what happens to a lair when three of the most intelligent, resourceful, well-written, helpful and experienced leaders of the forum leave??

does this whole forum need a shake-up?
is it doomed to implode?
does the forum need a refresh?

with the potential of some of the most respected leaders of this forum are looking at leaving and creating their own- there must be something wrong here....




p.s. - i am a little mella-dramatic (or however you spell it) - but i am at home on a fri night by myself - so need to do somethign to keep muself amused...

Nah- it isn't melodramatic. You are absolutely right.

First off, the rest of the forum is at fault for giving them a tough time and expecting them to solve all their problems. I am absolutely sure there is more to this whole situation than I know of, but as far as I can tell, they are getting sick of redundance.

Second off, being the leaders of the forum, I see no reason for them to leave and make their own "elite group". From what MagicJ says, it is because they keep answering the same questions. If that is indeed the case, then just don't answer the questions. The rest of us have probably seen the question in the past, as well as your answer to it. SO, let one of the other heavy-posting forum participants answer it.

You three are the heavy-hitters of the forum. No one is purposefully trying to make you feel like the parents of the forum. Don't go. You may have the game down, but the rest of us are far from your level.

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-Love, Charity, and Esteem-

Well now don't I feel like a whole lot of chopped liver...

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Repent now and save 50% on your next divine judgment.
-Monkey's Little Brother, Spud

let us also pay homage to the O.G.s Monkey, Shaft,and XFman. i'd like to see them compete against romeo,meth,and magic in game. it would be like the titans v.s. the olympians.

Well that would be hardly fair. With Shaft out of the game, it would just be xfman and I. Rough odds. You may want to add a few members to the other team's roster so XF and I won't beat them so badly.

(Nah. Empty bravado. I wub you guys.)

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Repent now and save 50% on your next divine judgment.
-Monkey's Little Brother, Spud

monkey -

just wondering...

do you agree with the point of view of th eother lads??

do you feel this forum needs a shake-up?

is there to much bullshit threads and fickle people going through this forum?

Implode. I agree with that. It's like all the people coming on here are slowly eating away at the structure, causing the inevitable of the forum collapsing on itself. The forum would definitely be at a massive loss if those guys left. The questions would continue to come, with not so many to answer them. Eventually, people would stop cease to post as they aren't getting responses.

I think it'd be great of meth, maj and romeo stuck around. But if they feel that this place doesn't offer anything for them, well then I guess that's their choice.

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- Difference

Honestly, I don't think it's just this forum. I think it's the pick-up community in general. We're over-populated and under-trained as a whole. New people act like lampreys on the established artists, sucking up their techniques and routines without giving anything back to the community. I've seen my openers used in clubs by people I'd never met (the Penguin opener seems to have gained some notoriety in Edmonton). I can't develop my own stuff because I need feedback on it, but when I put it somewhere like puaf.com, it's stolen and diluted.

This is basically what my round table manifesto was supposed to be about (I find I'm a much better reactive writer than a pro-active one, though, so it's good that you asked me this).

The next step in this community isn't elite groups pushing themselves to the fringes to support one another on already glutted material. The next step is to forget everything we know about pick-up and rebuild from the basics. The next step is small, isolated groups of like-thinking individuals striving for the betterment of their community.

You'll find more on that concept in a new post.

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Repent now and save 50% on your next divine judgment.
-Monkey's Little Brother, Spud

dude theres no way i am in any way old skool i just plug away im constantly workin on improving my game i know my sticking point is escalation and closing, i honestly can open anybody create enough rapport see the IOI's but can never close,

iv been on here a while learning game nearly a year now, to be honest i dnt use much canned stuff anymore, a few routines, a little palm reading etc, if the more experienced guys left then yes it would be sort of like a snake with the head cut off, although lookin at rep, dosnt mean a new comer with no rep dosnt understand the game an hasnt been sarging for years before...

Monkey, Xfman, Impact, you guys were here when i joined and i looked on you as my mentors, and i still do, i like seeing the nodding monkey, i like seeing cartman, and xfmans signature. Meth, Romeo, Majic and Giacomo seem to be to me the next head of the snake. as if you guys, and Shaft (Has dude Found a Bird??) have other commitments to hold to, there is a strong uprising who can keep it ticking over.

as for repeated posts, any "new openers" i try not to read them, i look through ebooks, and now im thinking more inner game. i find the posts on "becoming a better PUA" far more helpful than, openers routiens etc, "should my hair be pink and curly or black and straight" WTF!!!

when i joined i saw alot more valuable imformation on this site, but then thats probally because i had very little understanding of the game. we have to keep that in mind for those who understand it then we will take less, from the site, we should have a good enough understanding off the game to be able to work problems out for ourselves.

perhaps more posts ont he structure of the game should be posted?
for example, annihalation method, conversational ju-jitsu, mystery method etc etc... not exact lines for people to copy but the structure in which they can put their own words to, i believe that owuld be bette rfor all newcomes etc, it may not abolish the "new openers" but if people understand the game they wil try them first and perhaps we will get more feild reports on stuff that dosnt work, disect and improve tried an tested methods.

nice post guys..

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Black tattoos up and down his arm, aint nothin more dangerous than aboy woth charm - christina aguilera

I completely agree with this. This is how i am learning. I spend a couple of hours every now and again creating my own Openers/DHV's and gambits. The only canned material i use is 'Best friends test' which is only because im finding transitioning a sticking point. More How to posts should be made into stickeys for new people to read. And a general etiquet should be layed down: "Read this that and this before you ask questions." "heres a post of Canned goods you can use" Etc.

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Ratio theroy...

"IT HAS BEGUN!!!!!!!"

- Shang Tsung in Mortal Kombat

It seems like the forum has been rather hectic since I left for vacation. I had no idea that I was planning on leaving the forum, this is all news to me. Though it is true that the repetitive retarded questions and over-whelming amount of them has begun to annoy me to the point where I feel sick by just reading the titles. I have no plans on leaving this forum, I enjoy communicating with many of you and wouldn't leave to create a new forum. At some point in the future I will be leaving the forum, against my will, to serve a yet to be determined prison sentence. But that is still in the future, and is something that will be dealt with when the time comes.

At times I do feel like strangling people who ask dumb questions over and over again, but I don't particularly mind helping other guys with their problems. Ming, this forum certainly needs a shake up, I'd like to be receiving some input that challenges and argues for or against my point of view on things. However, I feel this is something that will come with time, as more and more of the new members of this forum begin to improve. The thing about any acquired skill, such as the PU arts, people tend to improve exponentially; so hopefully we will begin to see more and more of that as times passes. Difference, you have a good point as well, in any forum, when a mass of new-comers flood the forum they do tend to screw up the structure and quality of the forum. However, once again, I think this is something that we just have to deal with as it will improve with time. Monkey, as far as what you said about the community as a whole, your absolutely right. I have nothing further to add, well said.

I had a wonderful thought the other night while I was laying in bed with this chick I met surfing. She was snoring, rather loudly, so I was wide awake, watching late-night televangelists and their crazy takes on what religion should be. Then I turned to this one African preacher who was full of energy and listened to him for a few minutes. He was speaking about the success of certain men in their lives, and how people try to strive for that success by imitating their exact ways of life. He went on to say how wrong this was and how it leads to nothing but an empty life. The following is a quote from him, I refuse to take credit for this little piece of ingenious material. So wherever you are, and whatever your name is Mr. Crazy Religious African man, thank you for your input that I am now applying to seduction.

"Do not study the exact methods of those who are great, study the style they use and adapt it to suit your own situation."

Meaning, fuck the openers, fuck the lines, fuck the stupid tests, and fuck the bullshit. Use them, but don't focus your entire game around them. Game is your ability to adapt to any social situation and react accordingly. Game is not your weapons cache of canned bullshit. Know the style, know the structure, but loosen up and go with the flow of things. So many guys that I have taught have asked me the same stupid question over and over and over again. "Meth, what lines should I use in the bar/club/store/other, and what should I use after I say that." To which I reply, use your brain and the environment around you.

Here is a perfect example. (will be covered in further detail in one of the many field reports from my vacation) I was renting a surfboard from a stand on the beach the other day, and as I walked up I see this petite tanned island girl wearing the shortest little cut-off shorts I've ever seen on. What was my first thought? "Oh man, wow that girl is hot, WHAT LINE SHOULD I USE ON HER?" ABSOLUTELY NOT! My first thought was: "What can I use around me to start up a fun, intriguing, and worthy conversation with this gorgeous woman?"

See the difference? That is game. The other is not.

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Amor est Vitae Essentia