1) My understanding of hoop theory is that PUAs must never do what a female interest has asked oneself to do unless they do it for us first? Does it apply only to material things or does this also apply to her questions. For instance, she asks "where do you work?" do I say "I would like you to tell me where I work, but I'm more interested in yours?". And then after she answers one question we're allowed to jump through 2 of her hoops...because it seems that whatever question they ask, if I always ask them to answer me first and it gets awkward.


2) Mystery said a PUA must always be leading the conversation. But does that mean they should be doing most of the talking as well? As of yet, I I lead and talk through 80% of the conversation. I think that shows neediness. Or should it be the other way round, I simply lead the questions and direct them while the ladies do 80% of the talking. Who should do most of the talking?

3) Controlling the frame. This happened on facebook game. A girl with a halloween costume display picture looooooooooooong after halloween.

Me: Hey,

Looking good. The blood smeared across your face and your black teeth remind me of my ex.

Her:

Did you pick her up at a halloween party or somthing?? lol


Me: I like cheesecake, debating and talking to zombies in my spare time...u?


Now, I'm still learning and that could be improved. My question is, she reacted to my statement about her black teeth and blood joke. Was me switching the topic "I like....u?" controlling the frame? Would answering her question "Did you pick her up at...?" have been the wrong approach and would it be falling into her frame? Mind we don't know each other and that was the first contact...


Also about frames:

HB has rarely initiates chat with me, so I go:

Me: OMG, you won't believe what I saw last night!

HB: What?!!

Me: I saw a cat and dog fighting but the dog was shit scared of the cat. The cat chased the dog and the dog fell into a sewer. The SPCA had to come rescue it.

HB: ahahhahaha

Me: So did you clean up your room like you said you would?

Her: Yup, did that in the morning.

Me: You're so diligent...that's it we're breaking up!

HB: Huh??

What do you mean?

Me: You can keep the cat, I'll keep the house and car...

Then she didn't reply.

Welcome back, I thought that me saying "you're so diligent...we're breaking up!" was controlling the frame?? Comments


Thanks in advance

To be honest, this comes across as really strange.

Respect for trying this stuff out, but I think you need some clarification on these concepts.

1) Hoop theory. You don't necessarily have to make her jump through hoops. A lot of people will just resent this. When she asks "What do you do for work?" You can just give her some crap answer, like "Professional sunbather". The idea about hoops is mainly that you won't jump through hers, and you want to give her an indirect answer so she's forced to jump through yours.

2) Mystery was full of crap on this point. It's true that you'll probably be doing most of the talking for the first part of the conversation to get interest going, but once you really start things up, then start LISTENING to her. Really LISTEN to what she's saying and just shut up. Conversation flows easily from there. After this point, conversation may be about 50-50, but it depends on the interaction.

Okay, now, to be honest, everything after this point in your post sucks. Someone has given you a very flawed idea of frame control. Here is the best article I know of about frame control: frame-control-defining-reality-and-bein ... 34530.html

Read this article. My tips for you in general are as follows:

1) Carry on a normal conversation.

2) Learn what frame control is. I would focus on #1 primarily, as that is your biggest problem.

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Don't hate, just dominate.

Hey Apostle,

Here are my thoughts.
I'ts perfectly fine to answer girls questions. She's not making you jump through a hoop by asking you where you work. She's just making conversation here. If you want to be a bit mysterious and get her to earn information about you you could make a joke and reply something like:

'I'm a reverse parallel parker for the city council, but enough about me, i'm more interested in you. How do you earn a living'

This way you will hopefully come off as funny rather than the guy that is trying to hide something, and it should't be awkward.

I think you are a bit mixed up with what hoop theory is though. You can search it here http://www.pualingo.com

You're a bit all over the place here and i'm guessing she didn't reply to that because it just sounds weird. What would you think if someone wrote that to you?

Once again it is ok to answer girls questions, you're trying to have a conversation here. I don't see why you just want to change the topic so suddenly. You had her talking with the opener, you should have kept going with it. Perhaps you could have told her how u picked up your ex and used it as an opportunity to DHV yourself.
Once again I think your a bit too 'all over the place' here, changing from one topic or routine to another too quickly. I can see your trying to get your role play routine going there but you have to ease into it. She doesn't even know what's going on here.

Take your time, think about what she's saying and try to relate to her. Put a bit more of yourself into it and stop relying on the lines. The lines might help get you started, and give you confidence for if you run out of things to say, but it's more important to be able to converse of your on head, using your own words.

Im not sure you quite understand what a frame is and what frame control is either. I'm not the best person to explain it but i suggest you read up on that too.

Keep trying though, and make sure you learn from your mistakes, and I'm sure you'll get there


wowo

wow, you are overthinking this thing way too much. A simple question is just that, just answer the question and throw some C&F in there. When your talking it seems like you are suddenly resetting and forgot where the convo was going.
Leading means to move the convo in a way you are directing but following the flow of the convo. Its like water going down a hill u can move which way it will go down the hill but the flow is down the hill. Cant start a new convo till the flow has made it down the hill.
What you are doing is starting seperate convos, if this convo was in person u'd come off as strange and even rude. You are cutting off what she is talking about, its just poor convo.