I would like to get the opinion of guys with credible field experience, sorry keyboard jockie, nvm no i'm not.

When is persistence and plowing turn into neediness?
where is the balance, and when does it become to much and a turn off?

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Attraction isn't a choice, stop worrying about finding the right woman and start focusing on becoming the right man.

I'm always looking to sarge with new people...hit me up if you are in the Orange County/Los Angeles area.

Very good question. After some thought, I believe the best response is that it's all in how you act. When she turns you down at first/earlier on, do you blow it off as immaterial, or do you get upset. Looking like you really really want it versus taking it if it comes your way. Persistence is knowing what you want, and going to get it. Neediness is making a bigger deal out of something than it is, and becoming despondent when you don't get your way. Does that make sense?

I really don't know any other way to get rid of neediness and replace it with solid persistence, other than just going out and getting other girls. A lot of times, I think we start to accumulate what we want from a girl, and stick it all into one chick. This is where oneitis comes from. We think we "need" a particular girl because in our minds, we have equated this girl with what we ant. It's actually a form of settling. This does not mean that this girl you want is not completely worth it. But rather that you just have unrealistic expectations of her, and it's going to throw everybody off. Go out with other women, make out, have sex, whatever, and you should burn off a lot of this "neediness". In the end, you'll actually end up appreciating this girl more, but for who she is, rather than what you want. Weird, huh?

Hope this helps.

Hmm, maybe my usual mistake is that I never appreciate any girl for who she is Thank you for this post

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I'm the man!

If you are hitting on some gal because you are having fun and enjoying and she is enjoying the attention and enjoying the banter then it is all good.

If on the otherhand you are experiencing distress and discomfort over it and it is causing you more frustration and pain and it is causing her discomfort and irritation, then it has crossed the line.