From AFC to PUA: a Learning Journal (AFC Daniel)



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 6:36 pm 
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I have to plan a bit with all these new target coming back at me. But no time for now. I have an exam tomorrow.
I can't remember if I've shared this with you or not. In any case, this will help you structure your studies efficiently to maximize the time you have for socializing:

http://calnewport.com/blog/

Here are a few intro articles:

Amazing Pre-Med who finishes all his work by dinner, to leave the entire night for ladies:
http://calnewport.com/blog/2011/01/21/o ... re-dinner/

Time Arbitrage: Making a productivity profit through scheduling
http://calnewport.com/blog/2008/01/21/m ... ty-profit/

A primer on the method:
http://calnewport.com/blog/2009/11/20/a ... ks-primer/

Many of his paradigms are applicable to all aspects of life. I'm sure if he was a PUA, he'd have a journal just like yours.
Thanks Hobbit, I'll take a look. I like this kind of blogs.

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On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:25 pm 
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DAY 57: cervejada party.
Princess likes a lot of princes.

Context.
I managed to get an ice-cream date with Princess today (Saturday) but I knew I would see her yesterday at the cervejada party on the campus of the University of São Paulo. A lot of exchange students were supposed to come but due to logistic I had to come by myself.

Adressed issues.
- I'm not good enough at escalating.
- I still have a lot to learn in night game.
- Poor dancing skills?
- I don't get enough out of my comfort zone.
- I'm unable to kiss close.

Goals.
- Escalate with Princess.
- Kiss close Princess.
- Have fun.

Strategy.
I've read Vin DiCarlo's Escalation Ladder and some 60yoc. I wanted to kill some micro-avoidance to be confident in the party so I went to a mall to have a meal and do some shopping. I also wanted to focus on the first 30 minutes of the night. I also wanted to have fun.

____________________________________________________________________

At the mall.
I wanted to buy some new tee-shirts and grab something to eat before going to the party. The idea was to give me some confidence before night game. Truth is, I've been doubting all day, I don't really know why, but I needed to inverse the flow. It did not work. I went to several stores, bought some tee-shirts, had some unsuccessful interactions... That was a bad sign, I knew it but was a bit powerless... I did not give up and went to Pizza Hut to get a pizza. I force myself to have an interaction with the cashier and it worked well. I took this small positive results and got out of the mall. On my way home, I surprised my self hesitating to ask the bus driver if he was going where I wanted to go... Arg, not a good day, but I have to handle it. I went home, read some material to get a better mindset and I went there.

The first 30 minutes.
I was okay but I was by myself! I did not know anybody. I went to the bar and got a tequila and walked around for 15 minutes without seeing anyone that I know... Arg. I decided to go to the bathroom and finally met two Dutch exchange students that I know. I stayed with them and was really social. One of the has a really good natural game actually. He's cool, confident, good looking, alpha. It was cool to be with him, I wanted to observe him.

Princess.
About one hour later, Princess arrived. I asked a French friend to hold my beer for me, I wanted to have my hands free to say hello to her. I kissed her hello and did a "disney hug", then kissed her again on the cheek. She was going to the bar. I did not want to come across as needy so I told her that I would see her later in the party so we can speak a little. As planned I saw her later in the party but we were talking in a group so I could not do anything except maintain eye-contact and do some KINO from time to time. I teased her though. Later, she met a Brazilian friend of her that took her hand and isolated her... She spent 30 minutes making out with him. lol. I think I'm the only one who have not kissed her actually. Anyways she came back. I was not pissed off but I was hesitating even more... should I try to kiss her? Later we dance together. Rock was playing... The first steps were okay, but at some point she wanted to do something I did not get... She looked at me and said: never mind. Damn. First fail in my dancing skills! But that's okay, at least I went for it. Later on, she went to the bathroom and she made out with another guy... I could not believe what I was seeing... I started to think stupid things like "damn, would be a shame to get rejected by her...". Anyways, I did not have the balls to create an opportunity to kiss her despite the escalation I've done. All these guys went alpha with her I think... I was the guy who has been pussying around again... In my defense, I really thought I would have time to isolate and kiss her... but in the end, I did not even know what I wanted. Yet, there is some progress... As an AFC, I would have been really pissed off about that. Here I was just a bit lost but it did not affect my mood or anything.

Brazilian girl.
At some point in the party, I've met a cute Brazilian girl a guy introduced me to. I introduced me and started to talk about the theme of the party. We spoke about on random stuff but I did not manage to keep the flow of the conversation. Another girl I know came and I could not handle both of them. I was not focused anyways and felt like she knew I was hitting on her. I was not showing good game at all.

Natural PUAs?
Since I was not in a great night, I actually observed other guys' game.
The Dutch guy was doing really good, he did not spend the whole time with the other exchange students. He was relaxed, cool, just enjoying himself. He ended up dancing and making out with a girl. She was not so cute... but at least he was kiss closing. He actually kiss closed Princess at another party.
There was also a French guy with a different style. He was obviously looking for a girl. He opened a lot contrary to the Dutch guy and ejected often. He danced like crazy with some of them. Don't know if he had some success though.

Results: none in the end. I just had fun. The girl I was supposed to kiss made out with another guy... and I was bad at meeting new people. A bad night to remember as an example. I was a bit drunk too.

____________________________________________________________________
The party was not about good Game, but I've learned some stuff though. Plus, I'm not that depressed about it, I can feel it's all about calibration.

On the strategy.
I did not work this time, I could not warm up efficiently. The doubt had the upper hand on me. Yet, I fought it and actually managed to get better until the party. The confidence happened to be okay, but my game was poor except for the escalation part with Princess.

On the Game.
- I should never focus on one target: I lost the abundance mindset got no number close from other girls.
- I should spend less time with the people I know[/b] in the party.
- Being drunk was not a good idea: I lost focus.
- Escalate fast until your target is here!
- Isolating is gold.

Questions to move on.
- Is there a simple technique to isolate? Grabbing her hand and walking I guess.
- How to manage alcohol? It's not a problem when it makes me dance and all, but I usually lose focus on the Game. What if I just try to dance without being drunk? lol

Coming next, a report on a 3 hour date with Princess.

_________________
On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


Last edited by AFC Daniel on Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:14 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 11:09 pm 
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For isolation you can go with cold reading, the cube or omething similar and say that you both need to really be concentrating and so need to go somewhere more private.

On that note, I see a lot of people on this forum talking about the cube and saying that they think it's not very good. The cube is actually one of hundreds of games that are part of a strand of psychology called 'Kokologu'. There are better and much more sexual games than the cube that will allow you to very quickly frame her as a sexual person and escalate the conversation. You can buy the book very cheap. See the link below.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kokology-Game-S ... 306&sr=8-1


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 2:12 pm 
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For isolation you can go with cold reading, the cube or omething similar and say that you both need to really be concentrating and so need to go somewhere more private.

On that note, I see a lot of people on this forum talking about the cube and saying that they think it's not very good. The cube is actually one of hundreds of games that are part of a strand of psychology called 'Kokologu'. There are better and much more sexual games than the cube that will allow you to very quickly frame her as a sexual person and escalate the conversation. You can buy the book very cheap. See the link below.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kokology-Game-S ... 306&sr=8-1
Some routines could definitely help me out here. Thanks for the reference, it can be interesting to know more of this kind of games...

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On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 2:41 pm 
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On the Game.
- I should never focus on one target: I lost the abundance mindset got no number close from other girls.
Sounds like you didn't give enough 'proper' focus on the princess. There's nothing particularly wrong with zoning in on a girl that grabs your attention.
Quote:
Questions to move on.
- Is there a simple technique to isolate? Grabbing her hand and walking I guess.
I was talking to my 14 year old nephew the other day and asked him teasingly, "So how do you go about asking girls out?" If he answered with an "I don't know," I thought I'd offer him some ideas . . .

His answer: "Just make it seem like it's no big deal like, 'hey, let's go to the movies,' or something like that. . . .ha, ha, ha . . ." - I had nothing to add . .

You're already in an environment where everybody's in a party mood and up for anything. If you tell ANYBODY . . . even guys, "Hey, let's go check out the bar/pool table/balcony/those candles/DJ area/pictures/smoke machine, etc. . . the least they usually do is shrug their shoulders and follow . . .


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 2:45 pm 
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On the Game.
- I should never focus on one target: I lost the abundance mindset got no number close from other girls.
Sounds like you didn't give enough 'proper' focus on the princess. There's nothing particularly wrong with zoning in on a girl that grabs your attention.
Quote:
Questions to move on.
- Is there a simple technique to isolate? Grabbing her hand and walking I guess.
I was talking to my 14 year old nephew the other day and asked him teasingly, "So how do you go about asking girls out?" If he answered with an "I don't know," I thought I'd offer him some ideas . . .

His answer: "Just make it seem like it's no big deal like, 'hey, let's go to the movies,' or something like that. . . .ha, ha, ha . . ." - I had nothing to add . .

You're already in an environment where everybody's in a party mood and up for anything. If you tell ANYBODY . . . even guys, "Hey, let's go check out the bar/pool table/balcony/those candles/DJ area/pictures/smoke machine, etc. . . the least they usually do is shrug their shoulders and follow . . .
Yeah, sounds obvious, but I really thought I would have the time later on (she's just arrived at the party)... but seeing her going with this guy to make out kinda froze me afterwards...

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On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 8:15 pm 
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DAY 58: 3-hours date with Princess.
Letting her talk.

Context.
I went to a party on Friday night. My game was not really good even though I did escalate with Princess... The only thing is, I did not isolate her early enough and she ended making out with someone else. Truth is, she makes out with at least one guy per party... but well, not me. Anyways, we had to take an ice-cream together.

Addressed issues.
- I'm still having difficulties to escalate properly.
- I don't have a huge date experience.
- I speak too much, I even interrupt the targets when they speak, I should let them break the awkward silence.

Goals.
Well, the point is, I was still a bit puzzled by what I've seen the night before... She made out with a lot of people. I actually felt like I was the one being played... so I did not know what I was supposed to set up as a goal. I don't even know what I want in the end.
- Escalate to a kiss-close?
- Let her talk.

Strategy.
I did not have time to prepare any strategy and I'm actually mad about it... I was supposed to see her the afternoon, not in the morning.
____________________________________________________________________

Text messages.
I wanted to rest after the party but I received a message from Princess:
Quote:
GOOD MORNING!! Ready for some ice cream today? I am free anytime this morning until 2h30! Bjs
I answered:
Quote:
I'll be there at 11.11am.
She replied:
Quote:
At Patio? [mall] 11 is one of my favorite numbers- this ice cream better be good! =p
Taking pictures.
It was a wonderful day and since I did not want to be late, I chose to actually come early... I went there one hour before to take some picture on avenida Paulista. I enjoyed that time actually. At 11.11am I was at the mall to meet her.

Dating.
I met her at the mall, I was not anxious at all since I had a "whatever" attitude since I understood she must have basically made with more than 10 guys since she's here. We took the ice-cream and started to walk out of the mall to have a walk on the avenue. Nothing really happened but here are a few key elements:
- we went to several venues: museum, parc, mall, library... hospital! lol
- I've spent 3 hours with her
- I basically let her talk all along, I wanted to see if I can just shut up and guide the conversation. It worked well. I listened a lot. She looked happy about it.
- I KINOed again: claw and stuff... but well it did not get me anywhere.
- At some point, she let me know that she doesn't want to be that crazy in her relations anymore (I guess it's related to the fact that she was making out a lot?) [IOI?]
- I learned that her ex-boyfriend is actually another exchange student.
- I told her some DHV stories: me going to New York spontaneously, me being in the student association of my business school...
- At some point I asked her to read in Hungarian (she is Hungarian but studies in France)... well that was hot.

Results:
Yes guys... 3 hours... and that's all... I don't even know what to think about it. In the end, I just managed to let her talk, teased and KINOed her a bit.

____________________________________________________________________

On the date.
Well, let's be honest. I like her... but I'm going nowhere with that kind of dates... except if she actually likes the fact that I'm different in the way that I don't try to make out with her... lol... In my dreams right? I feel like I'm being a bit AFC here but I dunno... A part of me prefers a nice date with a beautiful girl than a crazy make out with drunk girls tasting like beer... Yet, I did not even have the balls to be in the second situation. On another note, I don't really know how to react to the fact that she makes out with other guys... I don't know how to interpret it. Good sign? Bad sign?

On the Game.
- I'm way less anxious about what to talk about since I let her talk.
- I have to think about what I actually want when it comes to women.
- I need to learn these damn routines!

Next steps.
I would like to do the secret kiss close routine on her.

_________________
On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 9:11 pm 
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Her making out with other guys means she likes physical relations with MEN. GOOD SIGN. What is the difference between you and the MEN she is making out with spontaniously?

You are inspiring her to hang out with you, she already knows you are a nice guy. BoyFRIEND material if you will. Attraction isn't affection. Your light kino is falling on deaf ears for a girl who is capable of tossing her mouth around the bar scene at the drop of a hat. She might care that you think less of her for it, she might not.

Use the working assumption that although she says she is not too proud of her behaviour, she still behaves this way naturally. It is in her nature. SO:

Escalating is a premise you understand how to achieve and the basic priciples behind it.

Kino has its purpose, to move inward towards her center of physicality, this you know.

You're beating around the bush, literally, you are not taking the risk of trying to move in and make a move.

Kasabi made a good point about de escalation, swing for the fences right off the bat. You need to take the risk Daniel, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

These women in your life enjoy you and the rapport you have with them. you have a friendly frame, an air of intellect, some artsy qualities and the ability to make them laugh. This is all natural, all easy to achieve and very obvious to you how to do it.

That being said, is it getting you laid? you don't need routines, they are going to be useless if you are not being sexual in your interactions. Women expect you to be mature and aware of the sexual nature of your interactions, the sexual purpose and desires behind organizing ice cream dates and having friendly convos. If you don't make that obvious, the interaction becomes a thing between friends.
SUBTLY obvious, it isn't as hard as it sounds. Hell, if you can be comfortable with the idea of sex you can literally bring up a sexual topic directly and not scare her away.

You know how I am always talking about EYE FUCKING? seriously, you need to do it when you are conversing. You need to have sexually commanding body language, you need to sexually charge your kino. If you aren't getting aroused by the claw you are throwing at her, neither is she.

escalation hinges on the fact that you are allowing sexual energy to flow out of you, not repressing it.

i think the biggest thing for me was actually letting go of the fear that I would creep a girl out by being openly sexual.

In the quietest of places, pretend you can't hear her, make her lean in and speak directly in your ear. She finishes talking, you pull out. look at her, smile sexually and say "OH, much easier to hear you when you are close" lean in, put your hand on the back of her neck and say softly in her ear "See, this is much better, don't you think?"

Not that risky at all. She knows you could hear her, she likes your playfulness, your openly sexual attempt at moving the interaction upwards is officially out there, she has the choice of being weirded out or not. She doesn't have to say a thing if she likes it, and if she doesn't say a thing, you are going to increase the frequency of blatant sexual behaviour. this is just a small example, you can turn anything sexual.

Another thing to remember is she is LOOKING for reasons to be attracted to you. DHV is a small part, it lets her logical brain know "this guy is congruent with my logical interpratation of attractive lifestyle" but your physical cues are much more important. It lets her emotional center know "this guy is trying to fuck me, and I like it". It is what you don't say that will get you laid. Licking your lips, deliberatly touching your mouth for whatever reason, looking at her like she is FUCKING HOT and you like it...etc.

You have established the ability to get any women to like you, now you need to focus your energy on making them WANT you.

Questions, did you let princess know you thought it was hot when she read the hungarian? Did you tell her it was hot, did you look at her with arousal in your blood? Did you hide it? Do you feel fear ever when the idea of being sexual crosses your mind or enters into the interaction? If she is doing all the talking, does she ever try to move the convo in a sexual direction? If she did, how would you react?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:34 am 
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These women in your life enjoy you and the rapport you have with them. you have a friendly frame, an air of intellect, some artsy qualities and the ability to make them laugh. This is all natural, all easy to achieve and very obvious to you how to do it.

That being said, is it getting you laid? you don't need routines, they are going to be useless if you are not being sexual in your interactions. Women expect you to be mature and aware of the sexual nature of your interactions, the sexual purpose and desires behind organizing ice cream dates and having friendly convos. If you don't make that obvious, the interaction becomes a thing between friends.
SUBTLY obvious, it isn't as hard as it sounds. Hell, if you can be comfortable with the idea of sex you can literally bring up a sexual topic directly and not scare her away.

You know how I am always talking about EYE FUCKING? seriously, you need to do it when you are conversing. You need to have sexually commanding body language, you need to sexually charge your kino. If you aren't getting aroused by the claw you are throwing at her, neither is she.

escalation hinges on the fact that you are allowing sexual energy to flow out of you, not repressing it.

i think the biggest thing for me was actually letting go of the fear that I would creep a girl out by being openly sexual.
I really try to be more sexual in general, we openly spoke a bit about sex at the cinema, and even at the party, but I was not sure if I was really conveying a sexual tension yesterday, or at least I'm not sure to have been enough focused on this.
Quote:
In the quietest of places, pretend you can't hear her, make her lean in and speak directly in your ear. She finishes talking, you pull out. look at her, smile sexually and say "OH, much easier to hear you when you are close" lean in, put your hand on the back of her neck and say softly in her ear "See, this is much better, don't you think?"

Not that risky at all. She knows you could hear her, she likes your playfulness, your openly sexual attempt at moving the interaction upwards is officially out there, she has the choice of being weirded out or not. She doesn't have to say a thing if she likes it, and if she doesn't say a thing, you are going to increase the frequency of blatant sexual behavior. this is just a small example, you can turn anything sexual.
Got you.
Quote:
Another thing to remember is she is LOOKING for reasons to be attracted to you. DHV is a small part, it lets her logical brain know "this guy is congruent with my logical interpretation of attractive lifestyle" but your physical cues are much more important. It lets her emotional center know "this guy is trying to fuck me, and I like it". It is what you don't say that will get you laid. Licking your lips, deliberately touching your mouth for whatever reason, looking at her like she is FUCKING HOT and you like it...etc.

You have established the ability to get any women to like you, now you need to focus your energy on making them WANT you.
Yes indeed. I have a global idea how to do that: being sexual, KINO escalation... but I'm still having hard time to currently apply this. I'm too dispersed, I'm not consistent enough... sometimes I escalate fast then I freeze... I should focus more on an "escalation ladder" and reach the top.
Quote:
Questions, did you let princess know you thought it was hot when she read the Hungarian? Did you tell her it was hot, did you look at her with arousal in your blood? Did you hide it? Do you feel fear ever when the idea of being sexual crosses your mind or enters into the interaction? If she is doing all the talking, does she ever try to move the convo in a sexual direction? If she did, how would you react?
I told her that Hungarian turned me on. I'm not that afraid of being sexual... but the point is, I did not really feel this sexual tension in me... so I might not be congruent about it. I need a bit more for that to be really turned on. Yes! She naturally brought sex into the conversation: she told me she wanted to be more serious in her next sexual relations but then she started to speak about something else. I told her that we would speak about it (sexual stuff) later but we did not.

_________________
On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:55 am 
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Alright AFC Daniel man . . . I'm going to try to be as logical and gentle as possible:
Quote:
Context.
I went to a party on Friday night. My game was not really good even though I did escalate with Princess... The only thing is, I did not isolate her early enough and she ended making out with someone else. Truth is, she makes out with at least one guy per party... but well, not me. Anyways, we had to take an ice-cream together.
Isn't it interesting that you're wording it, "HER kissing guys and HER not kissing you?" The reality is that this is a girl who can't say no. They kissed her. You did not. This has nothing to do with knowledge, skills, looks, value, theory, etc . . . It all boils down to a decision. It's as simple as choosing vanilla or chocolate. Please make a decision soon.
Quote:
I wanted to rest after the party but I received a message from Princess:
Quote:
GOOD MORNING!! Ready for some ice cream today? I am free anytime this morning until 2h30! Bjs
Daniel! If I was your roommate, and we went out together Friday night(saw all that happened) . . . and then I saw you get this text from Princess, I probably would have gone ape shit. You are practically frustrating this girl to death. What kind of "crazy" requests an ICE CREAM date in the morning? She WANTED TO SEE YOU.

Now, if she made out with a few guys at the party, those guys would have pushed for an F close. She doesn't seem like the type who can say no. She called you in the morning with free time. Who ever fucked her probably didn't stick around long after shooting his seed down her throat. You're already becoming the 'reliable guy'. There are "GAY HAIR STYLIST" reliable guys and there are "BOYFRIEND" reliable guys: Again . . . this identity is not dependent upon luck, skills, value, etc . . . It's your decision and that's it.
Quote:
- I've spent 3 hours with her
Did you guys discuss stock market strategies? New advances in organ transplant procedures? Shifts in Global politics? I mean, what could possibly be sooooo important that you chat for 3 hours? I believe you when you say you listened to her intently but the only reason you did this is because you want to eventually fuck her. This means that in 3 hours, you're sitting there and waiting, waiting, and waiting for her to take a neon sign out of her bag that reads, "2:20 minutes. Congratulations. Now you can kiss me." You know this won't happen. The reality is that you THINK you're waiting for a 'kiss green light' but with every sign she's offered, you've turned them into legitimate excuses for non action.

You're sensitive and intelligent enough to read her signs but your mind is way too cluttered to properly interpret them.

So . . . the following is done hoping you see the humor in my reactions:
Quote:
- At some point, she let me know that she doesn't want to be that crazy in her relations anymore (I guess it's related to the fact that she was making out a lot?) [IOI?]
ZZZZZzzzzz. . .
Quote:
- I learned that her ex-boyfriend is actually another exchange student.
ZzZZzzzzzz. . .
Quote:
- I told her some DHV stories: me going to New York spontaneously, me being in the student association of my business school...
- At some point I asked her to read in Hungarian (she is Hungarian but studies in France)... well that was hot.


Zz...... Well, you get the picture. Now you're just beginning to fortify an "identity" that I am certain is undesirable to you.

Quote:
Well, let's be honest. I like her... but I'm going nowhere with that kind of dates... except if she actually likes the fact that I'm different in the way that I don't try to make out with her... lol... In my dreams right?


See . . . you KNOW everything.

Quote:
I feel like I'm being a bit AFC here but I dunno

This is the intelligent and logical "read"

Quote:
A part of me prefers a nice date with a beautiful girl than a crazy make out with drunk girls tasting like beer...


This is your habitual 'excuse maker' clutter.

Quote:
- I'm way less anxious about what to talk about since I let her talk
Probably because you had already given up on the idea of kissing her.
Quote:
- I have to think about what I actually want when it comes to women.
No, you already 'thought' about what you actually want with this particular woman. You've already made an internal decision. Now that the physical part seems like a 'challenge' to you, you're only thinking your way out of it. Avoid this.
Quote:
- I need to learn these damn routines!


How many different kiss close routines are you planning on doing to her? 10? Illogic's already got several tongue sucks out of ONE ROUTINE.

Quote:
Next steps.I would like to do the secret kiss close routine on her.


Change the above 'internal message' to "I will do the secret kiss close on her."

Daniel, you're a sweet non-combative guy. You aren't the confrontational type with others . . . which is why people seem to gravitate towards you in real life and online. Unfortunately, you're also non-confrontational with yourself. Meaning . . . if you don't feel like it, you don't do it; you don't want to 'feel uncomfortable'.

Well, you read the pimpin' thread. What is it? You want to kiss or don't you? Make up your mind! The caller in the Howard Stern show confessed that he felt uncomfortable pimping his girlfriend and he CHOSE NOT TO BE A PIMP. You've already directly and indirectly told us that it makes you feel uncomfortable to go for the kiss. . . so what is it? If you STILL WANT TO DO IT, then you're going to have to be 'uncomfortable' just for that SPLIT SECOND right? Think about it . . . it's literally a second prior to going for it and when you're lips meet but you will be uncomfortable for that short period of time. So hey, in that second, you might stutter, you might shake, you might drool, you might pee in your pants . . . seriously . . . who knows? But if it's what you want, you're going to have to do it.

*I can think of many, many things much more challenging than a second of discomfort in order to get some of things we want out of life.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:11 am 
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Quote:
Isn't it interesting that you're wording it, "HER kissing guys and HER not kissing you?" The reality is that this is a girl who can't say no. They kissed her. You did not. This has nothing to do with knowledge, skills, looks, value, theory, etc . . . It all boils down to a decision. It's as simple as choosing vanilla or chocolate. Please make a decision soon.
You're perfectly right.
Quote:
Daniel! If I was your roommate, and we went out together Friday night(saw all that happened) . . . and then I saw you get this text from Princess, I probably would have gone ape shit. You are practically frustrating this girl to death. What kind of "crazy" requests an ICE CREAM date in the morning? She WANTED TO SEE YOU.

Now, if she made out with a few guys at the party, those guys would have pushed for an F close. She doesn't seem like the type who can say no. She called you in the morning with free time. Who ever fucked her probably didn't stick around long after shooting his seed down her throat. You're already becoming the 'reliable guy'. There are "GAY HAIR STYLIST" reliable guys and there are "BOYFRIEND" reliable guys: Again . . . this identity is not dependent upon luck, skills, value, etc . . . It's your decision and that's it.
Let's be the second option. It's all about a decision as you said... Let's cut the bullshit. I'll take action tomorrow to see her.
Quote:
Did you guys discuss stock market strategies? New advances in organ transplant procedures? Shifts in Global politics? I mean, what could possibly be sooooo important that you chat for 3 hours? I believe you when you say you listened to her intently but the only reason you did this is because you want to eventually fuck her. This means that in 3 hours, you're sitting there and waiting, waiting, and waiting for her to take a neon sign out of her bag that reads, "2:20 minutes. Congratulations. Now you can kiss me." You know this won't happen. The reality is that you THINK you're waiting for a 'kiss green light' but with every sign she's offered, you've turned them into legitimate excuses for non action.

You're sensitive and intelligent enough to read her signs but your mind is way too cluttered to properly interpret them.
I should have made out with her in that damn church. That would have been fucking unique. The kissing part is definitely a sticking point, I realized it and took action the very same night at the party to get rid of this (report coming including Illogic's routine).
Quote:
So . . . the following is done hoping you see the humor in my reactions:
Quote:
- At some point, she let me know that she doesn't want to be that crazy in her relations anymore (I guess it's related to the fact that she was making out a lot?) [IOI?]
ZZZZZzzzzz. . .
Quote:
- I learned that her ex-boyfriend is actually another exchange student.
ZzZZzzzzzz. . .
Quote:
- I told her some DHV stories: me going to New York spontaneously, me being in the student association of my business school...
- At some point I asked her to read in Hungarian (she is Hungarian but studies in France)... well that was hot.


Zz...... Well, you get the picture. Now you're just beginning to fortify an "identity" that I am certain is undesirable to you.

Quote:
Well, let's be honest. I like her... but I'm going nowhere with that kind of dates... except if she actually likes the fact that I'm different in the way that I don't try to make out with her... lol... In my dreams right?


See . . . you KNOW everything.

Quote:
I feel like I'm being a bit AFC here but I dunno

This is the intelligent and logical "read"

Quote:
A part of me prefers a nice date with a beautiful girl than a crazy make out with drunk girls tasting like beer...


This is your habitual 'excuse maker' clutter.


This is a bit scary to me but seems like you already know me well. Please tell me when I surprise you, this might be a good sign.

Quote:
Quote:
- I'm way less anxious about what to talk about since I let her talk

Probably because you had already given up on the idea of kissing her.


I did indeed.

Quote:
Change the above 'internal message' to "I will do the secret kiss close on her."


I will do it.

Quote:
Daniel, you're a sweet non-combative guy. You aren't the confrontational type with others . . . which is why people seem to gravitate towards you in real life and online. Unfortunately, you're also non-confrontational with yourself. Meaning . . . if you don't feel like it, you don't do it; you don't want to 'feel uncomfortable'.


That's interesting. "if you don't feel like it, you don't do it"... well that childish attitude is in me. That's why I refused to go get that ice cream at the club with Little Miss Sunshine, that's why some days, I just did not open when I was in these malls in France. The only things that really moved me forward were the seeing my ex-gf picture with another guy, listening to Princess talking about that guy she might have spent the night with... That's because there's also a selfish jerk in me that does not want to be the last one in the place. Selfish jerk versus kid attitudes. These are too ingredients of a strange cocktail surprisingly giving birth to a "sweet guy" with an insane determination to change. (It's 2am right now, I might be analyzing quickly but that makes sense right now... and actually answers to some questions I've been asking myself.)

Quote:
Well, you read the pimpin' thread. What is it? You want to kiss or don't you? Make up your mind! The caller in the Howard Stern show confessed that he felt uncomfortable pimping his girlfriend and he CHOSE NOT TO BE A PIMP. You've already directly and indirectly told us that it makes you feel uncomfortable to go for the kiss. . . so what is it? If you STILL WANT TO DO IT, then you're going to have to be 'uncomfortable' just for that SPLIT SECOND right? Think about it . . . it's literally a second prior to going for it and when you're lips meet but you will be uncomfortable for that short period of time. So hey, in that second, you might stutter, you might shake, you might drool, you might pee in your pants . . . seriously . . . who knows? But if it's what you want, you're going to have to do it.

*I can think of many, many things much more challenging than a second of discomfort in order to get some of things we want out of life.


I have a report coming on the huge party from yesterday night. I stepped out of my comfort zone and did some routines. I'll publish it tomorrow I think.

_________________
On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:25 pm 
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I hope the "published story" has a kiss close in it.

Come on Daniel, you've had opportunity after opportunity. Your college years are the years you don't want to miss out on.

So keep pushing those limits man. We all want to hear you getting down and dirty with a cute Brazilian chick.

:wink:

Your in charge of your own destiny man. Go for it!

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:12 pm 
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Location: Paris, France.
DAY 58: huge student party.
Almost kiss closing and running some routines.

Context.
I spent 3 hours with Princess just basically listening and enjoying the weather... and pussying around too. lol. But I was confident for the party... every time I've been in this kind of situation (date with Smiling Artist and her bf), I ended up getting out of my comfort zone. I wanted to do the same Saturday night and have fun!

Adressed issues.
- I still have a lot to learn in night game.
- Poor dancing skills?
- I don't get enough out of my comfort zone.
- I'm unable to kiss close.

Goals.
- Escalate with a girl.
- Apply some routines.
- Kiss close.
- Enjoy myself

Strategy.
I wanted to apply the routines Illogic used several times: 'the almost kiss you" routine. Basically, start to dance with a chick, escalate physically and kiss close. I wanted to keep it simple.
____________________________________________________________________

I joined some other exchange students at a friend's place.

At my friend's place.
São Paulo's weather is a bitch. It started to rain like hell but I made it to my friend's place. HB Colombian was there... but there was also a bunch of French guys. I wanted to warm up a little and kill micro-avoidance before the party but it did not work well... I was not a huge fan of the French guys there. I mean, there were not mean or anything but I really did not like the French girl... She was arrogant and showing off a lot but she was a HB5 to me. For an unknown reason, they made me feel insecure... but I fought it and tried to be social. Arg not easy. Dunno what went wrong... but the night was not over. hey were not going to the same party anywas. The two German girls joined us a little after to go to the party... I had a better vibe with them. We got into a cab and went to the party.

At the party.
So I went at the party with 4 girls among which Colombian HB, Behing Blue Eyes and German Girl. :) We've got there. I've never seen something like this. I thought it was a simple party but it wasn't... It was a 4000 party I have in front of me. Ouch. I felt like the level was a bit high for someone who is not comfortable in night game. Whatever, let's get comfortable and enjoy the party. I wanted to have fun.

Getting drinks.
I danced a bit with the two German girls (Behing Blue Eyes and German girl) but was not enjoying the party... I was tired... so I offered them to go get some drinks. We went to the bar and I took a Caipirinha. German girls took the same and the barmaid told her that if she drunk it "in one time" she would get a free drink. I offered to do it for her. I did it and I got to drink my caipirinha and hers. :) Anyways, the party started to be fun. At some point, Behind Blue Eyes went to dance, German girl was following but I took her hand so she would stay a bit with me at the bar. I asked her to show me her tatoo. She has the sexiest tattoo I've ever seen... It's just at the bottom of her belly so I could only see a part of it. But it was a nice tribal stuff. That turned me on.
ME - It brings some fantasies in my mind right now...
HER - I'm sure it does...
ME - Actually these fantasies involved my tongue. [looking at her]
HER - ...

Seeing some natural guys.
I've already told you about that French natural guy that usually was the life of the parties? He was there and challenged a Spanish friend. Basically, the one who kissed more chicks wins. I've been observing them later. The other Daniel was here too.

Taking actions: Illogic's routine.
Okay, been there for one hour, I did nothing. Time to take action but was unable to open strangers for now. I went to the German girls, took her hand, isolated her and started to dance really close with her. Time for the Illogic's routine. I've been dancing and escalating as hell with her... I went for a kiss. She turned her head, told me I was a "bad guy". ;) We danced really close during 25 to 30 minutes, tried several time to kiss her, I ran the routines... "I'm gonna almost kiss you" but no result... I just got a kiss on the cheek...

Seeing a ghost.
While I was dancing, I noticed that Behind Blue Eyes was dancing with a Brazilian guy. She has a boyfriend and we happened to speak about it. She told me how serious she was. But the thing is... she was actually being kissed by the guy... At that moment, I freaked out. I thought about my ex... I pictured her doing the same thing while away from me... I was still dancing and German girl noticed I was being different. STOOOOOP. I had to stop that right now. 5 minutes later I told German girl I was tired of dancing. I took her hand and went to play a game. :)

Style's 5 lies routine.
I told her we should play a game and started to explain the 5 lies game... "I've seen it on the internet, that's funny... bla bla..." The delivery was a bit hard here since we could not hear each other but I went for it... I gave an example, then started to ask two stupid questions and told her...
ME - wow you're good, we should bet something...
HER - mmmm okay...
ME - mmmm let's think... If I win you'll show me your tattoo again
HER - ... [laughing]
ME - and if I lose... well what do you want...
HER - I dunno [come on!]
ME - you don't have any idea?
HER - mmmm okay, I'll tell you something someone told me about you. [?!]
ME - what?
That was strange cuz I'm winning in both cases... but whatever. I asked her how many questions I've asked her til now and she lost the game... She showed me her tattoo...I touched her and ask her to show me how far it goes (I was pointing at the top of her tight). I got her back to the group of exchange students and I tried to game some stranger...

Sucking at it.
I walked for 20 minutes in the party to open. I was bad... unable to figure out what to do... 4000 people dancing in the mud (the party was on a football field and it rained just before)... but I was not able to open... I've met the French natural guy and started to hang out with him.

Hanging out with the French guys.
He was crazy, he told me that it was difficult to make out tonight but he would not let the Spanish guy win... I followed him for a while, he was grabbing girls'hands and started to dance with them... Truth is, he got rejected a lot this way (but at least he was doing something). Every time he saw someone taking a picture, he went for it and I ended up being on picture with several unknown girls. We introduced ourselves to several girls but it was hard to actually go further... it was obvious that we were hitting on them and I confess I don't know how to handle this. Later, I've seen the other French guy, Daniel. It was a different style, he was focusing on one girl, dancing with her and escalating little by little... I like that. He was smiling, enjoying himself... I'm learning stuff from him... Too bad I did not see how he opened the girl.

Leaving the party.
I went back to the group of exchange students and we agreed on leaving. We left the party and waited outside for other people. At some point, I was with the two German girls waiting. We chatted a bit and Behing Blue Eyes had to go back to the party to find someone else. I stayed with German Girl for a while. I've been with her for 45 min waiting for the other one... I wanted to go home. Behing Blue Eyes called German Girl, she was not going home with me (she was going in the same direction as I did).

Being an "ass" and getting the finger.
I was tired of waiting and wanted to leave. I said goodbye to German Girl and something really strange happened... She told me "you're such an ass" and walk away... "what did I do?" she gave me the finger. My reaction was: "?!". I spoke to the taxi drive, nice guy, 25yo. We spoke about engagement.

Results: I did some routines, escalate with German Girl... and even got her insulting me... No kiss close though.
___________________________________________________________________

On the strategy.
I had no balls to open by just coming and dancing with a girl... I felt ridiculous at doing it, like all the guys hovering around the girls I was with... But what's ridiculous is actually is me being too proud to get rejected. Need to fix this. I'm happy though since I've been through strange inner game issue that night and I got over it.

On the game.
- I was able to finally do some routines... they helped me to get a bit further than an usual discussion.
- I can get back on my feet from a bad beginning but it's damn hard and it looks like a quick fix.
- I got out of my comfort zone but not enough...
- Seems like I need to drink to be good at dancing and enjoying the party... (for now)
- I've spent too much time with people I know again!
- Brazilian guys are sooooooo pushy... they're almost forcing girls to kiss them... I have some room to be creepy or dirty I think.
- I can be extremely direct and sexual when I feel comfortable enough (I offered her to lick her, lol)

Next: discovering why she gave me the finger... (I really had no clue).

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(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 3:43 am 
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Nice job Daniel. You've hit another milestone. Awesome, awesome, awesome. . . . Now that you're actually 'going for it', we can finally chat about some technique instead of sitting here like a bunch of teen-aged cheerleaders, urging you to "Go For It!"

So let's get right to it:
Quote:
Next: discovering why she gave me the finger... (I really had no clue).
. . . Because you're a wussy tease. (In her mind)

It doesn't matter if she puts her hand on your face or makes a gag face, if she's CONTINUING to dance with you, it means you are in. Girls are hypersensitive about this crap. They don't typically dance in public with people that disgust them or people they would fee 'ashamed' to bee seen with. Obviously . . . you already know that she is into you.

Now meditate a bit on how this German girl sees the World. What would it be like for her to go to school in a foreign country and go to parties? All the girls have everything figured out; they know the 'sluts', the 'queens', the 'rich girls', the 'poor girls'. the 'hot girls', etc . . . girls are nearly sadistically aware of their social environment. How do you think she perceives others and how do you think she perceives herself?

So you go for an initial K close. She playfully denies your advances. So this would be a good time to think about which needs are not being met for her to comply; this would be a good time to address these issues. Your story is enough to tell me that:

1. She's not making out with anybody in a bar/club full of people unless she's totally wasted or if she feels that those around her 'think' that she's with a 'boyfriend'.
2. She's not going to be the girl that goes around, makes out with 3 different guys at a bar, and then gets labeled an International 'slut'.
3. She's not going to simply kiss a guy who she thinks will then go off and kiss a few other girls just to win a 'bet'.
4. But she wants, wants, wants to kiss you.

As a man, your job is to carve a easy, smooth, guiltless path to her mind blasting orgasm. If she already gave you a "NO", then it's time to re-think your strategy instead of doing the same thing over and over again. So a girl like this negs you and you just smile it off and go, "You are just so fucking hot . . ." then go right off into some 'fantasy dates'. All the cool places you've been to around the World. . . perhaps all the places she's been around the World . . .and then "Oh, we're definitely doing that together/next year/before getting out to the real World". What you want to plant in her brain is that you're ALREADY thinking about your time together in the future instead of fucking and chucking her and going off to the next 'international slut'. Chat about possible fun dates: "Oh, that ____ bar! It's so much fun! We're definitely going next week!" (High five)

Instead of all ^this, you pretty much ejected when she gave you a simple test and began walking around scoping out other chicks. Believe me . .. she was watching you the whole time. Instead of sticking to your guns, you essentially proved to her that you're a "Player" . . . and a horribly untalented player. . .

The middle finger? It's a combination of "You broke my heart" + "Wow, and you're going home alone" . . which means . . . "You broke my heart and you're a fucking chump."

Call her for a date. Get more numbers. Get more dates. Go to more parties. Everything is looking good.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 6:11 pm 
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Quote:
I hope the "published story" has a kiss close in it.

Come on Daniel, you've had opportunity after opportunity. Your college years are the years you don't want to miss out on.

So keep pushing those limits man. We all want to hear you getting down and dirty with a cute Brazilian chick.

:wink:

Your in charge of your own destiny man. Go for it!
Actually that my last semester as a student... so yes, I better enjoy it!

But you got it Tweeby... I wanna have results without putting my hands in the dirt... that's not gonna happen unfortunately...

- kissing a drunk girl? too dirty for my ego.
- kissing a girl that has been making out with random guys? too dirty for my ego.
- dancing and hovering a stranger in order to make he dance with me? too ridiculous for my ego...

This is stupid but changing takes some time...

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On the Road to Manhood, my new learning journal: http://bit.ly/TEVapM
(My old learning journal http://bit.ly/eYRWL4)


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