I have always found bartenders attractive. Well mainly because they are serving and control your alchohol. But i am a regular at a bar near my house and this HB bartender has recently been employed. I engaged into a small chit chat with her and got to know her work at another bar ect. but how should i escalte form there. My Goal is phone Number close. What are some good ways to attract her. I understand hitting on her won work as she gets hit on 24/7 by older guys.

P.S I am 19 years of age and fairly in a good financial position to tip handsomely though i do hold it off.

Please give me some good Ideas for my next visit to that bar.

if you know that she gets hit on by many guys, you've got to stand out from them and be different if she's not going for them. as the other guys are being very direct, complimentary, you have to be indirect so that you would not be just any other guy just trying to get in her pants. to be indirect, ask her an opinion opener, something that you would value her opinion on and make her validate herself by justifying her opinion. chicks love to vocalize their opinions.

here are some notes on attraction, building rapport, and number closing which might be of interest to you. enjoy.

one thing you should know is when to tease (push pull technique, negging etc). they should only be used if ur target is a 7.5 or above (or the girls who think they are 7.5 or above whereas in actual fact they are not). if you were to tease a girl below that rating, you would end of hurting and insulting them. in exclaimer for using negging and teasing is that one should positively validate their target before they negatively validate them. the reason to do it in this way is because one must hook their target in order to get their attention. so after the positive validation (for a set who is +7.5) you negatively validate them (tease, push) in order to put yourself at a higher level than them because at the beginning they are higher than you. the main reason why it is good to use negging is to challenge the ego of a girl of high calibre which is something that a typical afc does not do. and by doing this, it shows that u r a man that has high standards and does not go for just any girl and this will make the girl more interested and it will compel her to work harder to gain your approval because you have showed disinterest in her, told her that she does not fit your standards (negative validation). girls always want the guys that is surrounded by women and guys which are difficult to get, its a challenge for women to go after those guys.

building rapport is a very interesting process. in order to build a great emotional connection one must choose to talk about things which have deep emotional content. it does not matter what the girl does or likes, you can connect with her even if you have dissimilar interests. as you know all occupations and hobbies are completely different in their complexity, principles and structure, but there is one thing which all of them have in common/share "EMOTIONS". one must be empathetic and show a girl that u understand why she chose to do that job or hobbie by expressing the emotions that one feels when doing that activity, it shows that you're really trying to get to know her, and she will think "wow this is a great guy to talk to, he's making an effort to understand me, but wait, i dont know anything about him" and this will compel her to ask you questions and u can freely express yourself how ever much u want as long as u express urself passionately and positively. all the men dont do this at all and do not understand how much empathy is a powerful force and openly allow themselves to be perceived to see a girl superficially. you can use the concept of 'rapport' to ur advantage as well.

in order for you to build greater rapport with her, get used to asking more open-ended questions e.g. "what have you been up to?" or "What did u get up to today?", my one: "What monkey business did u get up to today?". dont use questions like "wats up hun?", thats a closed-ended question which the girl would simply answer and she wont give u much material to work on in order to reach the hook point.

and connect on her answers in a positive way. dont be afraid to tease her as well. dont be afraid to create impact. when telling a girl about a situation that happened to u on that day or in the week, give more details about it, women love details. it is also good to read the local news paper, women are usually very aware what happens in the world, u should as well. u can get her point of view on something in the news (nothing to do with which celebrity had sex with who) e.g. political, environmental, sociological etc and then she would ask you what u think and you can manipulate the conversation which can lead anywhere u want.

another way u can have an "endless conversation" is the principle of "Question, statement, Question, statement, Q, S, Q, S etc". so u ask an open question, receive the answer, and then make a statement about the last thing she said in order to ask a deeper question. this process can go round in a circle, it can go on for ages.

after you have the girl attracted to you and built rapport, here's how to make sure that you can get a definite number close and afterwards ensure a date in the future.

the way to ask a girl out is by 'offering' not asking permission, never ask "Do you want to go out tonight?" or "will you go out with me?" or "so what time are you free tomorrow?". They are all questions which AFCs do. they make a guy sound needy, desperate, dependent on doing something with her.

so before offering a date, let her know how busy and sociable you are. girls want guys who are difficult to get. usually in rapport with girls, to make sure she does not flake on u after the first meeting, there's a pua principle called 'seeding'. this is when u in plant an invitation in the conversation with her but u havent actually invited her. for example, you could say that "im thinking of going to this really cool bar sometime next week which i heard about". now usually when a guy mentions to a girl about going to a bar, club or party that u know, the girl will always expects the guy to automatically invite her. but what you would do is just to mention the party or the bar and continue on the conversation. this will catch the girl off guard and the girl will be thinking "hey, this guy is pretty cool (depending on the attraction and rapport), but he has just mentioned this party but why is he not asking me out?". she will think this and will be more compelled and desperate for you to ask her and she realises that she needs to work in order to get the invitation. women want to go to things that are hard to get into, exclusive and even more if they are told they cant go. people always want to go to things when they have been told they cant go. sounds so forbiden and interesting.

dont be in the position to be waiting for a girl to call you, women are lazy or busy but definitely unreliable. you make the contact. but when u contact, dont sound like you are too eager to see her, bad sign to show that ur desperate. in between texting a girl, act like u dont care if she ever replies back. i know it sounds crazy, but it does not feel good waiting, checking ur phone every so often seeing if the girl replies. have the frame of mind that u dont care about a reply, then u will feel less anxious, and more focused on ur game.

Hope that i have helped. happy gaming dude

Mickey, quick question. You dated a lot of bartenders?

They aren't getting hit on all night. Guys will flirt with them a little, yeah, but they're not making any serious offers. A few guys going "you got a boyfriend?" or "what's your number?" after they've downed a few glasses of dutch courage don't count, so that's not really an excuse to play the long game in my opinion.

Most guys who make conversation with those girls just talk about BS and they don't actually take it anywhere. So what you're telling our friend here is, be one of those guys except pull the trigger when he feels comfortable that she "likes" him. When they have a "connection". Not saying it won't work but it really isn't necessary, and it's gonna be a problem cos he probably won't know when she "likes him enough" to ask for it. So it'll drag on and on. Also, that word... "like"... that doesn't equal "wants to jump in bed with". Try not to confuse the two. It's better than not making a move, period... but not much better.

Seriously, I've known guys to sit and talk to girls for 20 minutes at a time 3 or 4 times before asking for their number or even flirting with them properly... seriously, why?? So you can deal with her resistance pre-emptively? Cos I got news for ya, you have to deal with resistance nomatter how you play it. You can't just "build attraction and comfort and rapport" then boom you get her number and everything is smooth sailing. That's a fairy tale. It can happen, but any time it does happen you coulda just gone for it right away and built that connection lying in bed together after a few rounds of nookie... instead of across a bar. If you build a meaningful connection before you have sex, what you have most of the time is a friend. A number of girls have told me about "this guy", who they really liked at first but he just wouldn't shut the fuck up and make a move... and by the time he did, they weren't interested anymore. Or the guy who she really fancied from across the bar, then he came over and her heart was racing... then he just started talking about crap and got nervous, and the girl lost interest after just a few minutes.

Even if you're super confident with your indirect approach, it's the same story. Cos... if you were confident that you were gonna get her, then you wouldn't be talking about bullshit and trying to size her up before making your move. Am I making sense? Playing it safe is boring and predictable. Girls aren't getting hit on directly all the time, it's exactly the opposite... and the few guys who are direct with them, they're not persistent. They're like drive by's. So they don't count.

I personally think that being indirect is an insult to their intelligence. Even if it wasn't, you're still playing by their rules... and that means she feels she has the upper hand the whole time. You might think you're being "high value" and "being the prize", because you're not buying her shit and taking her out or acting needy... but in fact, this isn't the case. You're still playing it safe, doing what is expected of you in a proper and socially acceptable manner - you don't even realise that you're doing exactly what they expect you to do, and the fact that they know what you're after right from the start puts them in a position where they can have you if they want, and there is no rush. And all the time you spend not fucking them, you can do so many things to kill the attraction that's there and ruin your chances completely. I've seen it happen more times than I care to remember. They know what you want, and they also know that you're gonna be passive - so they can have you in their own time (if they choose to). That's not being a prize, that's being an option. A part-time one, at that.

If you only knew how many other guys she knows who are just like that... and she gets to choose the one she likes the best while you hang around and chase after her. You could be that guy, but are you? If not, being indirect and passive certainly isn't gonna move you up the ladder.

If the OP goes indirect with this chick to try and gauge her reactions, "build" shit up and try to secure a sure thing before he pulls the trigger he's gonna waste a lot of time and energy - he might also get too invested in her. None of those are good things; this is actually one of the ways oneitis happens. Yeah, they'll get along really well and have a good vibe going, but if it drags on for too long he's got a pretty good chance of getting friended. Or he'll get stuck in a rut and never make a move cos he doesn't wanna ruin the good thing he has going. Guys think they're being smooth and unique by flying under the radar cos "all the other guys are direct and it never works" but in reality what they're doing is the same as every other guy. Most guys aren't direct, and like I said... the ones who are, do it drive-by style without any real passion or effort.

I'm not completely hating on indirect approaches, don't get me wrong... but guys spend so much time trying to figure the girl out and building that special connection before they even get anywhere with her. If you wanna get to know the girl and do all that rapport crap, take her out or invite her over some night and do that. The vast majority of times you can't build that connection first, you just can't. It's a numbers game at the end of the day, if you put all that effort into every single girl you fancied you'd never have time for anything else in your life.

This is all just my opinion though. You don't have to agree with it, and you don't have to like it. I'm just putting it out there so the guy can make up his mind about what way he wants to go about things. I've had my own experiences over the years and my attitude is, you have nothing to lose by just going for it as long as you stick to your principles and use common sense. The only things you lose out on are drama, pointless bullshitting, analysis, and chasing round asking for advice for every new situation. It all just comes naturally.

Been a while since I had a good rant. I might not have made myself clear at times so if you're reading something there and thinking "what the hell are you talking about solomon" then fire away with any questions and I'll try to explain things better. I don't feel like proof reading.

So let me thisstraight.

A.Dont hit on her at all.

B. Ask her about her job, her hobbies, her scheduele outside herjob.

C,. I think that 1 - 10 number game wouldbe fun.

Now what would be some IOI's?

How long to wait before going in for a close?

Gah. Yes, do "hit on" her. Every other guy who talks to her is either forward (but too passive), or they talk about BS and never get to the point.

You have a reason for doing this. You wanna meet this girl one on one, either on a date or at your place. Right? You do not have to build comfort and attraction and rapport in your first interaction. I'm not saying it "doesn't work", but it's completely unnecessary and in some cases can even kill whatever she had for you to start with. All you have to do is show her you like her, you go after what you want and you're not a psycho.

Just go for it, don't take any of her resistance seriously and hang in there until she either gives you her number or makes it very clear that she isn't interested ie. tells you to fuck off, walks away etc. If you can't handle that kind of reaction then ok, read mystery method and learn how to play it safe. But this is the price you pay for not wasting your time and getting invested in a girl before you pull the trigger (which sucks even more in the long run and is why most guys become more direct over time).

When she gives you shit, don't think too hard about what to say. You don't need witty or smooth responses to everything she says. Sometimes a smile is all you need. Oh yeah, and the answer you think she wants to hear is wrong. So whatever you do, answer honestly. Never tell a woman what YOU THINK she wants to hear. What she wants to hear and what you think she wants are worlds apart.

Last thing I'll say is this... women have double standards, just like us. One man is persistent and it turns her on, another is needy and annoying. If she likes you, your persistence is a good thing. And if she doesn't, well you'll figure that out soon enough. And that means no more gaming her, no more chasing her around and no more thinking about the "what if". She's just one girl. There are plenty of them out there, some like you and some don't. Find the ones who do and have a good time with them, and forget the ones who don't. You can't fixate on any one girl, cos you don't know if she likes you or not yet and it makes you dependent on getting good reactions from her and playing it safe. There is no way to "make" a girl like you. You can increase your chances with the ones who do, but if a girl isn't interested then good luck. Be real and you'll be happy. You're worrying about this one chick when she could be married, have a boyfriend she'd never cheat on in a million years, a lesbian, or you're not her type. You don't even know yet and you're trying to write up a game plan. Make your play, find out and deal with it. Stop thinking and start doing. You'll feel pretty stupid if she just flat out says no or puts you in the friend zone after all this thinking and planning, so stop planning and just go with the flow.
No, no, yes. Her schedule is important cos that'll tell you when you can meet up. The rest is useless. If you wanna find out about her hobbies and all that jazz, you can do it when you meet her. I get baffled when guys try to get to know a girl really well before they ask her out, cos then what the hell are they gonna talk about when they go out? Yeah there's still plenty of stuff to talk about and they can have a bit of banter, but you get what I mean. The more you talk, the more chances you have to fuck it up... so you should keep the in depth talking and shit for when you're actually one on one. If she gets bored on a date you can say ok fuck it, my place. If she gets bored before you've even gotten her number? Forget about it.
I dunno what this 1-10 game is so I'll hold my tongue on that one. "Indicators of interest" though, not something I look for... I just assume she's into me and play it like that, if I'm wrong I'm wrong. Big deal. Cos when I'm right, shit moves 10 times as fast and it's a more fun experience for both of us... it's worth it. You can find a list of those things somewhere but don't be scanning her and trying to collect a certain number before you make a move like some chump. We're not robots.
See this is the problem. You're not thinking about what you want, you're thinking about what she wants. What she expects. What is appropriate in her eyes. And you're worrying about this shit cos you think you won't get anywhere if you don't play by her rules!! That's completely ass backwards. Not gonna go into a whole thing about that, but to make it easier for you, just ask for it when you have a reason to. Find out when she's off, tell her what you wanna do, if she's into the idea then whip out the phone. If she gives you a bit of resistance, which is more likely, whip it out anyway. You guys are trying to find a way to get the number so you can text her and ask her out, you're doing shit in the wrong order. Who the hell teaches this crap?

Closing notes... don't take any of her resistance seriously, cos if it was real she wouldn't still be talking to you. And don't play by her rules. As in, if she suggests she takes your number instead... don't do that. If you wanna cook a meal together in the house and she wants to go to a restaurant, fuck that shit. If you want her to come to your place and she says her place is easier... you can live with that. Just never do anything you don't wanna do cos you think it'll get you brownie points. Cos you're doing the exact opposite.