I just wonder what the difference between a PUA and a non-PUA is when it comes to an established relationship? Is there even a difference? How can I be the supperior "bf" or "husband" that a guy who hasn't practiced PUA can't? I've heard that members say that they use the techniques they have learned on their boss, friends and in normal social situations, how does that work?

Extra question: if I'm looking for a long term relationship only, should I still be going fast-forward? Kiss her on the first date and try to get her in bed as quickly as possible or would that be a bad idea?

It all comes down to frame control. Being the same person through out the entire relationship.
Yes. Most girls meet their boyfriends at a party.

Stop being so in love with the idea of a relationship and fall in love with a girl instead... I actually say fall in love with several of them but to each his own

[/quote]It all comes down to frame control. Being the same person through out the entire relationship.[/quote]

Yes, but how does it differ then? From PUA and non-PUA? The non-PUA would become more and more alike with the PUA as far as confidence goes, because it wouldn't matter that much in a well established relationship. People are confident around others when they get to know them... (Of course, she would still probably want a confident man that can talk infront of a crowd and have that kind of confidence as well if you know what I mean..). Would a girl benefit from going into a long-term relationship with a PUA? Would he be better than the average man in long term the same way he's "superior" short term?



[/quote]Yes. Most girls meet their boyfriends at a party.[/quote]

Was this sarcastic? I don't know much about life...

I dont think you can fool your way into a LTR. My observation (and personal experience) is this:

1) Girls play the game to get a strong male, to feel comfortable, to feel safe, and to ultimately procreate. (props to: Mystery)

2) Dudes play the game so that (in a nutshell) they dont have to play the game anymore.
Beyond the desire for game free sex, guys have to compartmentalize fear and be strong so that they can carve out a world safe from other predators for their family. I mean, who the fuck really wants to be on the alert for predators all the time with no feeling of safety? Cortisol overload is not healthy.

---
The mistake I see everywhere is that a dude mans up to get the woman (sweeps her off her feet), and then after the LTR begins, he starts to soften up to her (imo, most of us dudes are peace-loving at heart and want to give to our woman). Once the safety is in place we forget that safety is temporary and only as good as our ability to maintain it.

This is the trap.

Once you start deferring solely to her (because you're really a pacifist at heart ) you are actually underminining your own relationship - you're not being strong for her anymore. She loves you (prbly) but being a woman she continues to sub-conciously shit-test you to see if youre still stronger than her (for safety/comfort reason) .... which you (again.. because you love her and dont want to be controlling) unwittingly fail and cant figure out why. Some time down the road you feel emasculated/bitter and she is in total control of the relationship and running it in the same convoluted manner that she manages her purse. Pulling out of this means a huge social adjustment which, if you're not inherently strong enough, will be an ugly mess --- because it means you have to win back power which you might not have had from the start.

IMO, the best thing is to work on your inner game and be confident w/out a woman first. It's a lonely world out there and it seems you just have to embrace the fear, accept the lonely, and do what men have been doing for thousands of years... compartmentalize (i.e hide the fear). It's scary as shit.. but that's what being male is all about.

The only other thing I have to add here is that you HAVE to find a way to de-compartmentalize sometimes (allow yourself to not have to be strong) or the stress will kill you - try Tai-Chi, Yoga, Prayer, Mathematics, Higher Education, etc... whatever brings a sense of peace, sharpens your strengths, and offers a lack of need to perform externally - these things build confidence and ultimately help you DHV.

The irony is that once you start being proactive in becoming self-fulfilled, and thus less fearful, the rest will fall into place. I'll tell you when I get there

Or more succicntly: social climbing downwards is much easier than social climbing upwards.

_________________
Total f*ckin' noob

PUA was not built upon gaining an LTR. It was conceived to sleep with attractive, sought after women by setting yourself aside from everyone else. PUA isn't for relationships, not long term relationships at least.

If you want a girlfriend don't use techniques, don't try the PUA mentality and for the love of god don't listen to half the shit you read on forums.

All you should ever take from PUA when it comes to building a relationship or finding a girlfriend is the self-improvement part of Pick Up. Work on your inner game and outer game. That's all. Learn to be comfortable with women and build the confidence to approach women and show an interest in them but learn how to approach without being weird or intimidating.

If you come across a girl you like approach her. Say "Hi, you look very cute and I wanted to say hello." That's all you need from PU. Then move towards getting her number. Use the false time constraint, get her number, have some interest from her before you leave then call her the next day or so and meet up with her in a public low-pressure environment. If you hit it off ask her out again and ramp it up. By the third date you just want to have some investment from her such as a kiss. That's all. Forget about PUA after that or the tricks, techniques, etc. You're not trying to fuck and toss this girl, you're trying to have her as your girlfriend so you need to show her you have all the characteristics of a boyfriend.

Only a kiss by the third date?

I can't imagine not kissing on the first, if not sleeping with the girl.

Welcome to the real world.

I settled for that with my current GF. She made me wait a loooooong time before having sex to test me after I overgamed the fuck out of her. Wich goes to prove the whole point: PUA is of very limited use if you want a girl for the long haul.