can PUA methods lead to a healthy relationship?



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:15 pm 
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This is a question that I would like to pose to everyone, but especially the forum elders.

Can PUA methods lead to a healthy relationship?

(when I say methods, what I mean is a very broad sense of confidence, control, living in the moment, being unphased, and all that stuff)

There is a reason I really am directing this question to experienced PUA's, because they've been doing it long enough and have enough experience where they might actually have perfected their game and found "The One".

Guys, does "The One" really exist? and if so, can PUA mentality and methodology actually help keep her?

Could freezeouts, 2/3 rule, always being in charge, and a lot of the other aspects of PUA actually help keep a healthy relationship in the long run?

This is a really philosophical sort of question, I hope it's not coming off as retarded.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:51 pm 
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Yes it can. The problem is you need to not be completely retarded for it to work.
An example would be in PUA people are taught you should always do what you want never do something you don't like etc etc. In a relationship though you HAVE to compromise - the thing is though you need to know when to stand your ground and when to give some.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 9:02 pm 
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My PU game is far from perfected, but I've mastered the relationship game. Before I delve in further, however, let me clarify linguistics. When talking about "PU" and "game", I will be referring to natural game, the social dynamics aspect, and such--not routines, canned material, and all that shit. In essence not the gimmicks but the underlying stuff you learn, or learn to fake by means of employing the gimmicks. I am also assuming you are talking about a traditional, exclusive LTR.

Most fundamentally, a healthy relationship works only if you're happy and content with and by yourself. Like in PU, you cannot need that other person to fill you out. Otherwise, you become clingy (or needy), neglect other aspects of your life; aspects that led her to enter a relationship with you in the first place.

Since you must be fine without her, it follows that you must have solid inner game. Without, you can't develop trust, which will lead to petty arguments and break you up or make you unhappy in your relationship. If you have the requisite confidence--"I rock her world each and every day"--you will also not make the mistake of making assumptions. Making assumptions is another fatal sin in relationships. She may flirt with other guys, go out and get shitfaced while you're at work, dish you stories that don't seem to add up. Don't assume things. Instead, be aware that you leave nothing to be desired and that you need her to retain some independence as well. You'll find, there are benign explanations each time. But so much for the foundation.

Employing PU techniques are essential in the beginning. Making her wait, keeping her guessing, always being in charge are things that will stoke her interest. But there comes a pivot point, when your relationship tips from game playing to partnership. Ease into it, but from then on the dynamic should change. She needs to know that she is it for you, that you adore her, think of her, blah blah blah. While I may catch flack for this, think of all the romanticized TV shit. Tell her how much she means to you, give her flowers, surprise her with a picnic, make breakfast in bed, make sacrifices for her (small gestures will be enough). You will be the boyfriend she brags about to everyone she knows, her girl friends will be jealous, and when you hit a rough patch, her friends will tell her to get through it since you're a winner. At this point, it's important to keep in mind what I laid out as the fundamentals. Yes, there are contradictions, but it's a balancing act.

Next, remember that she's not perfect. She will make mistakes. Maybe throw a petty bitchfit. Be forgiving, you're better than that and can swallow your pride. Once she's thinking clearly again, she will appreciate it and value you even more, since you can forgive her flaws. This is an instance where you shouldn't freeze her out, or punish her for it. It's not a fight for power, it's not about playing games, a relationship is a cooperative project. Even if you fight and she tells you to piss off, it's never a good idea to freeze out. If you do, she's left with negative feelings to dwell on, wondering all the while why on earth you aren't making an effort to fix it.

In sum, be truly confident, keep your cool, and be upfront and honest. PU can help you get her, unless it's a gimmick-based game. But to keep her, you have to change a bit.

As for "the one," I think it's a necessary fiction. You have to believe in it during the course of the relationship. But from an outside perspective, there are thousands of girls who can make you feel that--or really just one, who you will never meet. But that relates to your other question. What I describe above only works on girls who are like that themselves. My method may not work with girls who lack self-esteem, are emotionally immature, or have not developed a strong enough personality. But if you're looking of "the one" to settle on, why settle for anything sub-par? In the meantime, keep playing the game until you come across one that can match you.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 9:47 pm 
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Quote:
Yes it can. The problem is you need to not be completely retarded for it to work.
An example would be in PUA people are taught you should always do what you want never do something you don't like etc etc. In a relationship though you HAVE to compromise - the thing is though you need to know when to stand your ground and when to give some.
Pretty much this.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:19 pm 
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You guys are putting too much weight on PU. . .

PU is NOT:

1. Self Improvement. If PU = Self Improvement, we'd call it "SI". . . if you want bigger muscles, go to a gym. If you want to learn something, go to school.
2. A way to become alpha or beta or David Hasselhoff.
3. A way to improve any other part of your life other than. . .

Picking up Chicks.

And many have enough problems with ^this objective alone.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:55 am 
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A girl is not in a relationship with PUA methods; she's in a relationship with the person who used them.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:04 am 
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Yes, PUA skills can absolutely help you maintain a serious LTR.

I disagree with kasabi. I've always seen PUA as fundamentally about Self-Improvement. It's about bringing out the best in you. It's about showing people your best side and learning for yourself what you want and how to get it.
These skills will help you pick up girls, pick up same-sex friends, be better liked around the office, and maintain healthier relationships overall.

If you ONLY see PUA as a method for fucking as many broads as possible, then you're doing it wrong!
p.s. that's why so many of us here have such an adverse reaction when people come here and post on how to cheat on their spouses/serious girlfriends.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:21 am 
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Quote:
It's about bringing out the best in you. It's about showing people your best side and learning for yourself what you want and how to get it.
Nope. I learned PU and became an Actor in the field, damn good too. very tiring tho.

PU and the things that come with it SI, Alphaness, social life, confidence, etc will help you in a relationship.

They will help you with the 4 horseman
contempt, defensiveness, criticism, stonewalling
(Gottman)

stonewalling is shutting down when ppl start arguing with you.
What is learned in PU will help with all these things. 4 horseman considered in the psychology world to be very important and very high predictors of sucess

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:36 am 
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It all comes down to this: don't have a relationship with the game, have a relationship with the girl.

That said, healthy relationships happen when both people expect the right things of each other, and see each other for who they are. Will Smith said it well: "Here's the test. Is there something you would tell your best friend, that you wouldn't tell your girl?" In general I think Will Smith dispenses excellent dating advice in his interviews :)

It's fine to use PUA methods to get the girl. I would personally use social networking and social intelligence because you can continue to use them and you don't have to feel like you are giving up the skills you learned fo the girl.
Quote:
This is a question that I would like to pose to everyone, but especially the forum elders.

Can PUA methods lead to a healthy relationship?

(when I say methods, what I mean is a very broad sense of confidence, control, living in the moment, being unphased, and all that stuff)

There is a reason I really am directing this question to experienced PUA's, because they've been doing it long enough and have enough experience where they might actually have perfected their game and found "The One".

Guys, does "The One" really exist? and if so, can PUA mentality and methodology actually help keep her?

Could freezeouts, 2/3 rule, always being in charge, and a lot of the other aspects of PUA actually help keep a healthy relationship in the long run?

This is a really philosophical sort of question, I hope it's not coming off as retarded.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:21 pm 
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yes i believe you can have an LTR and some if not all the skills of PUA factor into this. of course as someone said above some concessions do have to be observed if you really want to stay with the girl and not just treat her as an Fclose.

women tend to stick to men who they see other women desire. it keeps them on their toes and things don't get boring. When all is said and done thats what its about right? not keeping the relationship boring and stale. PUA have the skills to keep things lively while at the same time recognizing this is the girl they wan to be with. Though they could never really let on how much they like this girl it's okay to show weakness once in awhile


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:36 pm 
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If you're "acting" in-field or there's a "pick up" you and a "real" you, then you're not there yet.

Last night I talked about pickup with another guy whilst my MLTR was sitting right there nodding her head and agreeing. Later I showed her a video http://vimeo.com/19738331 of Sasha doing sets, including using a variation of the opener I used on her (to which she said, hmmm sounds familiar," and gave me a cheeky smile).

Of course you can have successful LTRs and be a PUA. The key is to be COMPLETELY HONEST with yourself and everyone around you.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:39 pm 
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PUA routines and lines will fuck up your relationship, but PUA principles are solid psychological theories that will keep a girl attracted to you.

If you have a girlfriend you used routines on, either admit on the initial interaction you said that stuff because you were so attracted you needed something to say, or if you didn't and you already fucked, never fucking tell her. You might as well tell her all your intentions were bogus. Whether she acts fine with it or not, she can't help but think you basically tricked her into bed, like she went through an assembly line in a factory and came out the other side like a cheap manufactured robot.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 1:01 pm 
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Quote:
A girl is not in a relationship with PUA methods; she's in a relationship with the person who used them.
Truth.

The cube, 5 lies, strawberry field, the ring routine, all these games are not going to help you get to know your girl the same way they help you pick her up. The PUA mindset will help keep some spice in the relationship (push/pull, confidence, teasing) since those become foreplay and so you can still be charming. You don't want to be the guy who attracted her and then became boring because everything was superficial(routines) before. It's a sure way to become the borefriend and then another PUA will sweep her off of her feet. I'm tempted to try some routines on my girlfriend for fun though, but I'd never freeze her out since relationships, unlike fbs, are more about communication than game.

Thoughts?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 3:32 pm 
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"You aren't in relationship with PU, you are in relationship with the girl"-True

The same way girl isn't in relationship with PU, she is in relationship with YOU!

That's why:

If you do PU(acting)-that's not you.=girl doesn't even know you.

If you make PU part of who you are (being instead of doing-credits to Bruce Lee)

then you develop a more attractive personality, and we all know, personality matters.

You won't be able to act all the time. You won't be able to come with a cool "line" every time. And even if you can-I doubt the possibility of a happy relationship in this case.

IMHO


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 4:29 pm 
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listen to all these guys mate

although whoever said- alpha, beta or hasselhoff really made my day!


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