I realized something last night. All the guys that do well with girls are total dicks. And I'm not talking about the whole "Nice guy VS Jerk" argument. I'm saying that even if there are no girls around they are just total assholes. For example last night I saw this guy doing textbook PU on some girls. I have known him for some time and he always tries to start fights with people but never follows through. Pretty much he is a dick to everybody including girls and he's not willing to make friends with other guys. This is relevant to us since have any of you noticed that you have gotten crueler since PU? I've noticed guys that do PU try to out-AMOG other guys that aren't even challenging them. Do any of you guys try to help out other guys doing badly/ make friends with people? Or is it all about outcome and you say "fuck others I just want to get laid" ?

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If only God would give me some clear sign! Like making a large deposit in my name in a Swiss bank. - Woody Allen

It a process that takes time. While we are learning, we are testing various limits in all directions, and sometimes we act in ways that are inappropriate. The ultimate goal of puas is not to be cruel or negative to anyone, especially not people in our day to day lives, but while we are trying to figure out a new way of living, we must push the envelope in all directions.

Basically what I'm trying to say is that so many guys come to PU so beaten down and negative upon themselves, that they treat other people 1000X better than they treat themselves. Then they must learn to become more selfish in order to balance themselves out. So they become a little cruel, to see what on the other end of that spectrum. The goal isn't to stay there, but rather to rebound toward the middle where normalcy exists. The goal is to get to a point where a pua can treat people fairly, not just to others but to themselves as well. They must get to a point where they realize that they themselves are important and their feelings matter in every decision they make.

Most credible gurus talk about how uplifting your friends is important and how negativity towards others will come back to you in some way.

It's the unpredictability jerks have that attract girls. They are able to spark emotions within a girl. That's why they keep coming back.

Kalel is right. Many of the guys here have selfesteem issues. They overdo the rebel, bad guy part. They try too hard and put on a mask ov assholeness, trying to challenge everyone and caring only for themselves.

It is also important to see that these guys mature as their skills improve. As they calibrate who they are they will in the end be able to be nice too.

An underdog with power will abuse it.

I do not agree that all PUAs are assholes. Many of the good ones (Really Good Ones!) are very nice people.

Ezo

Got crueller, game improved.

Then got less cruel and more understanding and positive towards people.... i.e. LESS of a dick than I origonally was.

My game improved ten fold.

I do.

This is one of the things that pisses me off about this community.

I'm gonna be deadly honest for a sec here; this is basically a group of wannabes. We all want/ed to be better with women, like the asshole football player in high school or the douchebag frat boy in college.

Since there are many inmature guys learning this stuff, they start to copy the behavior of the jerks, because it apparently works.

Thats like selling your soul to the devil. I wanna get laid so I'm gonna become a massive douche.

I'm probably the nicest guy you can find. I know, for most of you that word has a negative idea associated with. I'n not a mamma's boy, I'm nice as in "I make friends (with everybody), and I`m good with them" but I do no let people take advantage of me and I'm not nice with girls to get into their pants. And most importantly; When I want something I'm not afraid of go and get it.

I'm a nice guy cause its on my nature.

A girl told me once that the hottest thing about me was the way I treated everyone.

I talk to people I barely know that needs to be cheered up. I help my friends to get some girls. I might make fun of everybody and everything, but I do not disrespect of offend anyone.

I take care of stuff. I listen when I'm being talked to.

But I'm not a wimp.

Thats why I'm attractive to women.

I dont care if a douche might be attractive to women too.

If someone is desperate enough to start acting like a jerk to get pussy, PM me or something, cause you need help.

PD: Maybe some of the jerks arent jerks at all, jealousy can make people judgemental

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"[Cool is] a heavily manipulative corporate ethos. ”
Kalle Lasn

"Motherfuckers best belive in....That you are fucking with the best" - 3oh!3

Teasing is a battle plan for what Shakespeare called “the merry war.”

I must agree with what you are saying here. It's spot on!
Jealousy takes out the worst in people, and I don't see pua as just a way of getting girls. I see it as an opportunity to learn more about how we are as human beings and in most cases you are able to improve yourself in all areas to become a better person, which hopefully is why all of us is doing this:)

Why is a gentleman not the same as a loser?

Because a gentleman has power over you but chooses not to use it.

A loser does not have power and would use it if he could.

I love that. That quote says so much about human nature.

I've always been pretty good at talking to strangers and making new people feel good about themselves or part of a group. However, in the past, when ever I feel I have total control over someone I tend to retract or hand over the initiative in some way. Its as if part of me doesn't really want a relationship or at least doesn't want it to be won too easily. The quote makes me feel a lot better about myself but I know I have missed out with gilrs because of this. Recently I've started to kino more as soon as I feel the power and I'm getting results but it still sometimes feels like I'm being manipulative which I don't enjoy.

As much as everyone in here trys to defend the nice guy, nice guys finish last.. period.. Everybody knows that.. Does that mean you have to be an asshole all the time? NO. Does it mean that you have to constantly going around making fun of people making them feel like shit? NO.

And to be quite frank it's not even the asshole part of a guy that the girl is attracted to. It's the confidence that comes with it..

But regardless of how many people want to sit here and say differently nice guys finish last.

no see i used to be a nice guy and i still could pick up women, but i didnt' say being a jerk i said being confident there's a big difference.. You can still be nice to a woman and be confident..

The only thing I like about jerks is their unpredictability.

A wise girl once told me that part of the reason why girls go out with jerks is because its then easier for them to be selfish. Correspondingly girls aren't looking for Mr Nice because they are worried about feeling obligated to him or guilty when they do they want to do their own thing. In a similar way some guys avoid girls who are too nice.

Personally I also think that some girls get a kick out of being treated semi-nice by someone who is a total tool to everyone else. Makes them feel special

I'd just like to share some of my own experience on the matter.

It takes time and a lot of practice
to realise the diffrence between throwing a teasefull neg, and being a jerk.

While learning and devolping my game, I first didn't pay much attention to howe other people really would feel. I was all about the reactions and the next step.

I really belive its important to open many sets, but when people calls you a dick (even though they might stick around to change your mind about how they really are as people), you need to THINK about why this is happenin.

Is it neccesary?

Yesterday a girl called me skinny ( and I dont like that very much...)
So I thought she deserved to hear something back.
"Well, my personal belief is that one should think about what they eat and howe much they eat"

She started crying and I fuckin hated myself for saying that shit.
Conclusion: What I did. MAJOR DLV. Why did I do it? Bad innergame (Why should I care if some random chick says Im skinny?)
I felt absolutly pathetic.

I gave this a girl a really honest excuse and explained that she steped on something that I dont feel to good about, and what I said came as a reaction due to this. I also said that I thought she was really beautiful and would love to get to know her better.
She said she was sorry about what she had said and we had great rapport.

Later that evening she wanted me to massage her and actually suggested we should kiss.

Now. I dont know what to call this.
Obviosly this was a sweet girl that need a bit of sweet SPAM.

I learnt a great deal from that experience.

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Vino, vedi, vici.
I drank some wine, I saw her, I conquered