your right everyone is different, and peoples opinions will be that of their own for what works best.

but also as you have said confidence made all the difference. Ive never been against routines and techniques. However when someone understands the process and whats going on. They realize that this whole transformation is simply about the confidence to be who you want to be.

_________________
"The greatest mistake you can make in life is to be continually fearing you will make one."

Totally guys, It's all about Confidence and Inner self.

When I got into the game, I found out about mystery and learned the M3 Model. It wasn't successful for me, as there were many aspects about myself I still didn't have.

Many people rely on Routines and have the mindset that if they memorize all the routines, they will get the girl. Well I know I did when I begin. You could have ever line scripted for you on what to say and even then some people would still not be be successful with him because they don't have the inner self to deliver it. However I'm not against Routines, there good to use online and In field sometimes.

For me; its a lot less about what you say and more about how you make her feel.

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If you think you are beaten, you are.
If you think you dare not, you don't.
If you think you'll lose, you've lost.
--It's all in the STATE OF MIND--

my parents used that...i didn't stop...it didn't work...you obviously cave in to easy

NLP is weird, its manipulative and thats not how i wana meet women and get to now them, by manipulating their emotions and sometimes actions, its wrong. i prefer to make myself ideal for their attraction

and i have read a ross jeffries book...it sucked eggs. and tbh, creeped me out and made me sorta hate that guy for what he does

-teen

Everything in life is an attempt to manipulate the way things are perceived.

The "techniques" and "routines" you stick to, are a way to get an emotional responsive from someone that otherwise would not give you one. Your manipulative the system in your favor.

In a sense you manipulate yourself into thinking that NLP is manipulative. Its simply more direct then most methods. Its not about the knowledge you have, its about how you use it.

So no ego's needed when you say that NLP is manipulative. NLP is just as positive as it can be negative. I use it on myself all the time for inner game.

_________________
"The greatest mistake you can make in life is to be continually fearing you will make one."

What DC said.. I am not having ANOTHER why NLP isn't bad debate. Just search the forum, it has been done to death!

Seems like the common path many of us take, is that you start in Mystery Method/ indirect, & it's the routines & having something to say give you confidence enough at least in the lines working to actually approach. I think what you find, at least for me is eventually you have a seeing the matrix moment where you start relizing it's not what you say, it's what your body language, tone, & overall attitude says & it all comes from inner game.

I think everyone that gets good in this game eventually has to figure it out on their on, its not really something you can be taught coming from where many of us start its a huge jump. Success breads confidence though & the more success you have from what ever method the better your inner game gets because it can feed off the success & the more natural you get.

That said I think for the new guys, they really should start in Mystery Method or indirect. It's a way that most of the time you don't get blown out bad & can build your confidence with women & eventually you switch over to natural game onces you get your inner game built strong. So if you are starting learn, try the M3 skill set. It can still be useful after.