FINALLLLYYYYY!!!!

Hands down the pants, no finger, but pubic region. I told her how important it was too me, choosing words carefully, and she agreed. She was really hesitant, i could tell she wanted to move my hand away but then she came to grip with the idea. Then after a while she moved my hand away.

Fuck it, Its nothing I know, but it s something little

Just keep pushing on a large scale always works. Slowly you are seeing progress.

And when the times comes and u have sex. You will be the one in control. Not her.

Do you know the difference between token resistance and actual resistance?

I had a girl give me token resistance one time a while back, and I just apologized about my horny self and kept going. She tried to stop me a little but then gave up and just let it happen. Sometimes they don't want to feel like they chose to have sex with you, like they were forced, not because they don't want to but because they can then feel like it's not their fault. You can't push that too far, because then it's rape, but you'll know when you're going too far, because they'll really put up a fight.

Virgins can be tough nuts to crack.

Did I just rape her?

PFfffftt bwahaha, I don't think so. Well, I'm not a lawyer so I honestly can't tell you but um, she doesn't sound like she's too mad at you so you probably won't find out.

YOu know it just occurred to me a lot of times girls do this shit because they are afraid you're going to lose interest after you have sex.

I had sex with a girl after about a month of seeing her and now she's telling me she wishes she'd waited longer. Probably because I only call her like twice a week now. Eh, well, she had me pegged like a nail....

Anyway, I guess it's what you'd call sellers remorse, when you sell something you wish you could've sold it for more, why didn't I hold out a little longer, make them give me more?

How do you mitigate that issue, you have to tell them they are getting a good deal, they are being treated fairly, they're making the right choice, they won't regret it, they will never do better.

I'm having a similar issue with a Mormon girl. AMAZING rapport and energy between us, but she won't go down on me or give it up. 4 dates so far, with multi-hour makeouts and dry jumping on the 2nd 3rd and 4th. (What makes it more aggravating, is she's NOT a virgin. She's 23, but 2 years ago swore off premartial sex. Makes it aggravating to think past guys had it easier, OTOH it helps convince me I can change her mind back again.)

I haven't cracked het yet, but I have cracked a few past similar girls (who were actual virgins), and here are my thoughts with these situations:

1. As always with girls - "dont' change her mind, change her mood," as heariste(.wordpress.com) Girls are less logic-driven and more emotion-driven than guys.

2. I've let this girl know, truthfully, that I am seeing and screwing other girls, and being exclusive with her is absolutely off the table if we're not having sex. She's been amazingly supportive of it (jealous in a 'good' way), even aroused by hearing about my other exploits. (And don't act jealous if she's seeing other guys. Maintain confidence that you are her destiny.)

This should be your main bartering chip. whysoskinny, you MUST see other girls and you MUST tell her that's just how it's gonna be until she will let you make love to her.

You must do it to offset your oneitis, and to let her see that she could lose you and that you won't play by her rules.

If she says "would you be exclusive with me if I had sex," you don't want to immediately say "YES!" b/c that will sound like you're just saying what she wants to hear, and it sounds desperate. Say suggestive things like, "I've daydreamed about a life like that together," that make her think that the truth is 'yes' but that you don't want to say 'yes'...so that it won't seem like you're just saying 'yes' to sex her.

3. With my girl I'm playing a 'doomed romance' vibe - she, like most chicks, gets off on this drama stuff. I've told her, in a nostalgic and not nasty way, 'we both know we shouldn't really be together b/c of this, but we have this amazing connection and can't pull ourselves away'... Chick crack. Even if I never lay her, we're having a wild and passionate ride.

I don't want our relationship to be full of me griping about lack of sex, so instead, I try to make it positive energy 95% of the time, but she always knows that she could lose me becoming serious/exclusive to another girl with another girl.

In other words, the relationship should be positive - and the big negative should be her knowledge that it could end at any time. "Instill dread," as heartiste says. Sounds cruel, but it's not meant to be. It's just how it is.

4. Try for a blowjob as a compromise. I enjoy BJs as much as sex so this is a genuine prize for me, and in my experience, it opens girls up to sex later on.

5. State control / outcome independent mindset. Since I'm screwing other girls I don't get bad blue balls etc., and I genuinely enjoy my time with her, I'm not depressed about not sexing her. It'd just be a great additional positive.

6. Do NOT say "I love you." (You already have, so stop it, now.) Like she's doing with sex, you must dangle and withhold that prize. I say things to her like "I'm beginning to see I could love you if I let myself. I almost regret I'm so good at not letting myself when I know I shouldn't." I sort of talk about it the way she thinks about sex.

Relationships aren't altruistic. They're quid pro quo. I wish to god it weren't that way, but it is. Once you've taken the red pill you can never go back...

...but really, would you want to?

whysoskinny

i feel like your a sucker n i have read this whole post hoping you wld get laid as if it were me. i do however think its commendable you have stuck in there n seem to be making some progress. next time dnt go out with a girl that doesnt have sex exclusively it seems like a blue balls death wish to me. but good luck n get some

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scorpion

This is the problem when you commit with a girl before really being sure about the relationship physically. I mean why would you make a girl your girlfriend without any sex...Sure a lot of people don't have sex until they label it...but really this is ridiculous.

Find someone else. She's a virgin, but let me tell you one thing: OVERRATED! At best, the first time is going to be extremely lame fucking her. I honestly wouldn't waste my time and go with a more confident girl that's not so ASD. I mean you're even giving her deniability but she won't do it. It just seems like either she's not willing to do it with you, or she has that 1 thing set in her mind.

Okay, calling me a sucker I Dont know what you mean but fuck it, I have had my share of getting down to business with girls, great girls, models, a girl in entourage as well... Ive done all that and this girl does have something differernet about her. Now back to the task at hand:

I have to admit I am getting tiresome, today we had a long talk about it where she said she "knows I am doing a good job and it must be hard for me and she is trying".... I put my hand on her inner thigh when we are alone and she pushed me away, all night I was getting rejected. I was so horny, I laid on top of her and I have never wanted to dry hump so bad, I felt her pubic bone sticking into me and I wanted to fuck the shit out of her. I even told her that this is a sexy position, and every attempt I try, she some how manages to turn it negative...

- I say that, she says well it hurts
-I put my hand in the inner thigh, she says she is not in the mood
-I say, well we have to create the mood, you have to allow yourself to be able to get there, and she says she isn't feeling it
-I lay on my stomach, say i like my stomach scrated, I even say, since my hand has been down your pants a bit, its fair you go down mine a bit, and she says she doenst want to

EVERY FUCKING ATTEMPT IS A FAIL

I told her, if i didnt try, you wouldn try and we would be stuck at 0.. I try and i get rejected all the time, but at least now I can touch ur ass without u freaking out

What the fuck do I do, honestly

She leaves to go home in 8 days, for................ 3 MONTHS... I wont see her for 3 months. Ignore that part, what do i do when im around her to get her turned on, because everything i have been taught doenst work on this girl

2 words

Confident persistence

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Nothing is working.

New Issue taking place:

In 2 days she lives for summer, and she is gone for Four Months. Lately, in our relationship she has been in control, get that, she is in control. I have been very lovey dovey for some reason. She has backed off a bit, i dont know how to handle it.

I am asking for some advice. In the next 2 days....

Tonight we are going to the pub night.

Tomorrow a concert.

Then goodbye.

Your opinions

my advice is make it clear that your getting pissed off at these shenanigans. and you don't like little 12 year girls who are so unsure of themselves.


make it all or nothing, especially with u not going to see her until next semester now.

that could ruin our last night together

get real u wont stil be together after 4 months

youre too afraid to take a risk, that's why u lose.

You're either a PUA or an AFC, you can't be both. You're clowning yourself, this is your fault not hers. You can only blame yourself if you wait another 3-4 months for her to come back and its the same shit.

Although I suppose if you can't be a good example, be a terrible warning... lol