius is 1% inspiration and 99% persperation.
-Thomas Edison

OP i think you are looking at game as minimizing rejection, you want to minimize your rejection rate , it is hurtful and painful, filling you with bad emotions.

The emphasize should be placed on playing to win, not playing to not lose.

You can say what you want but at the end of the day it is a numbers game. Learning pick up only improves your odds but it won't guarantee anything. As you said your self you are dealing with another human being one we can't control to have a favorable outcome. Its kinda like learning a card game like poker. If you want to get good you learn the game but you can't control what cards you are given or what cards are put on the table.

Poker is the perfect analogy for my point. It's not hard to learn the game, but it still takes a lot of effort to become good at it. You can't control your cards or the other players, but get good enough at reading your opponent, and you can sure as hell make the right play, almost every time. You don't need good cards to be a good poker player all you need to do is read the other players, get good enough at that, and you'll know what cards they hold every time.

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Seduce their mind and the rest will follow.

It's a numbers game if you have no game.

I think Warped or Kasabi or some other theory type cat wrote something along the lines of, "if you approach 10 girls, 4 will dislike you, 2 will like you and 4 will be on the fence". Those 6 are where good game comes in. I have found this to be very true. I'm not down for scouting last resort DTF girls when I could be picking up the 6 I actually wanna meet.

BTW MM is gay:) But use whatever works for you!

90% succes ratio?..................happy Easter guys,eat and sleep a lot

PUA is both a game of skill and a numbers game. A 30% conversion rate is awesome. You'll be doing better than Warren Buffet.

Approach/Opening = 100 Tries
Number Closes out of 100 = 30 Numbers
Kiss Closes out of 30 = 10 HBs
Fuck Closes out of 10 = 3 HBs = WIN

Does Warren Buffet have skill? You bet.

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Approach. Open. Escalate. Isolate

Here are my two essential rules on texting that will save you tons of time and money:

general-questions/topic137931.html

Damn! I generate activity! Ezo - Send some of the revenue.you're making off me to my SPAM.

@SexAddict
You send that nicely Fam! Damn, maybe I was wrong about you. Forgive me for flaming you. You know your stuff.

All these people saying its a numbers game still. Tsk tsk. Just setting self limiting beliefs. One day ill be able to get that 85% success rate. I got a shit load of learning to do, but ill get there.

And just a side note. Ive been doing the numbers game and I'm pretty much sick of getting rejected 85% of the time. Furthest I've gotten with it is k-close. Big whoop. I should use the numbers game game as a warm up only. Tbh I haven't even used MM in years! Reason I haven't used it yet is because just very recently did I conclude the shit that I'm doing now is stupid and I need tochange to something I've had success with. (Technically I used it yesterday once while leaving class. And I already saw a difference)