Even scientific studies are clueless about bad vs nice guy



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:02 pm 
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Even scientific studies contradict each other about the topic "Bad Guys vs. Nice Guys"! - What's your take?

I thought only science can enlighten us whether women like bad guys or nice guys. Yet even they are clueless. See there are two studies which examines what kind of guys women like in general. But they contradict each other, or am I just misunderstand them? What's your take? What survey is correct in your opinion?

Here's the first survey. It says women prefer the bad guy over the nice guy:
“Academic studies have reaffirmed that women prefer the bad boy archetype over the nice guy. A 2008 study at New Mexico State University in Las Cruces examined how college students perceived “dark” traits such as thrill-seeking behavior, deceitfulness and narcissism. The study found the female students preferred the males with these traits.”

Yet here's a second survey which says the majority of women would pick the nice guy:
"Herold & Milhausen (1998) asked a sample of undergraduate women: 'You meet two men: One, John, is nice but somewhat shy. He has not had any sexual experience. The other, Mike, is attractive, a lot of fun, and has had intercourse with 10 women. Both wish to date you. Whom do you choose?'
54% reported a preference for "John," 18% preferred "Mike," and the rest had no preference."


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 4:09 pm 
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<a href="http://kezianoble.org/">Kezia Noble</a> said it best about 'nice guys':
"nice guys are bland, boring, forgetable and replaceable! coca cola has the best marketing in the world if it marketed itself as bland, boring, forgettable and replaceable would it sell as well"

if you market yourself as the person who displays all the traits of the nice guy straight away quite frankly you're coming off as the guy who is no fun, not exciting, has no charm and are bland boring forgettable and replaceable!

the same is said for women too arent we just as judgemental when it comes to women im gonna give you an example: i was quite attracted to Pixie Lott(the singer) i think she is quite attractive and she always looks good apparently http://www.rightcelebrity.com/?p=6068

then i saw a picture of her with horrid glasses and spots that make her look like shes got chicken pox frankly if i saw this girl in a night club i wouldnt look at her twice
http://www.mirror.co.uk/celebs/news/200 ... -21467999/

the point i am making is we all judge straight away, if you project yourself wrong then your going to be overlooked, i dont mean be a complete asshole or the guy who agrees with everything she says.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:11 pm 
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"Nice guy" and "bad boy" can mean all kinds of things. The spectrum covers a whole range of behaviours. A bad boy who is just a charmless thug isn't going to get laid. A nice guy with a huge social network, tons of social proof who is good with Kino, gets girls in the right state and flies in under the radar, gets laid a lot.
However, all things being equal it is better to be bad than nice. It is just a hell of a lot more complicated than that implies.

It is really better to be strong, confident, sexual, empathetic, charming and fun than either of these extremes.

Additionally, women tend to bullshit you quite a lot if you ask them about this. They never want to admit they are attracted to jerks even when they obviously are. There's no easy way of allowing for that in a scientific study and eliminating bias.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:27 pm 
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Its not about being nice or being bad, its about being STRONG! Strong enough to be "bad" to a person that did not behave to your expectations, nice enough to people who YOU THINK really deserve that SPAM. Strong enough to behave in the way you think you should, without acting in fear or for approaval.

Most studies about sexual attraction fail, because they are done by clueless nerdy people(my intention is not to offend). 80% of them even think females are attracted to male looks, because "male are attracted to female looks, so the reserve should be true. Imo, forget those studies, and watch the real world, that has the awnser.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:29 pm 
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Quote:
"Nice guy" and "bad boy" can mean all kinds of things. The spectrum covers a whole range of behaviours. A bad boy who is just a charmless thug isn't going to get laid. A nice guy with a huge social network, tons of social proof who is good with Kino, gets girls in the right state and flies in under the radar, gets laid a lot.
However, all things being equal it is better to be bad than nice. It is just a hell of a lot more complicated than that implies.

It is really better to be strong, confident, sexual, empathetic, charming and fun than either of these extremes.

Additionally, women tend to bullshit you quite a lot if you ask them about this. They never want to admit they are attracted to jerks even when they obviously are. There's no easy way of allowing for that in a scientific study and eliminating bias.
I don't think it's that easy. Girls who are into jerks have weird relationships with their father. Normal girls are more prone to liking normal guys i.e. no jerk kind of guy


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:31 pm 
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i know s.o. who fits to the jerk stereotype. he's on every party. and girls like him.... but only ugly girls with low self esteem. the last one even dumped him.... lol


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:35 pm 
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I don't think it's that easy. Girls who are into jerks have weird relationships with their father. Normal girls are more prone to liking normal guys i.e. no jerk kind of guy
No, that's a get-out clause women use to rationalize their stupid behaviour.

Of course, a woman gets her male role-model from her Father and tends to subconsciously seek that out in a man. This is, however, a totally separate concept from why women like jerks.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:40 pm 
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Quote:
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I don't think it's that easy. Girls who are into jerks have weird relationships with their father. Normal girls are more prone to liking normal guys i.e. no jerk kind of guy
No, that's a get-out clause women use to rationalize their stupid behaviour.

Of course, a woman gets her male role-model from her Father and tends to subconsciously seek that out in a man. This is, however, a totally separate concept from why women like jerks.
where's your proof for that?


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:49 pm 
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I think there's also a tendency between likink jerks and being intelligent: the more intelligent you are the less likeli you'll like a jerk


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:14 pm 
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Quote:
Even scientific studies contradict each other about the topic "Bad Guys vs. Nice Guys"! - What's your take?

I thought only science can enlighten us whether women like bad guys or nice guys. Yet even they are clueless. See there are two studies which examines what kind of guys women like in general. But they contradict each other, or am I just misunderstand them? What's your take? What survey is correct in your opinion?

Here's the first survey. It says women prefer the bad guy over the nice guy:
“Academic studies have reaffirmed that women prefer the bad boy archetype over the nice guy. A 2008 study at New Mexico State University in Las Cruces examined how college students perceived “dark” traits such as thrill-seeking behavior, deceitfulness and narcissism. The study found the female students preferred the males with these traits.”

Yet here's a second survey which says the majority of women would pick the nice guy:
"Herold & Milhausen (1998) asked a sample of undergraduate women: 'You meet two men: One, John, is nice but somewhat shy. He has not had any sexual experience. The other, Mike, is attractive, a lot of fun, and has had intercourse with 10 women. Both wish to date you. Whom do you choose?'
54% reported a preference for "John," 18% preferred "Mike," and the rest had no preference."
It sounds like the second "study" was just a survey? I think it's been established that most girls will _say_ they like "nice" but will actually _feel_ attraction for the other guy. How did they do the first study? Was it more realistic than just asking?

Do you have links to the actual studies to see how they were done and do a proper evaluation? News reporting on scientific studies generally seems to be crap...


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:17 pm 
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unfortunately not. Yet I made the same survey as the second one: People could vote anonymously. And the results were exactly the same.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:33 pm 
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Its not about being nice or being bad, its about being STRONG! Strong enough to be "bad" to a person that did not behave to your expectations, nice enough to people who YOU THINK really deserve that SPAM. Strong enough to behave in the way you think you should, without acting in fear or for approaval.

Most studies about sexual attraction fail, because they are done by clueless nerdy people(my intention is not to offend). 80% of them even think females are attracted to male looks, because "male are attracted to female looks, so the reserve should be true. Imo, forget those studies, and watch the real world, that has the awnser.
My female therapist thinks women are attracted to male looks too... and somehow I think she'd have a decent credibility in the area!


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:35 pm 
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unfortunately not. Yet I made the same survey as the second one: People could vote anonymously. And the results were exactly the same.
Women lie to _themselves_ too, you know. After all, "I can't possibly be so shallow that a bad boy turns me on, I must like nice guys. I just can never find one, all men are jerks so this jerk will change for me... I mean, there are some married nice guys so they must have changed for their wives right?"


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:42 pm 
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but where's the proof for your statement? I can as easily say: Maybe you're lying to yourself, too.

After all: "How can I be so unattractive that me being nice and honest doesn't work on women while others do. I bet they've got to be mean to them/ have lots of money/ are great in bed/ or other 'tricks' "


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:20 pm 
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Just asking questions is a pretty weak study. I wouldn't put much faith in either survey. Depending how the questions are asked, most girls will just answer logically. It sounds like each survey had loaded questions. Of course, we all know attraction isn't logical.

What needs to be done is a third party observational study. Recording what actually goes on. I'll bet the more social and exciting guys get laid way more than the rest. Regardless of what label they're given.


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