Hi, Im new here. I came on this site to learn more about the art of pickup, because it is very interesting to me as a social psychology major. But has the art of pickup ever been truly put to the test by a scientist? I mean, has someone ever done a study in which some males approached women without knowledge of any pickup material and had some men approach women WITH knowledge of pickup and then interviewed the women to see which group of men they found more attractive? Of course this hypothetical study is not one that would work; there would need to be a physically measurable dependent variable, like perhaps women's heart rate or something like that, but im sure you all get the idea. anyway if someone did something like this it would be revolutionary and new; it would prove without a doubt that there are psychological methods to making other human beings become attracted to you, and that would change the way the world viewed the art of pickup. when I think of pickup, I think of a sketchy website that is trying to sell me something. I have faith that it is real, but im not totally convinced yet, and a study like this would convince me and many others.

There has been testing done, like how you describe, but to answer your question, no. Pickup will not ever be scientifically proven as it's outside the realms of science. However, certain aspects, such as the effects of dominance, eye-contact, etc, are provable.

no man, it's all fake.

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Oh, well can you show me the testing that was done? Thanks!

There's your answer right there!!

It's impossible to do an experiment. If you know anything about experimental design, you'll know that it's impossible. Case studies are possible though.

You said they should compare "before PUA knowledge" and "after PUA knowledge" but to that I turn to Defy's answer! All of the knowledge, all of the gurus, are all fake. At least in the sense that reading their book will probably make you worse with girls the next time you go out.

But if you spend years talking to girls every chance you get, by the end, don't you think you'll be pretty good at talking to girls? Plenty of people are trying to sell you something, but they can't sell hard work and experience, so you never need to buy any of it.

How can 'art' be scientifically proven? Your question contradicts itself.

Is there a science to seducing women? Absolutley. There is psychology and biology or my personal favourite which I believe encompasses both, the science of evolution.

If you are interested in this I suggest that you read a book called 'the selfish' gene by Richard Dawkins. He is not a 'PUA' but he is one of the worlds foremost experts on evolution and his book puts it into terms that most people can understand.

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I believe there is science behind it. Exactly why there guys who get women on regular basis and there are guys who get no women at all.

Oh, how can you say its all fake and then be a part of this forum? And I dont think its fake actually, even though I dont know anything about it yet, because like someone else said, some people get a lot of women all the time and some never do, so its not chance. It may appear to seem like chance though, like poker, but the same thing goes for poker-- how can the same group of people always end up at the final table of the yearly poker tournament every time? Its not chance, so it must be learnable and real.

Hey, thanks for the book suggestion, it looks really interesting, and I agree that there is a science to this pickup thing that can (but is VERY hard to be) proven. I am going to try to think of a study that will prove the art of pickup is real, and then post it here when I do. I am taking a research and statistics course right now so that will help!

Why don't they try that with brain surgery too, get one guy that didn't go to medical school to learn about the brain and one guy who did.. Then lets see who was the most effective surgeon.

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I obviously don't believe that talking to women is fake. I obviously believe that there are learnable tactics to talking to women.

All the ads above me, that say "Sleep with 10s by following these 3 secrets!" "Learn to pick up women in 7 minutes a day!" whatever bullshit they use to tell you there's an "easy way" is ALL fake. Doesn't mean the material they're selling is fake. The "easy way" is fake.

Whether or not a guy has access to "PUA knowledge" he will succeed or fail by his own efforts. The knowledge itself has little to do with that fact. Many more who come to this site fail than the number who succeed.

I've posted a few threads on the forums highlighting some pickup principles which were based on psychological research.
Here's one: the-tao-of-waitersincrease-your-tips-an ... highlight=

This one: congruency-what-kind-of-pua-are-you-vt1 ... highlight=

and this one: the-halo-effect-do-looks-have-to-matter ... highlight=

Can I suggest you read "59 seconds" by prof. Richard Wiseman, and "Get anyone to do anything" by David J. Lieberman.
Both have chapters on attraction referencing to psychological studies, and the principles they detail are central to a lot of pickup schools.

Oh ok, so you are saying that effort is more important than pick up knowledge? I would deffinitley agree and dont understand how people will read an entire book on something that teaches them to apply something to their life (pickup) and then not do anything. its like wasted knowledge. I am not particularly incredible with women, but I would not consider myself to be bad with them, Ive had a lot of girlfriends and sexual endouvers throughout my life. Im more interested in the social aspect of pickup and want to see if it can be applied to human beings in general and not just male-female courtship. But I feel that there must be certain, specific tactics that can get people to like you, simply for the fact that human beings do indeed become attracted to others under specific conditions. In other words its not just random attraction

Obviously it's not random. The fact that this forum exists has proved that.

And yes, there are certain tactics. But realize that there is an infinite number of them. Every person has a unique way of relating to people, of making people value them. Trying to apply a cookie cutter model is foolish, many of my strategies are unconscious and indefinable. And if they could be replicated by another person, they would not be as well adapted for who he is as a person, and they wouldn't be as successful.

You are searching for concreteness but there is very little concreteness to be found here.

wow, those were so interesting, exactly what I was looking for! I will have to look up some more on my psychINFO college database! the first link was really kool, i totally see how it relates to pick up. I think that this type of psychology is very new though, isnt it? I mean, ten years from now, psychologists will probably be looking back on us and laugh at how crazy and controversial all this attraction stuff was. Im going to try really hard to think about a test where I could prove a correlation between womens attraction and pick up artist material, but I will have to start by giving those two variables objectable definitions which will be VERY hard...