I am not here to lecture you on how I think it is wrong for guys to steal girls from guys they are in relationships with. I am here to ask those guys that do steal girls from other guys to why they do it and do they see the problems it can create for themselves and for others.

I am just curious to why to those that do this.

I'm not gonna say it's right and I don't encourage it. But:

a) if the relationship is not working out, you're doing two people a favor

b) a lot of girls will tell you they have a boyfriend - either as a test, a value demonstration or if they're not into you YET (as a disqualifier). Or they'll refer to a fuckbuddy as a boyfriend (have you ever heard a girl say 'oh, my fuckbuddy's a stylist too!'?). Whichever it is, she's not telling you to stop.

c) some women just want something different... an adventure. Just a one-off thing. Who are we to decide for them? If we both want it, I'm not gonna say 'no' because of an off-chance that the boyfriend she mentioned actually exists. And if he does, see a)

d) a friend of mine cheated on her boyfriend on vacation. When I asked her how she felt about it, she said she was happy because it made her realize how much she really loved him... OK, don't criticize this blatantly flawed argument, I'm just throwing it out there as a fun anecdote.


That being said, if I know the boyfriend exists and he's not a complete jackass, I'll always, always back off. But my flexible morals tell me this isn't a black-and-white issue and there is justifiable wiggle room.

Evaluate each situation independently and go with your instincts.

Some women cheat. Nobody's a saint, we sure as hell are not. It sucks. But it also sucks shy guys with great personalities get LJBFd; it doesn't stop it from being true. We're not here to idealize reality, we're here to figure it out.

Edit: Yeah man, I see the problems. I got into pickup after a girl cheated on me, and it seriously sucked ass. That's why I'm saying consider everything and don't go around wrecking homes. At the same time, I'm happy it happened 2 instead of 20 years into our relationship.

Ace's tired ramblings, vol. 1

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Ace

I agree with this, but doesn't every relationship has its ups and downs?
I wasn't really referring to the boyfriend shit test, but I do see your point on this tho. But I think if a girl did refer to her actual boyfriend as a fuck buddy she is already on the way out as far as the relationship is concern and looking for a replacement,
There is certainly the free will aspect to it. As well as the sexual fantasy as well.
I actually heard this before. But as you said lets not criticize the very flawed argument. But I think this shows that humans can be irrational in their thinking at times, only to rational it at a latter time.

Thats basically why I asked the question because at first glance to me its black and white. But if you do a search on the net for why women cheat you find all sorts of reasons why and it no longer becomes black and white.
The other problem I see is that when you steal the girl, it can make it that much easier for her to cheat on you with another guy. And another problem is in the long run guys get jaded from the cheating girls they had and in turn trust girls less in general and therefore there are more bad relationships that good ones. And in turn only repeating the cycle.

If a girl fancies me and I fancy her then I think that means that other things are secondary. If she would be in a happy relationship it is up to her to say no.

The guy, I just dont care. Unless it is a friend. I assume that the girl will not tell him about it and if she does then it was not meant to be anyway. It would have ended even without my help.

It pains the old me to say this, but I agree with Ezo. Given mutual attraction, everything becomes secondary. Just like in poker, 'it is immoral to let a sucker keep his money. Caveat Emptor'.

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I love this quote!

If there is anything that annoys me it is seeing an AMOG or an AFC getting the girl...

While I mostly agree with this logically. There is a slight problem with this tho. As this assumes that the girl fancies you before you did anything to game her. But as a PUA I would think you would know you able to get most girls to fancy you even if they are in a relationship with another guy they are even happy with.

The bottom line is, the responsibility for fidelity lies on her shoulders and her shoulders alone. You are in no position to judge what kind of relationship she has or if it's even real. Furthermore, if she's going to cheat, she'll do it whether you come along or not--it might as well be with you.

And to those who would suggest there ought to be a higher level of fraternity and respect among men, let me ask this: are we not doing the man a favor by exposing the girl's predisposition to cheat now rather than it coming out once they're married?

I agree. But I am not talking about the girl side of this as I would think it is obvious that the girl made the choice to cheat.
To answer your question first, I don't think we are doing the other man a favor really. We are doing him more of a disservice in my opinion. Because the more us guys take girls away from other guys the more girls will be okay with cheating in general and therefore making it harder to trust girls when it comes to relationships. Let me ask you this 870. What makes you think a wife won't cheat on her husband?

Mr "2-the-point" returns with a "2-the-point" response!

Women are constantly in relationships, they live for relationships.

From a PUA perspective looking inwards, to say "I will not sarge a girl if she has a boyfriend" is ridiculous.

So what a girl/woman has a boyfriend. Is that the same boyfriend she has had since she was 12 years old?

I don't think this slope is nearly as slippery as you're making it out to be. Women have been cheating on men in some capacity pretty much since the beginning of modern dating and society hasn't descended into a vicious circle of infidelity yet and is in no danger of doing so any time soon. Girls know other girls cheat already, and though they may take social cues from that to justify their actions, that's all it is--a justification. It doesn't affect their aptitude to engage in that act any more than being able to say "I was drunk" affects the likelihood a woman will take you home from the bar. If she wants to do it, she's going to.

If a guy distrusts all women because some of them cheat, I would say he has personal issues within himself he needs to work out before making such a sweeping generalization.

I can only speak from personal experience on this, but every time I have ever been cheated on I was thankful for being saved from making a further emotional investment in a woman who was inherently unfaithful. When you think about all the time and energy a guy would have wasted on his cheating girlfriend if you hadn't come along and exposed her infidelity, trying to pick up taken women isn't just noble, it's downright generous.

How's that for a reframe?
I know there are millions of women cheating on their husbands every day--I've slept with some of them myself! But at the same time, I also know there are millions being totally 100% faithful. Fidelity is something that must be measured on an individual basis.

Your boy,
870

I can certainly see where you are coming from and could certainly go along with it even to a certain point.

I certainly agree that fidelity should be look at on an individual basis. As well as be dealt on an individual basis as well

Taking out morals I agree but with morals I disagree with it. Because from my view point you are basically saying its okay to cheat on others to only get with another person only to do it again when someone else comes along.

Call me what you will, but I live my life through a Machiavellian-esque philosophy.

Everyone is a pawn (exept my fellow PUA's of course). There are road blocks to my capitalist approach on pick-up (boyfriends, husbands, cock blocks) and life, but the world is my stage.

Well the only way you can steal a girl is if she wants to be stolen. Ultimately if your girl isn't serious about you she will be all into the idea of going out to bars with you, and basically using you for sexual gratification until something different comes along. Girls aren't very different in that they like the idea of having a hot new piece of meet. Not all girls are like that but being able to recognize which girls just want to have fun, and the ones that are serious is a important ability as a pua. You aren't stealing the girl because the guy never had her most of the time, and usually she is looking for an excuse to get out of the relationship. It's better to pursue relationships without putting them into a box. I prefer not to label them because I feel the labels don't allow the relationships to naturally flow.

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