I've been coursing through the forums but I've not yet found anything that addresses my question specifically enough for me.

I've a tendency to pull out all the cute bf shit before anything is serious and stable enough to do so. Like even for a first date with this lady I met dancing at a salsa studio was a picnic (when I asked her I exaggerated all the cutesy nonsense) I suppose it's because I've programmed myself or been programmed to think of those little soft romantic things as valued even though it's obvious that modern women like a rougher much more manly fellow, not one who's into picnics in parks and tea and movies. It all sounds rather ghey... (in the derogatory sense not the homosexual sense) and I'd love to shake it but I've found it terribly difficult to overcome my tendency towards soft romantic, chumpy nonsense too early in an interaction. Any ideas? That mindset has (understandably) kept me in the friend zone with a lot of ladies. I'd love to shake it and man the hell up.
-atbh

Being a nice and romantic guy is great. You don't wanna change that or get rid of it.
So I'd say think of yourself as the prize and make her work for it. Once in a while tease her with your nice guy traits but let her know that she's not getting in until you've got her where you want her.

Theres nothing intrinsically wrong with movies or a picnic so long as you conduct yourself in a high status "alpha" manner - be decisive, demand respect from her, tease her occasionally etc, basically all the standard game stuff.

just don't say sorry for touching her or whatever, never ask permission and never say sorry for touching her or something.

what if yoy start to do kino and she responds with kino of her own wen u ignore her for a few minutes, and she "says sorry" is that a ioi? how best to respond when they appologise for touching ?

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- "Yeah, you better be:)"
And tap them on their shoulder etc.

Niceguy 'tendencies' need to be EARNED. If you come out the box with all the cutesy BS you will fall flat on your face.You want to be the exciting, mysterious bad boy with a sprinkle of nice guy acts. This will keep her hooked...

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Keep people off-balance and in the dark by never revealing the purpose behind your actions. - Robert Greene

Nice guys dont get laid and I believe that completely. I just got out of a 3 yr relationship

The cutesy stuff isn't really bad. I have a wing who does that shit all the time. He calls a girl he just met "his wife" all the time.

The thing is, the missing ingredients to your game are probably dominance, kino escalation, flirt/ing/pushpull, and leading. Add that stuff in and the other stuff will be fine.

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DJ Fuji
Lifestyle & Dating Coach
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Have a question for me? Post it to the forum and then PM me the link and i'll reply with my 2 cents.

There is nothing wrong with romancing a woman. It's actually a great way to seduce, if performed properly. Why do you think all the chick-fliks out there are so popular with the ladies? Because the romance works, but execution of it is absolutely crucial. Timing and planing is everything with this approach. You need to know what to say and when to say it. You need to able to read her. By that I mean you need to know how to respond to her response, of your actions (hope that makes sense). If you can get a good read and stay one step ahead of her than your golden. But if you, for even a moment lose track of what your ultimate goal is by doing all these romantic things, she will sense the drop in confidence and will take it as a cheezy way to get in her pants. BUT you WANT to get in her pants, so you have to believe in yourself by doing these things and acting out the romantic man with great timing and wording, that you will be able to keep her speechless. Take notes from some movies, don't try to hard to emulate the actions/events but rather the attitudes/confidence they have when doing this. Also use your own imagination to come up with an idea, don't follow scripts, keep your own twist and she'll appreciate the authenticity of the event.

Dont apologize for your actions, use a perportionate amount of keno in relation of the vibes she sends, and control your attitude if she isn't that impressed at first. BE PATIENT. Go with it and watch it blossom into a night of heat and passion. Somewhere deep inside she'll be taken away by the night, its just ONE of the many fantasies that woman digg. Just don't drag it out. Have your nights of romance but then come back to reality and be the man thats keeping her there. Too much will run her away, but keeping the a good balance can keep a woman hooked.

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In the midst of difficulty lies opportunity.

I totally agree with the OP.

You have at least, understood the error of your ways. Nice guy = Let's just be friends. This is FACT, and yes what with all those soppy rom coms and piss poor advice from mommy and daddy to always be polite it's hard to shake it off.

But shake it off you MUST.

The ONLY time that rom com shit actually works is when the woman is in attraction and under your spell. Basically, when its 51% her 49% you. Anything less spells doom.

Google, Gunwitch. Seriously, that shit hits the spot when it comes to grabbing for your balls and behaving like an alpha male.

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Tweeby, your right that it only works if you have the girls interest level in you, more than just 51%....i'd have to say 80% is a safe zone to try this out, but once you do have her in your sights and under your works, pull some of these cards out and she'll eat out of your hands....

I wouldn't recommend attempting any of this stuff unless the relationship has started to turn into a LTR. And thats assuming that you want it to be a LTR.

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In the midst of difficulty lies opportunity.

damn yo - if you met her at a dance studio, take her out dancing. not a picnic.

i think nice guy syndrome is an inner game issue, or lack thereof. why do i say that? because i used to be way too nice when i thought i had way less to offer. yes it got me laid with a few very specific types of girls (i.e. high maintenance, entitled, narcissistic) but in my opinion, it also got me used. key words in that last sentence are "a few"... nice guy is a guy who has no game. you are on here, posting this, so you obviously want to develop your game like all of us.

i have no clue who this dude is, but i happened upon this clip the other day totally randomly and you should listen to his cogent explanation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtxYGSbqoUY

I'm a frequent (and fairly good latin) dancer and I'm trying to broaden my horizons and not do something I do all the time that's the reason for the picnic. But yes over the past few days I've been using some push/pull and doing nice (nearly romantic) things with and for my "present case" without being the nice-guy. It's such a strategic exercise. Working wonders. Thanks you all! Cheers.
atbh