Hey guys,
firstly i think this forum is gold There are hundreds of thousands of AFC's out there who simply cannot admit to being a loner,depressed and down-right pathetic when it comes to women. The first step always admitting the truth and forums like this can only help many out.

Ok let me get straight to the point - I have had a fairly unsuccessful history with women and never had a proper gf.only meaningless flings that i had no real control over. I am not interested in HB's right now and there are alot of AB's (Average Babes) i wanna work on first . Now the methods and and tips ive been reading,watching and listening to have me amped up and ready to obviously take on the world in a new light.This last weekend i went out there and acted like a new man.... in no time i had 4 AB's eating out the palm of my hand .My rapport skills are pretty good but i see this as my biggest downfall. A women will tag me 'just a friend' within 15-20 minutes i rate.and not only that but a 'best guy friend' aswell
I just wanna know if there are some key aspects i can work on when it comes to completely killing the friendship image and getting into the make out zone rather.

Like i say im not worried about HB's right now but i will at a later stage

Any help appreciated and once again.....thanks and good luck to everyone out there

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Its time for a change....a huge Mother@#$@# change!

the only things that aren't HBs are UBs.

and don't lie to us. You're interested in HBs. You just feel like you're not good enough, and guess what? working on UBs first isn't gonna make it any easier to walk up to that HB10.

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Every Saint has a Past, Every Sinner has a Future

^ this is just stupid advise.

I have no advise for your OP but dont listen to this.

Often the AFC is more comfortable around less attractive girls.

A newb who is looking to improve his game must start on girls he isnt intimidated by. he must work his way up.

since when was sarging a HB10 the goal?

for a lot of guys on here simply overcoming the anxiety they have with women is the goal.

OP, you must lead the conversation in a more sexual direction. Take that risk.

Talk about what gets your horny, mention a time a HB got you aroused, it is a subtle form of negging.

Tell her what she should wear which would make her look more hot.

I agree with this. You have to inject sexual subjects in the conversation. Sometimes you will get a uncomfortable look from your target, but that is necessary to transition from friend zone to the fuck zone. For example throughout the conversation slowly escelate the sexual topics by talking about sexual situations about someone else, and maybe turn it into a joke. Like man my buddy was caught doing 69 by his mom. So now that you are on the subject, ask her what was the most emberassing sexual experience. Then the subject has been subtle opened and you can steer it anyway you want from there.

At this point you have already broken the ice in the subject. Also during all this you have to remember to touch her, smell her get close to her and have her start thinking about u in a sexual vs a guy who she really has good conversation with. Good luck

ABs are actually ofter harder than HBs, since their averageness has forced them to develop a personality.

The sexual banter has been mentioned already, however in my experience the single most important thing (aside from the sexual banter) is to TEASE her. This is spoken about alot in the community but most underestimate it.

If you can remember to do just this one thing, it will take you places. How many guys in the friend zone do you see issuing a remark that makes the girl laugh, squirm, make her shyly look at the ground and then back up at the guy with wide gazing eyes hungry for more. You dont see guys in the friend zone doing that, ever!

The reason why teasing from the minute you meet her is such an important aspect is that most people only start teasing each other once they know each other well (this applies to your guy friends too!). No AFC would DARE tease a beautiful girl on the first night of meeting her (or ever) as he doesnt have the confidence to do so. Be the guy that is teasing her after 1 min of knowing her and this will show extreme confidence, just by doing this you will single yourself out and will not only create attraction, but will make her day. She will REMEMBER you as that fun that fun guy that wants to see and be teased by again. No-one else does this, as you know most people tip toe around strangers by default, especially hot girls, do the exact opposite its really as simple as that.

Teasing also shows that you are extremely comfortable around people in general and are a great peoples person, ie. you have lots of experience with people and are probably very popular because of it. (people that are not liked and not popular dont get to speak to many people!)

And tease every single girl that you possibly can, seriously, practice on EVERYONE. It improves your wit like you wont believe and you will eventually become this flirting machine. Most experienced guys do this without even thinking and sometimes have to stop themselves as they realize they're seducing their own mother! (not quite, but you get my drift)

How do you know they're tagging you as a friend? You may be creating a self-fulfilling prophecy ie. BELIEVING they see you as a friend, so you refrain from trying to pick them up and then BEHAVING according to your own, potentially incorrect, assessment.

Simple ways to avoid this are to inject a sexual tone. You say that you're good at building a rapport, so this will work in your favour as they won't view you as a 'predator' as such. Build their trust up and let them do the work to get to you. Maybe drop an innuendo and see how they respond. If that doesn't work, then try a few kino's. Maybe even set up a kino with a neg? "Your hands are so tiny! I bet that my little finger is bigger than your index finger, here give me your hand."
By negging them, it's contrasting with the usual characteristics you'd associate with being 'a friend' - like kindness, politeness, friendliness.

Hope that helps.

Good Luck!




phoenix;!

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The day I stop having fun with anything will be the day I walk away..

thats not a neg....depending how that was said its more of a tease. negs dont make her laugh. negs are a compliment followed by a negative remark in order to get her to qualify herself. eg. 'thats a nice dress...a liiiittle outdated, but cute nonetheless' (note there is nothing funny about it, but she will be on your case about why you think its outdated). Your example is more of a tease.

Thanks for the heads up, still learning you see, first week here . We were all like me at one point, except maybe not quite as cool haha.




phoenix;!

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The day I stop having fun with anything will be the day I walk away..

I agree with what KristalNacthe said he's right. Approaching UB (ugly beast) because you think they'll be easier well not prepare you to approach the HB's. I know the UB are most ones likely to give you a hard time. Plus why settle for low quality women you're not really attracted too just because your afraid of getting your little ego bruised by HB and if you get a UB you'll never be satisified ever.
There's really no such thing as working your way up to a HB just need to get your confidence up.

Will tang's advice comes from his inexperience and show's he the type of guy who takes what he can get. he's pretty much in the same boat as you with approaching HB's .....as in he's afraid too
that quote.... seriously if you weren't picking up UB you wouldn't need to be her fashion consultant.

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Friendzone 1-vt51424.html?postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

bullshit.

I think the single most detrimental mindset in the community is the one that we should all start out hitting on the 8+'s

a HB will have sexual experience. and they know they can find another guy is the sex isn't up to their standards. so they won't go for someone without sexual confidence... so getting a wrap sheet of average chicks under your belt WILL make the HB sarging much more successful.

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If you want to know how to be successful with women, learn to obediance train your dog...

It only makes sense. I mean I learned to crawl before I learned to walk and then I learned to Game lol. Average chicks are great way to practice. Also, looks aren't everything. I ve met many average girls that are worth more in people's eyes than a 8+ bimbo. I mean yeah great it's always nice to have a 8+ on the end of your dick but if you are looking for a potential relationship sometime in the future a whole package is something everyone should be looking for.

Many hot girls have looks and they know it, and don't do much in their life to improve anything else. They learn this cold truth when they get old and find out that they can't rely on looks alone. Anyways, to get off my soap box, in my opinion the standard for PUA is not only looks alone, it's the whole package. We shouldn't be calling each other out for picking up ABs.

WTF, approaching and speaking to ANY HB will improve your game (and confidence) with ANY OTHER HB, how can it not, its called practicing people skills!

You telling me that approaching ten HB 6's in a night (and having a 5 min convo with each) is not going to improve your confidence and conversation skills in general? Bullshit.

You telling me that a guy thats never approached in his life before, versus a guy thats been approaching HB 6's for the past year will be on the same level when it comes to gaming an HB 9/10? Youre dreaming.

Nah you are not reading everything people are writing. It's not that approaching HBs will not give you the practice, what some people are saying is that confidence building for them would be better off if they started with less intimidating ladies. Now everyone has the natural conversational skills. Some people have too much anxiety dealing with 8+

It's just that for some it has to be a gradual building approach.

the thing is, AA doesn't go away on those HB10s with practice on UBs.

So in terms of getting in the fight, they aren't putting themselves in any better position.


and there is a difference between passively gaming a UB due to proximity and specifically targeting UBs out of desperation and sense of inadequacy.

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Every Saint has a Past, Every Sinner has a Future