I am sure this subject has been brought up many times and since the age of dawn, but I wanted to have a discussion on my latest conclusion.

As a guy in my 30's who has been around the block a little; I am coming to the opinion that difference between arrogance and confidence is the same difference between the colour grey and another colour inbetween black and white.

I was out the other night and met these two girls infront of a club when I was waiting for a friend. The girls were meant to be going to the same club as me. One was HB4 and the other HB6. They were trying to make conversation with me.. I was talking but not paying much attention to them. I took them both to another bar as the club looked shit. Fortunately, the HB4 lived in the opposite direction to me and HB6 lived close by. To cut a very long winded story short, I took the HB6 back, got her a bit pissed and did the damage.
We had a chat after and she said to me 'When I met you tonight, I thought you were just arrogant. Other guys pay attention to me and you just didnt seem interested.. like you thought you were better than me'.

In another situation I was talking to a girl I met this weekend. She was telling me about a guy she met in a bar a few years back. He puts his arm around her and she pushes it off telling him how rude he was. She told me how 'arrogant' she thought he was. Bottom line?... she started seeing him after for a bit.

Some of you might even think none of this is real arrogance, but the fact that these girls did obviously shows that it really is a matter of perception to many.
So why are they drawn to someone who is 'arrogant' when I was always led to believe it was confidence and not arrogance?.. alot of the time (and this is probably due to my low confidence at moments infront of girls).. I act like I dont care.
The other night I took a camera out of someones hands and stuck it down my pants and took a photo. I kept a straight face and then handed the camera back. The girls around me were laughing.. they loved it.. but that was pure arrogance.. right?

It is as if confidence and arrogance BOTH seem to present a DHV for guys.
Obviously there is a line to be drawn so it doesnt become irritating, but the point I am trying to make here is that us men worry alot about coming over as arrogant, and I am starting to think it doesnt matter.


As it happens, I am not a PUA and there are others on here much more qualified than me to give opinions on this, but I wanted to get the ball rolling on this and hear some thoughts...

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here to learn.. thats all.

You haven´t been led to believe something wrong here. You actually nailed the main difference between the two seemingly without noticing.

Arrogance is a non-quality and means that someone is displaying a behaviour that is putting down or humiliating others in order to mask a lack of confidence. A person that is truly self confident has no need for that.
There will always be women that will fall for an arrogant looser, but these women clearly have self-esteem issues.

The stunt you pulled with that camera was actually pretty cool and falls more into the cocky-category, which could be described (at least in my opinion) as showing seemingly arrogant behaviour but with a smile that says "I´m only fucking with you."

Real arrogance is simply repulsive to anyone, male or female, who has his/her shit together because it´s a sign of weakness and insecurity.

arrogance is taking things for granted and being stupid and ungrounded. Confidence is everything else

Arrogance is a flaw. I have tooled many arrogant guys because they challenged my confidence with their arrogance. Arrogance breeds a sense of superiority over others and they look down upon those that they feel aren't on equal playing fields. It is always fun making guys show off or challenge them enough to lay out their insecurities for everyone to see

I'd also add that arrogance is confidence that is out of proportion with reality.

A confident guy would chat and have a good time with a HB 4/6 pair, because he would know he could do better in the club (as far as only the numbers are concerned), and an experienced guy would know not to ignore them in the first place. Ignoring them creates enemies you don't need, and experience would tell you that they could be fun, have hot friends inside the club who could pre-select you to once inside, you could warm up your game on them, maybe one or two of them are actually pretty cool and could expand your circle of friends, etc.

Sticking the camera down your pants and taking a pic wasn't seen as arrogance because you probably didn't try to ignore those girls, like you did with the other girls waiting in line that were really making an effort to talk to you. If it's any consolation the HB6 was probably ready to get pissed off, because she wanted to tell you off for ignoring her in the first place and going with you to the next bar offered the opportunity to do so. Nonetheless, without overcoming that huge obstacle in her mind you never had a chance.

Additionally, you're talking about two different environments. A club is a sexually charged setting that is quite different from the line outside waiting to get in. Grabbing a girl's camera and taking a below-the-belt pic inside the club would be seen as bravado, provided it was spontaneous. Doing the same outside of the club would probably be viewed as perverted.

However, sometimes you bend reality to your beliefs.

confidence and arrogance are two entirely different things and don't nessicarily have to remain mutually exclusive

arrogance is just a feeling of superiority

and confidence is certainty

you can be an arrogant person and be very self confident at the same time, you can also be a humble person and be very self confident at the same time, just in the same way you can be unconfident and arrogant or unconfident and humble

girls are drawn to confidence, a girl being drawn to guy being humble or arrogant is like a guy being drawn to a girl because she is bubbly or bitchy, just personal preference