How is not being able to return another human's feelings a perfectly normal human position? In medieval texts, a maiden (virgin) is a person that is "worth" more than other people just because they have an intact hymen. Chief seems to support this barbarian position by saying a girl isn't even worth his time if she's a virgin. Bluntly, as a PUA I enjoy the intimacy of sex. When you say that virgins deserve special SPAM, when you elevate them above "regular" women, you are sending a message that women should not be having sex.

Just to demonstrate how patently ridiculous the logic in this post is, you're saying that if a girl admits that she's a virgin, you'll turn her away like Style saying she deserves a man that will appreciate her more. Okay, so if she goes out and screws the first available man (quite possible if the object of her affections totally rejects her sexual advances) and is no longer a virgin, THEN you'd pursue her? You make virginity sound like an evil curse (which for some men and women, it is).

Pick up DOES teach you not to appreciate women. It teaches you abundance mindset, it teaches you to be "fickle" as Chief says. Mystery, the Jesus of Pick Up was a man child that could not have an adult relationship, who didn't think of women beyond the pleasure they provide. Do you think that's a coincidence? The "good role models" you're talking about are probably posers that haven't been with a lot of women. You have to realize a lot of "MPUA's" are better at seducing desperate men than women. The FACT of economics is, the more you have of something, the less you will value it.

Sorry if I'm hard to follow, I know I'm right I just can't put it concisely. But anyway, the people that understand where I'm coming from are the ones who've probably already quit or maybe my results with pick up were totally unusual, so I'll give it a rest. Thanks for your time anyway.

The fact that you edited it out

Proof that you don't know how to read

Fin, I appreciate you taking the time here, but if you look at the posts I posted after what was quoted, you'll see I back pedaled on most of the points you take exception to. I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm not listening to you, I just don't want to retread old ground. You're a reasonable guy that doesn't need to make personal attacks to get his point across and I respect that. In regards to "objectifying human beings", it is really hard to make an analogy when talking about humans where you don't "objectify" them. "Her eyes were like sapphires". Making analogies is just another way of understanding something, it is hard to better understand something when your ONLY frame of reference is that object or PERSON in this case, if you want to be exacting. What I did is no different than stating that cat string theory works because like a cat, a female will lose interest when you simply give her what she wants instead of enticing her. That doesn't mean I think women are simple animals. It's a literary device, not LITERAL.

HAHAHA...... I own 6 V-cards....

If I cared about emotions of other people I wouldn't have a possibility to care about mine.

I know the best way out of this situation is to explain her the way she will feel and don't do big thing of it [...] And finally, if it's SHE who is a virgin, why am I the one who cares?

Okay Chief, you know exactly what I'm talking about. If you need to pretend you didn't go back and edit your post to save face because your internet persona is that important to you, so be it. But you know you did it and that's all that matters. I'll take pains to quote you in the future to avoid you taking cheap shots.

What is a PUA? Rather, what do PUAs do and what ethics do they (should they) follow?

What a PUA does: Seduce women
Ethics to follow: Leave her better than you found her

A PUA is experienced. He has been with multiple women. A virgin is inexperienced. She has been with no one else before. If a PUA has sex with a virgin, the PUA is her "first." He is very special and dear to her, but the PUA cannot possibly return the same sentiments. He can never see her in the same way she sees him. Does this sound fair?

Those who don't give a fuck about anyone but themselves would pay no heed to any concept of fairness in this matter, but the fact of the matter is that "Leave her better than you found her" is the PUA community's number 1 moral mantra. The saying can be interpreted in many ways, that's true, but seducing a virgin leaves too much room to do more harm than good as a PUA.

Admit it - we're fickle. Sooner or later, we're going to want to move onto the next woman. As pickup artists we're not going to be satisfied with enjoying just one work of art. Moving on is not going to be so easy for the girl who gave her virginity to you. And it's not just a matter of you being her first lover; it's also a matter of the fact that you're the first man who may have made her orgasm and released all that oxytocin in her system. She's never experienced that with anyone else before, and you have no idea what that feels like because we men don't get an oxytocin rush in response to orgasm. I can only assume from past experience that women experience a very deep level of attachment to their first lovers. Sure, some women may want to get rid of their virginities just for the sake of losing their virginities, and may have no initial desire to become attached to the first man they fuck, but their bodies always tell them something different from their conscious intentions. As PUAs we already know this.

It's a lot more trouble than it's worth.

What is a normal person? Well, that can really vary, but generally speaking I would say that a normal person is a serial monogamist, as in, they have LTRs... and they generally aren't too picky about their girlfriends. They "settle" a lot.

I would say that a "normal person" would more often be better qualified for taking a girl's virginity because they do not possess the conscious intention of seducing a plethora of women just to gain exp and level up.

PUAs are players. We play for fun. More often than not, this shit isn't just a game for virgin girls. It's some serious shit. I don't want to take someone else's serious shit and trivialize it for my own selfish physical desires. That's fucked up.

There are plenty of sexually experienced women who view sex as something you can have with no strings attached, or whatever the hell you're looking for as a PUA. Virgins have no idea what the fuck they're doing. Leave the children alone and play on your level.