"You wouldnt expect a man to tell a target that he prefers blow jobs as his sexual preference in an opener, thus, you need not tell your target your preference is lady lovin'  "

actually I think having the girl know your into girls but saying a woman isn't your type is a great neg. I talked about this with another bi girl and we noticed that often friends who are sure to be totally straight and not bi-curious will still be curious what you're type is or be fishing for compliments and wanting to know if they are your type and sometimes even get jealous or upset if they feel they aren't the type of woman you like. They want the attention!
Maybe make it less harsh, like "don't worry, I only date blonds/ brunettes " or whatever and make it more playful? not sure...

I'm writing this both in the general section and the lesbian thread, cos I guess these are more general questions:

I have a date with a cute & fun bi girl this WE, I'm visiting her town and she's showing me around (bad, cos I can't really lead, but other setting wasn't really possible)

now here's the trickys:

1. this girl has issues and problems and I know the rule is don't talk negative and the last time I saw her (event, not date) that went well - but on the other hand, if I decide I want to close with her in one way or another, I need to know how she's doing psychologically/ dealing with the issues she told me about when we first met - how do I balance this?

2. I read a first date shouldn't be too long or it might get boring - thing is her town is quite a bit away so I don't really want to take the train down there several times to build comfort - how long do you think the date should be?

3. her parents are really religious (she's 17, legal age 16 here) so I don't think we'll go to her place. And it's a small town and I'm bit concerned how things will go if aquaintances of hers see us and ask about me

so yeah, perfect first date settings

any advice (besides the don't date girls with issues, since I've made up my mind, I wanna give it a try)

that's precisely my problem...i'm not easily suspect-able. many people see me as a typical woman child, young and innocent, which in a certain way i am, everyone has an innocent side, but people rarely even believe i'm into women.

too look more adult i dress smarter, very european style, try acting classier, yet being warm and re-assuring with women. i live in a very straight (yet gay-friendly environment), with men i never had problems, things are easy, i don't even need to play games, but with women i'm totally confused...

Hey

I'm really new to all this PUA stuff, I more or less stumbled upon it.
Thing is, I'm another lesbian from germany and after reading and soaking up as much knowledge I could from here I googled lesbian PUA and again landed her.
So I signed in^^

Good thing is, that many things that are advised here are natural for me. Looking in the eyes, just striking up conversation, kino... well I just do that a flirting without thinking about it.

My problem is that most of the time women don't understand that I'm doing heavy flirting as I'm a girl myself. They think I'm just being nice. Mean, I'm in the friend zone without even doing ANYTHING.

I'm talking about straight girls here. In a gay bar it's a total different story. There I don't even need to PUA as I'm aproached by so many anyways. I'm kind of lucky, I'm small and look cute and I'm sort of androgynous (my hait is short but girly, i use make-up nut not much, I don't wear dresses and skirts and higheels but I can show what i have). I can be very bold and I get away with it almost all the time.

So, how do you get straight girls? I mean, girls who identify as straight to understand that you are hitting on them without them being scared by it? I mean, the girls a male PUA would hit on don't neccessarily want to be hit on, too. It doesn't make a difference if I'm a male or a female.

As femme-enfant said: What about femme/femme things? How do they understand that you are doing heavy flirting and not just being nice? I don't want to say things like "oh hey, I'm a lesbian, you're hot". The best thing would be not to mention lesbianism at all but letting your actions speak. Well For now I'm going to learn all kinds of strategies and try and test.

Do you think it is okay to test out what works best and if you have figured out, can I go back to my oneitis and try her?

Lol @ this thread.

Sap - So you want to pick up straight girls? I don't see how you could do that. If a girl is straight, then she's interested in men. You might get her to do some stuff with you, but that's about it. (Girls tend to be more open than guys) I highly doubt you could pull a relationship... maybe you couldn't even pull sex from a straight girl. However, I'm sure you could pull a make out.

I'm trying to figure out the same thing. I use the usual tactics, negging, false disqualifiers, kino a lot, but when it comes to pulling a trigger for a K-close, I freeze:) I still have this fear inside my head, that the girl will be disgusted by the thought of some lesbian trying to kiss her and totally overreact in a public place LOL. So, other than gay places and the internet, when I game "straight" girls, I approach very much under the radar, yeah I tease, I kino, but I have a feeling I don't state my sexual intent enough.
I'll be trying some new stuff out, if I find anything that works or makes it easier, I'll post here. Basically, I want to adapt some of 60's stuff. I think it isn't necessarily the male-female interaction that creates sexual tension by default, but the "predator-prey" interaction. And I'm the predator baby, grrrrr

well, I got a different approach on life in general. I believe everyone is somehow sexual and by that I mean bisexual. One simply can't be only attracted to one gender. Everyone is bisexual, no matter how small the percentage of bisexuality might be. ... well, I could also now talk about how gender isn't as fixed as one might think but... let's leave it at that^^
I think that's basically the same hobbit wanted to say.

Yeah, *close is really, really easy. I just need to be cute, look cute, have some social prove and make some "real" compliments. Most girls want to have a stroy to tell, so why not telling "how they totally made out with that lesbian chick"
I can also pull sex from straight girls, but, you know... sex with lesbians is a little different. As they aren't used to making love to women, they don't know what to do so I get evry little out of it. But I could get them addicted to having sex with mehr. Sex creates bonding and that would mean: TA-DAH, relationship. That's what I'm after. But I'd like it better if I had the relationship first, then sex... ^^"

@Txacoli I agree, I think sexual tension isn't created by female-male interaction. If females are turned on by the things a guy does, why shouldn't she be turned on by a girl doing the same stuff?
The only major flaw I see is, if they don't know you're a lesbian, they won't realize you're flirting. But if you tell them straight ahead that you're a lesbian, it equals saying "you're hot, I want to bone you"

@Hobbit Well, I guess I don't have real oneitis, as I have things going with different women all the time, but she still seems to be the gold trophy^^

I'm pretty butch, so most of the girls know I'm a lesbian. I think that's why I have a hard time expressing my sexual intent more, because I have this subconscious fear I'll freak them out. This stems from the high school days because I grew up in a very macho oriented town where I was practically an outcast for not being feminine enough. By the way, I found an interesting blog you might wanna check out: http://ties007.wordpress.com

Yeah but don't be! As far as I understood this PUA-Business, it's about showing your sexual desire to girls in a way taht won't make them uncomfortable, right?
How would you show it?

The blog is very interesting, tells me that one get's straight girls just like feminine lesbian ones. Yes, true. But only as far as "kissing, making out, occasionaly sex". Not really relationshippy.

I can't not be butch:) I can't pretend to be feminine, it's not who I am. I make an effort to look good, I don't have short hair, I wear make-up and I do have a good style, but my energy will never be feminine, it can't be. So that's why I'm afraid to make my sexual intent more clear and I think I come off as friendly, and honestly I don't need any more gorgeous friends, I have enough of those I usually have this cocky/funny approach which gets them to giggle and I'm good with kino, I can escalate without making them uncomfortable, random touching, hand holding and massages all done in a nonchalant manner, but that's where I'm stuck generally. I do get makeouts if I'm at a party where my social value is high, I'll often take two girls and hug them and say, hey let's all give each other a kiss and often get a threesome makeout session, but this gets really boring after a while. So what I generally do is meet somebody in a club, outside the club whatever and game them some more on facebook or via texting and set up a "date". Then I see what we have going on when we meet, I try to build some more attraction, more kino and comfort but I never make a move too soon, I want them to get really comfortable with me without falling into the friendzone. But I have to tell you, girls that I gamed slowly, once it got physical, it usually turned into a relationship. It does get messy, because all these straight chicks have an identity crisis and are freaked out. Then I reassure them that the labels don't mean anything, it's not the sex that's important, but the person blah blah. It's really so much easier to be with a lesbian, but femme lez girls don't come around too often where I live, and I really like femme girls, so yeah, I try to "convert" straight chicks.
There are more methods of showing your sexual desire. If you do it indirectly, yeah, you kinda go in under the radar, that's what I've been mostly doing. And thats' exactly why I want to try more direct game, but I still haven't found the balls to do it because I fear some dramatic rejection scenario where the girl is totally freaked out. But damnit I will find some balls and give it a shot! I've been reading 60 years of challenge and want to adapt some of the methods he advocates. We'll see. What do you do in clubs?

Don't stop being butch. I love me a good old butchy type of lesbian (: Too often these days the go trans and take T...

Well, as I mentioned earlier, in clubs I either get picked up by the really masculine lesbians or I go and approach someone - mostly just... natural.
I go and just say "Hi", introduce myself and say, that I wanted to talk, because they looked intresting or I ask where they got some accessoire they're wearing or ask them about how their evening is going. Usually they'll say it's fine and ask in return. Then I'll tell them a story on how it was a messy chaos to get to the club or how I accidentally ripped my t-shrit in half or how I was not able to put on makeup properly and how I freaked out then, or how I accidentally used my older brothers shampoo or just any silly or clumsy story that happened to my. Most of the time they'll laugh and think I was cute. Which I what is thaught her all the time, right? Make them laugh^^ When telling stories I often playfully hit their shoulders. Kino, right? I also often look around confused and make a sniffing noise. Then I lean in closer, one hand on shoulder and sniff next to their neck and then say "Ah, it's you!"
When they ask, I say that a wonderful smell was annoying me and keeping me from concentrating.
I think I got my own routines. Except for I didn't know that they were routines^^
Now I'm learing all about patterns. I think I'll try that the next time! And also I should do more negging. I often tease girls, yes. But I didn't know it was effective Well... uhm, just conversation. Eye contact is.. natural. I always thought that it was good manner to look somebody in the eye when talking. I was surprised when I read about it.
#close is easy. When I have to go, I just hold my cell infront of them. If they ask "what?" I'll say "your numer, what else?" Idk why this works, but it does. I think it's because I don't even show that they could possibly NOT give me the number. Or they give it to me, because they didn't understand I have an interest in them.

How do you set up a date one-on-one with a straight woman?

Yeah, I know about straight girls freaking out when starting to date women.
I guess I should be more patient with them, like you said. Often I get one steamy night with them too early in our relaysh and they freak and don't want to talk to me again.

For being direct, sometimes in straight clubs I do that. I just walk up and flirt in a veeery.. direct way. Make compliments, call her hot.. you know? Somehow the "bad" way, but I get away bc. I'm a girl and I love to see how they are really confused, looking at their friends for help and uncomfortable but flattered. They don't do big bad rejection things, but mostly they state something like "hey... uhm... I'm not a lesbo..."

Well when I talk to them about their interest and stuff, if we talk about music, I ask if they like jazz for example, if they do, I say oh there's a great jazz club there and there, we should definitely go there sometimes. Just plant the idea. I like to use future projections a lot. Like planning to do things etc. Soon after, I say I'm going to this club and she should join me. I really try not to ask her, but tell her. If she can't, I immediately set another preplanned date. If she can't and doesn't offer another date when she's available, I let it go and freeze her out for a while and then rinse and repeat. Every time I fail to set a date, the freezeout is longer. So tomorrow I'm going to the movies with a HB9 and I really wanna let her know I'm not after friendship with her. I met her outside a club through a mutual acquaintance and after facebook gaming her we arranged to meet at a concert one night. We hung there, but her ride was leaving afterwards and I could not really isolate properly. There was some kino there, got IOI's and some texting sessions afterwards. So now I just have to work up my balls and game her as if I was 100% sure she was into chicks. We'll see how that goes. This weekend I may get the chance to try some more direct game and I'll let you know how it went.

By butch do you mean your attitude or you look like a man? I'm curious because guys refer to butch chicks as stocky girls with short hair, who swear, drink and smoke like a man.

LOL, no dude:) I have longer hair, wear make-up, and I don't spit on the street hehe. I just don't wear really high heels or skirts and dresses as I don't feel comfortable in them. I wear mostly jeans and a nice shirt that shows the great boobs I have And yeah, when it comes to nail polish, pink is not my color I have them either transparent or black with some shiny bits for the night look.
I used the word butch for a lack of a better word, more appropriate would be soft butch I guess, but I don't feel I'm in this category either. What I really meant is that I'm not as feminine in the traditional sense, but I'm not manly. I don't know, some people would never tell that I'm a lesbian, others can tell immediately. I don't have the girly attitude, but a lot of girls these days don't have that. I do cross my legs when I sit It's really hard to explain.

What you described sounds like a normal girl to me.

I never worry about categorising myself or people. The way I see it, theres 2 extremes and if you arent either extreme then you're somewhere on the line inbetween them leaning to which ever side you favour more.