This is a long post, and it would be grateful to have an expert share their knowledge.

I've been seeing this girl since July. I thought of her as only a friend, until I took her out on a feel dates, then I realized holy crap, I want her to be my GF.

I always knew she had liked me, we met in a mutual friend's car back in early 2011, and on the way home from a dance she put her yawned and put her arms around my shoulder. I said denied it (I was a TOTAL afc back then)

Fast forward to July, we saw each other at another dance, I joked around for a bit, I told her I received 12 numbers that night from girls (this is true, Mormon girls = easy game), I got her number and said that's number 13 and left. I would always initiate the text convo, but I did it to be friendly, nothing else.

One night my mates and I went out to go bowling. And we decided to want to invite different people to come with us. I invited the mormon girl. She came in a heartbeat, to hang with me (i established no rapport over text messaging, and my mates are complete strangers to her).

She had a great personality, and she got along well with everyone, she was outgoing and what not. She asked for a ride, I gave her a ride home and I used my dumb and dumber quote. "I hate good byes... SHH, just go!" she replied "We'll see each other again!!"

I went to my friends house later that night to stay at his place, and they were all like dude, you should take her on a date. She's totally into you. I was a bit hesitant but in the end I ended taking her out on a date. And that's when I fell for her.

I knew 100% for sure she liked me when we went out to the waterfalls for a triple date. (Her older sister and her date, her bestfriend and her date) When she dove into the water, her sister and best friend were like "isn't she hot? she can be one of your playboy bunnies"

We ended going out on more dates, we shared our first kiss together (I'm a senior, she's a junior) But on one date where we went bowling, I said loser has to kiss the other person. After 3-4 frames where I took the lead she dropped the bomb. "I'm not looking for a boyfriend." Okay I take it as a shittest and I totally ignored it. On the way back I said you'll never get out of the friendzone unless you know the lyrics to hey jude. She said "what??" and I ignored.

We go out on more dates, she takes me to cheese cake factory and pays for the meal. We were in a nice scenic spot where i should have easily kissed her. But that whole I don't want a boyfriend thing is fucking with my mind. I don't end up kissing her.

Another date we went on, I tried to have a talk about it. I didn't know what to say and it was awkward. (Can't believe I listened to my friends about talking...)
She went into a little more depth... saying that her sisters all regretted dating at her age, her mom would like for her to wait another year, blah blah blah.

So this kind of shocks me a bit, I continue game, we hold hands every single time we're out, cuddle, kino, flirt, everything but kiss.

I asked her to homecoming, and she said yes. We had a great time, heavy kino, but still no kiss, my mind is being fucked. I'm being a pussy or some shit.

Today I hung out with her while doing my photography project. I tried to kiss her about 10 times today, it all failed. But trying I meant I would slow down the tempo, make heavy eye contact, and talk slowly. But I never really went in for it... either I waited to long with the sexual tension, or she saw the kiss coming and would walk away. I gave her a hug and went home.

I've been gaming other girls too, but I'm getting tired of constantly gaming. I just want to lay back, relax, and settle for a girlfriend. Which this is the one that I want out of the 30+ girls I have talked to in the past 4 months.

I am a catholic, and she is a VERY conservative mormon. Maybe our religion has something to do with commitment in an LTR? I have VERY high value in their mormon community, more value than MOST of the mormon members. I'm not lying when I say this.

She's into me 100%, I just need that last piece of advice to pull the trigger.

What do I do from here? Do I talk it out? Kino even more? I don't want to move on, I know what I want. Now any advice to help me achieve what I want would be appreciated.

In my opinion that seems like the friend-zone, I had a girl exactly like this, except she wasn't Mormon She seemed into me, I started escalating got to the point of her having her top off...but then she ended up saying she didn't want to hook up because she wanted to date someone first...instant turn off, so I took her for a few dates and then for some reason I just couldn't kiss her, didn't feel like the timing was right, then after a few weeks i decided to stop being a loser and just kiss her again, but she turned away and said no...at this point I was really starting to like her and we had a lot of fun together and was really interested in having a relationship with her...but I had gotten into the friends zone.


So in this case my advice is you should kino more, go for a kiss close! And sorry to say this, if you cant pull it off, you are pretty much stuck in the friends-zone and your just a good friend to cuddle with...like I said I have experienced this and it is very frustrating especially since the girl flirted with me so much...

I know I am not an expert but I went through pretty much the exact thing as you are going through, I hope my advice helps a bit...and if you cant pull off a kiss close from where you are now it seems like a lost cause

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Some people are destined for greatness, while others won't ever make it.-BigJolly

I consider myself both an expert with respect to Game and Mormon women. The short answer here is......EJECT! EJECT! EJECT!

She is CLASSIC Mormon....the Triple dating, the line in the sand - nothing beyond preliminary kino...etc.

The reason she and her sister are giving you value is because, in their minds, they have a shot AT CONVERTING YOU TO BEING LDS (The Mormons call themselves LDS Latter Day Saints...not Mormon).

To prove my point, if you have a discussion regarding religion with this girl and if you were to say, "There is no way I would ever consider leaving the Catholic Church"....she and her whole family will turn on you in a heartbeat. They won't be mean or anything...they will just withdraw from you and all of their "nice-ness" and flirting and everything else will cease.

The LDS religion is EXTREMELY tribal. They keep to themselves and their whole religious way of doing things is geared towards overlapping their social circles completely within their religious circles. The ONLY time they branch out is when they see a potential target to draw into their world.

LDS girls are taught from infancy that they should get married in their late teens or early 20's. They are taught that size matters when it comes to family size. I can pretty much guarantee you that unless she is a Jack Mormon (the LDS version of a fallen away Catholic) she will keep things with you at arm's length...she will keep flirting (practicing for the LDS boys she will want to woo who have returned from their 2 year mission) but she will NOT go any further.

Here are some signs of devotion to the LDS way of life

1) doesn't drink coffee or tea
2) dresses VERY modestly
3) No alcohol
4) No tobacco
5) VERY active in LDS Church (not only on Sundays but serving as a "sister" in some role within the local Stake (Stakes are like a Catholic Parish)


Again, I am not saying the LDS Church is bad or anything. All I am saying is that if you are not planning on converting and she is devout, you are COMPLETELY Wasting your time trying to escalate.

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Atomicglow

I understand both of your posts. But I doubt I'm in the friend zone. Like I said we hold hands and what not and flirt a lot. She even tries to impress me. But I really should k close or else I'll get put there. So yeah thanks for that piece.

And atomic I totally agree with you. Mormons try to suck you into their community. I know all the community leaders, bishops, brothers, sisters, but not once have they ever talked to me about their religion. It's like they already know I'm not going to convert. BUT they talk to my other friends to try to convert. Her parents are extremely nice to me, they've never asked about my religion or faith, we just talk and they're great convos.

This girl is devout, she doesn't dress very moderate, but she doesn't dress slutty. She doesn't drink tea/coffee, but drinks soda, doesn't drink alcohol. She even went against her own faith to hang out with me one night. Sundays she's suppose to hang with her family, but she invited me over and was like "i feel very weird, I've never done this before." Then we shared our first kiss.

I have a friend who had an LTR with a mormon girl for three years now. He converted to LDS this past summer and now they're getting married.

If she won't date me because I'm not mormon, there's no way I'm going to convert for her. But if I have an LTR with her or any mormon for this particular matter, and we want to get married. There's a great chance I will convert.

I'm not a devout catholic.

You are not in the friend zone.

LDS culture is a fascinating phenomenon, and I am intrigued to see how Game can be applied to it effectively. Their standards of behavior are radically different than those in common discussion in the PUA community. A kiss is a big deal for most of them, especially the more conservative ones.

Hanging out with you on a Sunday is not a violation of religious beliefs, but rather her family's "house rules," for lack of a better term, as they pertain to what they will and will not do on Sundays.

The "dating at her age" thing is also part of religious council given in the church. They are advised not to date seriously until they are in their late-teens so that they do not limit their social encounters too early on by spending time with only one or two other people--hence her Mom's apprehension, her anxiety, and her siblings' regret.

What you will need to remember is that integrity, honesty, and morality are highly-valued among them. If you demonstrate that you are an upstanding young man, her parents will probably not object to you dating her for now. In fact, they might even be happy that she is dating someone like you.

But the second you push things too far or betray their trust, it will come crashing down pretty fast.

Treat her like a lady, be respectful--which you seem to be doing so far, but I cannot emphasize enough--and you should have pretty clear sailing.

Feel free to ask any other questions you have.

Necoing because after reading all this, I'm itching to know how this played out! I'm kind of entering a similar situation, and wanting to learn how to pickup LDS girls.