right.

now, when i say "bad",

i don't mean bad by society's standards,

i mean "spiritually wrong or harmful".

_________________
what dr. house brings to medicine, i bring to everyday life (an extreme dose of cynicism), don't listen to the curmudgeon!

And who decides whats spiritually wrong? Do you think those guys in saudi arabia or Utha have any moral / spiritual problem being married to three chicks where it is the norm?

If you are not lying, not doing anything behind peoples back, not manipulating or taking advantage of anybody, not making false promises, not lead them on.... then all you are doing is "giving your gift" to a few girls rather than to just one. There is nothing spiritually wrong with it. I think it's beautiful.

Aren't you a great guy Mack? Why wouldn't you want to share yourself with a few girls? Even if it's just occasionally, or just once or twice.

I'm never with a girl I don't like, a girl I don't have a connection with. I would never bang a girl just to score. No girl is going to break my cars window. I get "thank you letters" from EVERY girl I've been with, thanking me for the time I spent with them and for all the things that I taught them.

HOWEVER.... I'll tell you a story:

Two nights ago I went out alone and met this cute German chick. We hardly talked we started makingout almost immediately, and we couldn't stop for five hours, until the club closed at 6 AM. We really liked each other and connected deeply in some spiritual / physical glorious way. Her friend didn't let her leave without her so I couldn't pull her to my room... but I didn't care much, it was a very special night.

Anyway, last night I went out alone again and I couldn't bring myself to open any sets. I thought about that girl from the night before and how "special" it was and that if I would tonight again meet someone it would degrade last nights experience. I don't want to "saturate" myself with such nights... they will cease to be special. So I went back home to sleep.


You can have long "special" connection / relationship with a few girls simultaneously... I know it is possible because I've done it. On the other hand, you need to know what your borders are, at what point you stop enjoying it and it becomes "spiritually wrong" or damaging as you call it. It all depends on the circumstances... the girls, the relationships you have with them, your internal state and inner game.


I feel that I have a lot to give, I feel that I have a lot to learn, that I want to share my life with a few girls. At least for the time being. There is nothing spiritually wrong with that.....

peace

i just can't give "all" of myself to "multiple people".

i could easily give "part" of myself to "multiple people".

it all depends on how much of yourself you believe you give in a romantic relationship.

if you give all of yourself to in a romantic relationship, there is nothing left to share with other people.

it's just my opinion. it's just what feels right to me.

it certainly doesn't mean i believe in happy endings.

i would have no problem fucking multiple women. but look at the word "polyamoury". it means "love many" or "love multiple". i simply don't work that way.

i only have one mom.

i only have one best friend.

i only have one dog.

i could only have one woman that i actually LOVED.

fucking?

well, i could fuck dozens.

_________________
what dr. house brings to medicine, i bring to everyday life (an extreme dose of cynicism), don't listen to the curmudgeon!

it's a lesson from buddhism...

love what you have...

learn to appreciate something and love something before getting more..

if i look to the sky during sunset in autumn i feel the same love i feel for a woman i love...

fucking doesn't mean anything for me.. i've fucked many woman and it didn't got me anywhere... i most cases i fucked woman only to find out a few weeks later they are sick manipulative bitches.

fucking and sex didn't got me anywhere in the long run...if im going to die im not thinking about how much pussy i got... i would think about if i lived my life well and how i helped people taking things to a next level.

im not saying you should value relationships.. monogomous or poly whatever... im just saying you need to find out for yourself. everything can be enlightement...

_________________
AK-47...When you absolutely positively have to kill every fucking orc in the room
questions about herbal medicine here-vp582526.html#582526

First I want to thank you for your post about why you're monogamous Mack, that's the kind of stuff that I was hoping to get people talking about with this thread. I'll have to write a proper response to that one later when I've got more free time to do it properly!

As far as what you said here goes though I just wanted to say that it is exactly the definition of what the authors of The Ethical Slut call "A Starvation Society" mindset. Basically any time you allow yourself to believe that there is only so much of something to go around; that it is a limited resource that can be used up and there won't be any left for anyone else. Now I want to say that I'm not at all a religious person, yet I am highly spiritual and I believe they said that this is exactly what the bible was trying to teach in the story of Jesus and the bread and the fish (hopefully you know that one, if not google is your friend for sure, it's worth knowing imho).

Love isn't something that comes in 10lb bags that you can run out of. You never run out of love it you don't want to. There's always more love to share and receive. I have several best friends, I have several mothers, I have several pets (none of them that I own, yet they sure act like my pets thus I love them all as mine), I have several lovers who all know me very deeply and intimately and there is always more of me for them and anyone else to love too. I promise you that I will never tell anyone that I already love to many people and can't love them too. I may have to tell them that I don't have the time to spend with them privately sometimes, yet I will still love them, just as I know they love me even if they need to spend time with someone else when I would like them to be spending it with me. Time is one of the only things I can think of that I would say you CAN run out of and can't make more of, everything else we can make/find more.

_________________
"The 'Brick Walls' are there to allow you to prove how badly you want something!" ~ Randy Pausch

~ Rye

Yes and I will add to that... that the idea that ONE person can fulfill ALL our needs (all our emotional needs, sexual needs, etc) and the idea that we can fulfill all the needs of another person - is ridiculous. One person cannot possibly give us everything and we cannot possibly be "enough" for someone.

I was listening to a TWO HOURS Steve Pavlina podcast about relationships on his website. He recorded it with his wife, for two hours they explain how they work on their relationship, how much they LOOOOOVEEEE each other, how they can't have enough from each other, how they GROW together, open communication etc etc etc..... these guys just GOT IT RIGHT. So OPEN and UNDERSTANDING and LOVING. They sound in the recording like two 16 years old who just made out for the first time, it's sickening. When it was recorded they were together for 15 years with two daughters.

I finish listening to it and then read his Wikipedia entry - THEY GOT DIVORCED SIX MONTHS AFTER THE PODCAST WAS RECORDED.

FUCK THIS SHIT.

IT'S ALL A LIE, CAN'T YOU SEE ????

For every happy couple that stays together for 50 years I will show you 5000000 of people who either divorced or stay together but HATE each other and do so only out of fear / social conditioning etc.

WAKE UP

phangan,

the goal of loving someone isn't always to have "every one of your needs met".

that could be considered selfish.

there are a lot of things that i would like to have in life.

millions of dollars, a yacht, a perfect body, power, a great job, a house on the beach...

there are so many things that i would like and never have...

and yet i will be happy.

actually, for the most part, i am happy.

so, why would i not be happy with one woman?

does EVERY desire in life have to be fulfilled for happiness?

i don't think so.

i don't think that the definition of happiness is "getting everything you want".

i've never gotten everything i wanted, and i'm a fairly happy person.

and again, your comment tends to assume that some people are not naturally fulfilled by ONE person.

i remind you, yet again, people are different.

not everyone thinks like you.

not everyone thinks like me.

_________________
what dr. house brings to medicine, i bring to everyday life (an extreme dose of cynicism), don't listen to the curmudgeon!

thanks for the response.

rye lee,

if you give everyone of your friends the same piece of jewelry as a gift,

is it just as special?

_________________
what dr. house brings to medicine, i bring to everyday life (an extreme dose of cynicism), don't listen to the curmudgeon!

Mack,

You WANT a Yacht. You WANT a million dollars. You WANT power.

You NEED sexual variety (or why would you want to fuck many women as you said?)
You NEED freedom.
You NEED a range of emotional connections.
You NEED the excitement of the chase and novelty.

Do you see the difference?

I'll accept that you're saying that YOU are monogamous... but again I think this is the result of social conditioning. The RAGE in my posts is the result of my disappointment from being lied to all my life. I'm probably the most romantic person to ever post on these forums. I told you what I did for my ex - I relocated to a different country, then moved with her to another country for her studies, I was her manager (she's an artist) and spent 50% of my time managing her career, turning her from NOTHING to an INTERNATIONAL STAR. She was not working and did not make a PENNY for 6 years while I was financing her. I purchased for her something that she needed for her career for 40,000 EURO when I was 28 !!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you know a lot of people who do such things ?!?!!

Lied to
Lied to
Lied to

All I got in return was unhappiness and frustration, from her side and my side. And in the end? Fucking behind my back.

Not her fault. She was lied to too. We are all lied to. It's not meant to work.

Oh well.

I just wish I could have my 20's back.

fuck

Everybody wants to believe in "love". But then everybody also knows that "sometimes it doesn't work" and the couple needs to separate... and "move on and look for someone else".

Only few realize that it is not MEANT to work. NEVER. If it ever works then it's pure luck or when the two people can somehow repress their sexual needs and their life somehow supports the relationship - like many many friends, spending vacations separately, being together just 3-4 days a week.... the occasional fling behind the back... then, maybe, a couple can pull somehow 30-40-50 years together.

Or, of course, there is the "lets bury ourselves with 18 hours work a day and three children", which most people do, and then they are too busy to notice how unhappy they are.............. of course most people are anyway not connected to their feelings, lack the self confidence to confront their own fears... their partners. So they repress everything....

If you don't know what I'm talking about... just wait. Wait until you're in a long relationship. You'll have a GF and then after 1 or 2 years one day you will wake up and my posts will become crystal clear. You will feel like you want to throw up... it will hit you like a brick wall.

you need:

- food
- water
- shelter

you don't need:

- sexual VARIETY

you may want it, but you don't need it. again, i harken back to other things that i want. i'm sorry to tell you, that sexual variety is not a "need". you can survive, and even thrive, without it.

i'm not anti-polyamourous. i'm just defending your attack on monogamy as being wrong, or misdirected, or a fluke. not everybody is the same.

marriage?

take a closer look at marriage statistics:

they say that 50% fail, or even more...

but look at the truth behind the statistics.

many of those "failed" marriages are the second, third, and fourth marriages of people who couldn't make it work the first time. these artificially inflate the numbers. the actual truth is that 60% of people who get married will remain so successfully.

i'm also sorry to hear that you were hurt by an immature, selfish woman.

that is a reason not to love anyone, not just to love multiple people, lol.

again, we are talking about "love".

poly-amorous = "love many"

does "love" mean "fuck" now in society? lol

it's not called "fucky-amorous"

i simply refuse to believe that the nuclear family does not work. it has proven time and time again, that the nuclear (monogamous and faithful) family is the best version for our children, for our health, for our economy, and for our society.

if we want to run around like savages fucking everyone, we will revert to savages. just like those people living "the high life" back in 10,000 BC. lol.

_________________
what dr. house brings to medicine, i bring to everyday life (an extreme dose of cynicism), don't listen to the curmudgeon!

Yes, you do NEED sexual variety. Not in a every day level but your lower brains crave for it... deny your lower brains of their needs and you are asking for trouble. Why do you think so many people cheat? men and women? Just for "fun"?

It's a biological directive.

And by the way - in a monogamous family, if the parents die, or one of the partners die, the children are at a very high risk... right?

in "nature" 5000 years ago, when everybody was raising all the children together, if a parent died nothing would happen. On a survival level it makes MUCH MORE SENSE that an entire tribe will raise the children together.

That's why the womans body is DESIGNED to CONCEAL the identity of the father. It is extremely hard to know when the woman is ovulating... women want sex throughout their cycle. That is not the case with MOST animals by the way....

"fucking around day and night - always" is actually a much more HUMAN characteristic than an "animalistic" one. Most "animals" don't have / want / need as much sex as we do.

I'm not attacking monogamy man... I'm just looking facts straight in the eyes without flinching.

OK so "only" 40% divorce... or 30%.... do you know how HARD it is to divorce? With children and the house, and peoples fear to stay alone?

How many of the people who do not get divorced would if they could? How many of them are UNHAPPY? How many of them wish their PARTNERS WERE DEAD?

50%? 60%? 75%?

sex doesn't kill you

poly doesn't have to kill you

mono doesn't have to kill you

stupid descisions do kill you..

50 % of marriages fail ?

i see 80 % of the people making stupid descisions...

if a marriage doesn't work it doesn't mean marriage doesn't work

it means 2 stupid people just made a stupid descision...

how many guys marry their first girlfriends...

do you think marrying will end you AFCishness ?

NO

Everything is self-interest ... they want to marry their first or second girlfriend because they think they have a business deal to end their loneliness permanently...

in fact .. when they break up.. he/they would say '' i would never see this coming ''

95 % of the people say such thing... that's why there are so many stupid people... they only see what they want to see...

Descisions and consequenses are important...

they make a descision... but they don't see the consequences.. because they love her too much or she will make you forget in bed....

90 % of our species are still living 10.000 BC .... i think rye makes his concept work for him because he developed himself in a certain mature way...

truth is polymonogamous relationship don't work in general...

if you have dumb people, no concept will work .. they probably rape the whole concept out of self interest and stirr some war or another.

stupid people are the problem...

phangan ...

the rage of you post is not because you are dissapointed because you were being lied to all your life....

you let people lie to you...

you were being a idiot... like those other 95 % of the worldwide population

now you are waking up but you are still angry ... you are blaming them for lying to you... but it the end by blaming - you are only SPAM control. You sohuld blame yourself and learn from it... i see a guy swing from extreme left to extreme right.. maybe you should try to get middle ground ?

80 % of the people who hook up don't work out... if you are a rational person you should hook up with someone who is having more emotional intelligence...read some shit from Dr.paul .. KWLM.. he has wrote a book and website about it and his stuff does work.

nobody can lie to you .. you can only allow other people to lie to you.

_________________
AK-47...When you absolutely positively have to kill every fucking orc in the room
questions about herbal medicine here-vp582526.html#582526

So if the lack of something won't kill you - it is not a need. That's what you're saying .... sorry but not true. Living alone in the forest with no human contact won't kill you either But good luck trying it. I'll continue this post later my burger is ready.

lol you are just a angry guy.... you are way too emotional... you are being weak here. Instead of blaming people lying to you maybe you shouldn't give a shit and try to do something productive instead of wasting energy on being angry.

it's all in your head...

_________________
AK-47...When you absolutely positively have to kill every fucking orc in the room
questions about herbal medicine here-vp582526.html#582526

phangan,

this concept has been addressed by numerous philosophers, psychologists, and thinkers (far brighter than you or i) for decades, and even centuries...

some unanswered questions that you keep side-stepping:

1. why is it best to indulge one's reptile brain in certain instances and not others?

- for instance, why should i fuck unlimited numbers of women simultaneously (because my reptile brain says to) but not kill people (because my reptile brain says to)? can you answer that? why certain primal impulses should be indulged but not others?

2. is multi-fucking the same as multi-loving?

- again, you haven't even addressed any of the issues raised about what does love mean in the context of multiple partners, and what the difference is between banging multiple chicks and "being in love", aka-polyamorous? care to address this?

3. if the nuclear family is really defective, why then has society been documented and proven to progress BECAUSE of the nuclear family? this isn't something that i (or biggus, or countless others) have fabricated.

- it is well documented, that an orderly society fares best. you claimed what happens to a child in a nuclear family if the parents die? that is a moot point BECAUSE he/she is not the issue, the other 99 children in other families who do better are. society is not about the success or failure of one child, it is about the overreaching impact on everyone. any thoughts on this?

4. you claim that it is human nature to indulge one's primal mind and that it is CORRECT to do so?

- by what means or source of knowledge do you know that this is the case? any data to support that indulging one's primal thoughts is the best path? case studies? literature? or just your one bad relationship experience which emotionally clouds your judgment? i'm all ears...

it is also human nature to evolve, is it not?

doesn't nature evolve?

so perhaps humans were INTENDED to evolve (or progress to a higher being/self/existence) by stepping out of our primal monkey brains and being more intellectual, more spiritual, more intelligent, perhaps even more ... monogamous? no? not a possibility?

we know that humans evolve. right?

over the years, we have changed in the following ways:

- we are taller
- we are less hairy
- we are weaker
- we are more carnivorous
- we stopped foraging and started agriculture

but it is not possible that the move away from tribal orgies to monogamous single-family nuclear units was a step in evolution?

not even possible?

come on, buddy, if you are going to make such wide sweeping statements, you have GOT TO step up your game.

_________________
what dr. house brings to medicine, i bring to everyday life (an extreme dose of cynicism), don't listen to the curmudgeon!