Kas, man as much I sort of disagree with how you are playing devil's advocate, I don't disagree with the fact that you are doing it in the first place. Sometimes you just have to test people. Yeah, your posts have been a bit inflammatory, but if you were just trying to test Pepsi, I would say good job. If you were doing it out of a need to insult Pepsi, well that is fucking stupid and inexcusable. But hey man, thanks for shakin things up, because that is what it takes it make people think.

Oh, and back to the topic, none of the guys I know who are good with women are assholes per se because their is a whole lot of risk to being an asshole, now it can be fun and make for some really fucking good stories but most of the time being an asshole is just too risky, at least that is what I think. Personally, I think we should all have an asshole side to our personalities because it just adds to who you are. Imagine if you are total nice guy that women generally like, well, if you allow the asshole to come through once and a while that can make you more attractive you know. Having an asshole side to your generally nice guy-edness just serves to make you a more well rounded person, which is something highly attractive to women. The inverse is also true, if you are an asshole who women generally like, than you should let that sweet nice guy come through once and while because it will just serve to make you a more well rounded person. Sly out.

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Call me Sly.
My goal: To become a Pickup Artist in everything but name.

And yeah, This is (still) just the beginning.

Tucker Max is probably the funniest guy ever.

http://www.tuckermax.com/

That's not true.

What's being an asshole?

-----

Asshole (noun)

1. (vulgar) The anus.
2. (vulgar, pejorative) A jerk; an objectionably mean, inconsiderate, or rude person.

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Please tell me how that can be good in any way?

The dating industry, and tons of magazine articles created a false dicothomy between the nice guy and the asshole. Supposedly, nice guys cant get women, while assholes do remarkably well.

Here's the thing; being either a nice guy or a jerk is in no way related to getting pussy. There are many assholes without girlfriends in this world.

This whole thing has a lot to do with jealousy.

I understand that many guys here are... well, desperate. But thats no reason to do stupid things.

Being an asshole is not attractive. Maybe the guys that do OK with women and happen to be jerks have another trait that is attractive. Just to mention one. good looks tend to make other men jealous, since they cant aproach mentally the issue in a direct way (cause it would make them feel...kind of gay).

Also if you want to look like you were in a high social stratum, the best way of make a distasteful display of apparent high value would be treating other people badly. Any girl that finds that attractive is not worth my time.

Some of the guys here might not have enough social finesse to know how to deal with assholes threatening their possition. Please, dont lower yourself to their level.

Being an asshole has nothing to do with knowing what you want and going for it. It has nothing to do with avoid being manipulated by women.

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"[Cool is] a heavily manipulative corporate ethos. ”
Kalle Lasn

"Motherfuckers best belive in....That you are fucking with the best" - 3oh!3

Teasing is a battle plan for what Shakespeare called “the merry war.”

Hey douchebags

Keep your criticism as constructive and as positive as possible

And stop being so butthurt if someone "offends" you over the internet. It's the fucking internet lol

Kasabi, I'm going to keep this short in order to avoid this thread being locked. I never said WHO THE GUYS ARE DICKS TOO. It's not any personal reaction. It's how I see them handle situations badly. You answered your own question on why I don't hold my tongue on the internet.

Haha! Pick insults out of the sky! Who started this whole thing from a totally harmless post?

Your hunch? How did I prove your baseless hunch? All I've done is respond to your accusations. So that would make anybody who responds to an insult an asshole?

Kasabi, I have done nothing wrong. I have argued with you when you accused me and that is all. Your "testing me" is so stupid when really you're just venting your aggression over the internet. As you're proving to us every time by you keeping on attacking me. Anyways, this is my last post on the matter. Reply all you want. I'm done with this.

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If only God would give me some clear sign! Like making a large deposit in my name in a Swiss bank. - Woody Allen

Pepsi, I see and understand where you are coming from and your whole discussion on Asshole v/s nice guys. But my friend your replies leads me to believe you have inner game issues and conflicts within yourself. You have a problem in handling AMOGs and maintaing a strong frame and this would show in your game.

You sound very childish in your responses to Kasabi. I'm not taking sides but you have a lot of inner game to work on.

Marc, dont take sides on this.

Kasabi, stop messing with Pepsi.

Pepsi, dont let kasabi disturb you.

He tried to pull something like this on a thread of mine. I told him that I was not even minimally offended by his comment.. and I kept on my original thread theme. Dont let him de-rail your thread...its a cool thread and people can learn from it...at least from the first 2 pages....

We learn nothing from shit like this...I know the pua chat is down, but dont use the forum as a substitue to pick on each other. Exchange IM addresses, phone numbers... anything necessary to go on with this romance of yours.

But please, do not pollute the forum with this crap. People want to learn things, not to watch a 3rd grade playground argument.

Also, I belive that the mods should bring seriousness to the disscussions when needed.

People uses the internet forums for a variety of purposes, sometimes not very mature ones, and now this forum is far too large to be controlled reasonably.

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"[Cool is] a heavily manipulative corporate ethos. ”
Kalle Lasn

"Motherfuckers best belive in....That you are fucking with the best" - 3oh!3

Teasing is a battle plan for what Shakespeare called “the merry war.”

Mr. Amador,

I refuse to believe that any mature human being can't understand what I was trying accomplish on this thread. Pepsi might be an immature little kid with more ego than brains but he knows exactly what happened here. He just can't admit it to himself.

If anything, I was more on point with the initial topic than any other poster here. A question was posed: "Are PUAS assholes?" . . . And he went as far as to say that in his experience, "ALL guys who are good with girls are assholes." (What he forgot to add is that they are assholes TO HIM.) Has any of you experienced such extremities? . . . Or think of this: Do any of you think that the girls that those guys are banging are thinking, "Wow, this guy is an asshole . . ."

I agree that there are many important lessons to be learned here but in my opinion, Pepsi's final offer on this thread is by far the most important lesson for you younger kids. It seems some of you get it . . . and it seems most of you don't. To those who get it, just do your best to breathe, listen, assess, and respond to every meeting/conversation as a new situation instead of allowing your old habits to dictate your life.
I have known many people like this in real life and when I think of them . . . it seriously breaks my heart. The fat pale kid in my hall my freshman year. . . The adopted Korean kid in high school . . . The real estate conglomerate's son in business school . . . My God, they would dig a huge hole for themselves with just about EVERYBODY they faced. Then they would tell me, "God, people are such assholes!!!!!"

All it takes is that "next encounter" to turn assholes into great buddies. . . . just as all it takes is that next encounter to turn bitchy stand-offish girls into your fuck buddies. That's why we're all here isn't it? Aren't we here to harness and realize our social powers?

Pepsi,

Kasabi may have chosen a rather derisive way to deliver his message, but that doesn't mean the message itself isn't worthwhile. No one is attacking you. Just relax, try to remove yourself from the conversation and consider his words from an objective, unbiased perspective. There is truth in them. Perception is everything.

Your boy,
870

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"Do not blame, call out, alpha male, superman, or water sprinkle any hoes. And what will be, will be." -Hobbit

http://tinyurl.com/c6lbje<-Member Journal (PMZ Only)

Amador I clearly said in my post that I'm not taking sides, I just shared my thoughts!!!

I actually think Kasabi is an absoultely ARROGANT SOB who fucking says really intelligent things without sugar coating them. He speaks from experience and if you just for a second remove the arrogance he has in his statements you would see the pieces of the puzzles come together.

Pepsi, listen to what Kasabi is saying. read his responses again without taking them personally. he is not picking on you but the attitude that you have. I am neutral in this argument and I think of Kasabi as an arrogant well S** like I said before but the good news is he doesnt sugar coat his comments. He is direct to the point and bleady very blunt, but listen to what he is trying to convey. This guy unfortunatly fucking knows what he is talking I can totally see that you are hating everyone who is better than you at women and dating.

Yes there are guys, even in this forum who maupulate women to have sex with them and are arrogant about it but these arent guys who are 'good' with women, they are just guys who get laid by preying on innocent women who cant see through all their BS. There is a difference.

You can hate PUAs but guess what with that attitude you arent going get any far. Again read and try to understand what some of the guys are trying to say.

Ok. I'm gonna come clean for a sec...I didnt read the whole thing.

Sorry, I'm a busy guy.

I read more carefully and I sensed an attitude problem on Pepsi's posts.

Kasabi, delivering a message properly just on a few lines is harder than you might think. (Most people never had training on how to communicate ideas effectively). You wrote some stuff to me on another thread, because you misunderstood it. That happens a lot.

Now think how do you make guys feel when you take this "strong" aproach. They will instantly go defensive, and they will close themselves. Nothing will be learned.

What I'm saying here is not just personal views on stuff. I have some training on effective communications, leadership and group management. (Being involved in college stuff pays). If you genuinely want to help out this kids you have to know how to do it, and just a feeling of being intelectually superior doesnt gives you proeficiency on how to help.

When I post I try to make people think, cause you cant teach to someone that doesnt wants to learn.

When you post kasabi, you do it because you found a breach on the mental process. Anything that seems weak. You are very good at it.

Thats a great skill.

But tell me, how just telling people how they are wrong helps them?

To me, it seems like Pepsi is not learning because he doesnt wants to. He is asking all the wrong questions.

My first post here was meant to shift the focus of the thread to possitive stuff, to make people stop thinking about assholes (who might or not be good with women) to make them think about themselves, to help them improve the critical inner stuff.

_________________
"[Cool is] a heavily manipulative corporate ethos. ”
Kalle Lasn

"Motherfuckers best belive in....That you are fucking with the best" - 3oh!3

Teasing is a battle plan for what Shakespeare called “the merry war.”

We're not proving math formulas but rather offering personal opinions. I'm just going with what I believe to be true and I'd like to reply to some of your posts:

870: The point of this discussions IS that "EVERYBODY IS ATTACKING HIM". He already recognizes this perpetual dynamic in his life. I have purposely "attacked him" to see if he as a propensity to escalate or to neutralize. To say that nobody is attacking him would be a blatant lie.

Secondly, I disagree with the advice about "removing" himself from the discussion for I believe he is ALREADY removed from the discussion. Instead of reading, analyzing, and responding to this discussion, he is allowing is habits to take over. 1. I'm being attacked. 2. Attack back. 3. I'm being attacked even more. 4. Freak out. . . .repeat process.

What everybody should try to do more in their lives is to be MORE mindful and actually immerse themselves as much as they can to the here and now. Pounce the discussion. . . bathe in it. . . breathe it. This is the way to pick up chicks isn't it?

Mr. amdador: You bring up a great point and I too think about the balance act of effective communication often. Everything you wrote is absolutely possible. However, I am sure you are aware of the pitfalls of what I like to call the "Patient Retention Approach". Many professionals take the "positive" approach and simply tell their patients that "They are good. They are positive. They are doing well . . ." and try to steer them in to a better direction as opposed to telling them to STOP and REVERSE directions.

What happens often is that the patients, 1. Receive positive reinforcements and are giddy to hear this crap so they keep coming back for more. 2. Since they do not change their lives OUTSIDE of the clinic, they continue to receive NEGATIVE reinforcements in the real World. 3. They keep going back to see the shrink, over, over, and over again.

And of course, I do agree that if you just tell the guy that he is an "asshole", nothing works. . .

But I don't think this is what I did. What I did was I DEMONSTRATED to him with is OWN BEHAVIOR that he acts like a monkey. Hey, sorry . . . but there's really no other way to put it. The guy is a screeching, instigating monkey and reading his own writing should verify to himself of this fact. If he wants to improve himself, he should go over and read this entire thread over, over, and over again. Don't remove himself. Don't run. Just feel the emotions swell and think, "Why do I feel this way?" What is this situation? What is really going on? Why did I respond this way? What was my goal? How will responding to others in real life like this effect my life? What are all the other ways I could have responded?

There is much self study that can be done with this simple thread.

I've got some training but I'm no real expert (I'm a economics student, no psy or anything like that). When you mentioned patients, well.. I thought "Thats a bit too far.

In short, I'm not a profesional, and I'll dare to say that neither do you. (If I'm wrong... I'm terribly sorry, and I will tell people "go ask kasabi cause his a pro")

We can only provided limited help here. When I find guys that have issues that I cant (nor I should) handle, tell them to go get profesional help.

Forums like this one give an excellent chance to some people, a chance to get attention. They post a bunch of pittyful crap, and most times they are rewarded with a lot of people paying attention to them.

You have some talent for dialectics and debate kasabi.

I might be a little soft on cases like this one, but a) its in my nature, and b) I dont really know this people enough to tell them waht I think they need.

We can only open doors here. If someone decides that its a better idea to bang his head against the wall than crossing the door... its not my problem.

I liked what happened here; a "head-banger" (no metal-related comment) was caught red handed. (I'm sorry pepsi you have to fucking start thinking about what you are thinking and why). When someone reads a thread that has the same elements, please tell everyone that is pointless to keep arguing with someone that doesnt wants help.

---Sorry about the spelling, I'm too sleepy to check---

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"[Cool is] a heavily manipulative corporate ethos. ”
Kalle Lasn

"Motherfuckers best belive in....That you are fucking with the best" - 3oh!3

Teasing is a battle plan for what Shakespeare called “the merry war.”

Here's what I believe . . .

The truth is that pepsi will always be the asshole of any group. He will always get picked on and he will always point fingers at others.

Why do I think this? In my limited experience, I have simply NEVER seen anybody transform. Have any of you ever seen total target happy losers turn their lives around? If you have, you're lucky.

The point of this thread to me has very little to do with the OP who is pretty much fucked. He will continue to see a World filled with assholes out to "get him". The kid carries his life with a defensive little shield for all the offensive pecking he does in life. There are people like this . . . and I know ALL OF YOU know people like this. Have you ever seen any of them change? Really . . .

So to me, the lesson here is for the rest of us who have a bit more balance. Many guys go away from a social situation and think, "Why was THAT GUY such an asshole to me?" Many of us are quick to point without thinking of our influences in the World. Sure, there are times when crazies just go crazy but even when they do . . . we will always have the power to kill that fire.

As Marc mentioned, I am one cocky son of a bitch. I mean, I've gone into boardrooms filled with Worldly known CEO's thinking, "I can have my way with them." I am cocky enough to think that if I want something out of anybody, then I can do it JUST WITH WORDS.

But let me tell you what that cockiness brings . .. it bring responsibility. It brings an awareness that allows me to self assess(even if I am in the wrong) and shift my strategy to improve myself for the next time around . . .

While I agree that many people who are picked on and put down are unfortunatly unaware that it is often them that lack the social skills, NOT vice versa. (The fundamental characteristic between winners and losers in the world I believe is a focus on control of situations; losers explaining events by pointing to outside sources)

I disagree that people cannot change, I have changed, and many people here have changed hugely as well. It is true that some unfortunate people do not get the opportunity to "see the light" and move themselves for better, but I would not have such a defeatist attitude to humanity.

Now you prefer to expell the "loser-asshole", I don't, I have no need for that kind of behaviour, I don't expell, I just deal with them, yeah it's taken me self restraint at times, and required me to think about my actions. But I feel it has benefited my game and myself as a human being.

But maybe your attitudes work better in your part of the world and maybe you have different objectives in life to me.

Just my 2 cents