Second date kiss close, but flakes for the third date. Why?



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:35 am 
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This is going to be a long post, so before I begin I just want to say thank you to everyone in advance that takes the time to read this and reply. Much appreciated.

So there's this girl (I guess that's how most of these posts start), I met in my gym about 12 years ago. If it matters, at the time i was 23 and she was 17 (I'm 34 now and she's 28). We worked in the same mall as well so we also took many breaks together as well as visited each other at our respective stores that we worked at. There was definitely an instant connection between us but we never took things further because at the time the age difference seemed like a big deal. We've kept in touch over the years mostly through MSN messenger back in the day and now more recently with Facebook. A year or two could have gone by, but whenever we reconnected online, that connection was always there. We reconnected recently through Facebook which transitioned to texting each other every now and then. A few weeks ago she called me out of the blue to hang out. Now... at the time she called me, I was in a 6 year relationship which I was on the verge of ending (both me and my partner who are back in school had exams coming up and I was going to do it after that). We went out for drinks later that night. The connection was instantly there. It's like we never had time apart. She's been single since September and we talked about my relationship situation as well. She also kept mentioning how good looking I am. She also asked "how come we never dated?" The answer is we've both never been single at the same time until now. A few minutes after our "date" I get a text from her saying she had so much fun, how we had to get together again, and how I'm just as handsome as I was back when she first met me. I broke up with my partner a few days later (and it wasn't for this girl. It was going to happen regardless). So this past Sunday we had our second "date." Again, it went really well. Again, she mentioned how I was the "cutest thing ever." On the walk home she did something a bit weird though. A couple of girls came up to me to ask where a certain bar was and the girl I was with was about to try to get thier number for me. I dragged her away though before she did this because I wasn't interested. We get back to my apartment parking lot and we get in the car and she pulls around to the front of my building. I say "I want to kiss you right now but it might be a bit too early," to which she responds "really?". We stare and smile at each other for a few seconds. Then I ask her "do you think it's too early?" She's about to answer and I decided to just go in for the kiss. There was no pullback or hesitation from her and this lasted for a few seconds. I tell her to text me when she gets home, which she does, which starts off a series of texts about what just happend. Here's the conversation:


Her: Home

Me: All in one piece? And that was really quick!

Her: Except My man handled wrist

Me: Lol. If u swell up tomorrow just tell them that guy that showed to ur work did it
That's who I would blame
No one would believe u if u told them it was me

Her: Haha

Me: I had a really fun night with you again
And for the record, I should have kissed u a bit longer

Her: Lol

Me: Actually that was my only regret if the night--- that I didn't kiss u long enough lol

Her: Now she can hate me I guess

Me: Lol
I just want to let u know that I am completely over her. I have been for a very long time. I was more asking if
YOU thought it was too soon because I totally understand what u might be thinking

Her: What might I be thinking

Me: Well besides how good looking u think I am, u might be thinking its weird kissing someone that just got out of a relationship.

Her: No I can tell ur over her it's just hard taking someone out of a 10 yr friend zone
I didn't know u wanted to kiss me at all lol

Me: No? How could I not want to? Ur too cute!

Her: Can I ask u something

Me: Go ahead

Her: Since wen did u want to kiss me lol

Me: I think I have two answers to that

Her: No wonder u didn't want that girls # lol

Me: Lol duh!

Her: Lol

Me: First.... I knew I was going to kiss u tonite

Her: How
Lol

Me: Like even before we went out
I just felt it

Her: 2nd

Me: Lol
And I think I've just always wanted to kiss you since we first met about 12 years ago

Her: Lol

Me: Any more questions? Lol

Her: So I'm the first person u kissed since u broke up
?

Me: Well besides my mom and sister, yeah

Her: Lol I'm assuming those weren't on the lips

Me: Lol. No.
And whether u admit it or not I know you wanted to kiss me

Her: I'm just surprised is all
I almost got u another girls #

Me: Lol! Well in glad u didn't. Even if I had to drag u away

Her: Lol you are cute

Me: So are u

Her: Surprised?
Yes

Me: Lol... No I meant u r cute too. And stop being surprised. Just accept it lol

Her: See I think I'm worried

Me: About?

Her: I feel like I just got u back in my life
And I don't want anything to ruin our bond

Me: Our bond is stronger now. Sealed by our lips lol
So nothing to worry about

Her: Well ur freshly single u should mingle
I've been single for 8 mos and I want to settle my butt down

Me:
I want to settle down too once I find the right person. Lets just take it day by day and see what happens
All I know is that right now, I really enjoy being with u

Her: I'm a handful

Me: A handful of goodness

Her: Hahah you are so biased
I love it

Me: Lol. Biased in what way? Cause I haven't seen ur evil side yet?

Her: I have to go to bed but I wanted to tell u something

Me: Go ahead

Her: I hope u don't think I was purposely advising u to end your relationship for selfish reasons I actually said wat I said cuz I care and think u deserve better
Just for the record

Me: Lol. I never once thought that. Like I said my relationship was over a couple of years ago. It was only in the last
Couple of months (before we began talking) that I started to build the courage to end things
Anyway. I know u have to get to bed

Her:
Ok I'm glad
Well not that ur relationship crumbled
U know what I mean!

Me: Lol. I do!

Her: Kk lol I had fun tonight too, talk to u tmrw

I waited until tuesday to text her again. We exchanged a few jokey texts and then set up another get together for wednesday night after she was done work. So yesterday comes along and she flakes on me a couple of hours before we were supposed to meet up. She just said "can't make it tonight." So not even an apology. I just replied back "k" and haven't texted her since. Getting laid is not my number one goal here. I actually really like this girl and I'd really like to pursue a serious relationship with her, but I do know that the pua rules still apply. So.... any idea why she would flake? She's obviously a bit scared of me just getting out of a relationship. I know too she's talking about this friend zone, but the reality is we were never really friends. We've always been attracted to each other and every year or so we would just briefly catch up. Did I reveal too much in my texts? I was too AFC? How badly did I screw up in our text exchange? And if i screwed up, am I pretty much dead in the water or is there a way to salvage this? What should I do from here on in? Thanks again to everyone in advance that takes the time to read this and reply. Much appreciated.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:17 am 
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I’m not sure where to start here….but I think I’ll go with this.

Her shift in mindset: I think this started as soon as you hesitated a little too often on the kiss. You should have either JUST kissed her, or kissed her as soon as she said “Really?”

This may have made her think, “hmm, he’s hesitating…maybe he’s not over her.” If you were in fact over it, you should have been a bit more confident in going for the kiss. BUT, she did kiss you and it sounded like it went great.

Your shift from mysterious old acquaintance to AFC: Seems you did everything right until the kiss. You were hitting at the point of attack. But afterwards, presumably, after you reached a big goal (the kiss), it looks like you rested on your laurels and tried to put it on cruise control. Meaning, you lost control of the situation. The ball was in your court and she was chasing (she was looking for ways to compliment you). Now, she has the ball and has you scrambling (you are wondering why it seems she’s lost interest in you).

What happened? Read the texts over and see if you feel the same awkwardness that I do. Way too many “LOLs” that you really DED start sounding like you were in the friend zone. There is something to say about being mysterious: it keeps people interested and guessing. After all of your comments though, you left nothing to think about. She was totally clear on how you felt about her, and at that point, the levels of attraction were on two sides of a big chasm. That chasm was a lot smaller earlier in the night, wasn’t it?

The good news is, you have the first half down pat. You are friendly and engaging (and good looking apparently) so it wont be tough to get the foot in the door. Now its about getting out of your relationships funk (i.e. left-over relationship residue that makes you do relationshippy things that may seem awkward to a single chick).

In the future, embrace the uncertainty. You looked like you were so eager to hear what she thought of you (thus, you awkwardly asking when she wanted to kiss you). Plus, there was way too much chatter regarding this ex of yours. She obviously wasn’t convinced that you were over it.

Questionable comments:

• Me: First.... I knew I was going to kiss u tonite

Girls love some spontaneity and being “in the moment.” Many aren’t too fond of premeditated acts. Sometimes “I don’t know, crazy things happen in life sometimes and you have to go with it” is your get out of jail free card when she suspects you’re being shady.

• Me: Well besides how good looking u think I am, u might be thinking its weird kissing someone that just got out of a relationship.

Her: No I can tell ur over her it's just hard taking someone out of a 10 yr friend zone
I didn't know u wanted to kiss me at all lol

You shouldn’t even be talking about your ex anyways. Now you’ve created more focus on the topic so you left her with a tough decision. And what a bitchy thing to say that she is taking you out of her own 10 year friend zone. She definitely took your balls here.

• Me: Lol. No.
And whether u admit it or not I know you wanted to kiss me

This is going out on a limb. You NEED a positive reaction here or you really start looking stupid. And this is AFTER you asked her if she feels comfortable with kissing you right?

• Me: Our bond is stronger now. Sealed by our lips lol
So nothing to worry about

Her: Well ur freshly single u should mingle
I've been single for 8 mos and I want to settle my butt down

She ignored what was supposed to be your joke, to tell you that you should enjoy being single. Not good. She’s basically saying “I don’t think we have that much of a bond.” If she was interested in keeping you around, she would have said something to help preserve that. In this case, she just bluntly stated that the both of you are not only on different levels of attraction, but at different points in life.

Moving forward: Let it go man. If she flakes with that phrase(above) and without an alternative date, she doesn’t want to see you as much as you want to see her.

What a great learning point though. Start focusing on learning more about the second half of your game: texting, calling, sustaining rapport and attraction.

Hope this helps man!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 1:03 pm 
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Wow. Thanks for the reply. I knew I screwed up but I didn't realize I screwed up that badly. I'm not going to text her anymore, but if there is the slight chance she does text me back in the future, whether its in a few days, next month, or next year, what should I do?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 1:15 pm 
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I wanted to break my computer while reading that dude! lol

Dude dude dude.. Slow the F*** down lol

Why are you so eagerly thinking about a relationship when you just got out of one? Thats is not attractive dude. A girl is attracted to a man that can stand on his own two feet and be happy with or without them. All you were projecting to this girl is " She's all you want", almost as if you're incapable of getting other girls. Next time a girl goes to grab another girls number for you, let her do it. Take a deep breath dude and let her chase you a bit. She'll contact you soon but just slow the hell down. Bang her a few times first; she's not as innocent as you think. And last but not least, never ask for permission to kiss a girl ever again; its always best to ask for forgiveness than permission and thats with anything.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:11 pm 
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Quote:
I wanted to break my computer while reading that dude! lol

Dude dude dude.. Slow the F*** down lol

Why are you so eagerly thinking about a relationship when you just got out of one? Thats is not attractive dude. A girl is attracted to a man that can stand on his own two feet and be happy with or without them. All you were projecting to this girl is " She's all you want", almost as if you're incapable of getting other girls. Next time a girl goes to grab another girls number for you, let her do it. Take a deep breath dude and let her chase you a bit. She'll contact you soon but just slow the hell down. Bang her a few times first; she's not as innocent as you think. And last but not least, never ask for permission to kiss a girl ever again; its always best to ask for forgiveness than permission and thats with anything.
Even though I just got out of a relationship, I was mentally out of my relationship for atleast a year. It was only recently where I built the courage to end things. I could see myself having a relationship with this girl eventually, but I don't want one as of this minute. My intention was to go slowwwwwww but I guess I'm rusty at this stuff and I'm coming off across as to eager. And you're right. Thinking back I should have let her grab those girls numbers... I'm such a dummy! When you say to take a deep breath and let her chase me a bit, what do you mean by that? Don't text her until she texts me? Thanks for advice!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:42 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
I wanted to break my computer while reading that dude! lol

Dude dude dude.. Slow the F*** down lol

Why are you so eagerly thinking about a relationship when you just got out of one? Thats is not attractive dude. A girl is attracted to a man that can stand on his own two feet and be happy with or without them. All you were projecting to this girl is " She's all you want", almost as if you're incapable of getting other girls. Next time a girl goes to grab another girls number for you, let her do it. Take a deep breath dude and let her chase you a bit. She'll contact you soon but just slow the hell down. Bang her a few times first; she's not as innocent as you think. And last but not least, never ask for permission to kiss a girl ever again; its always best to ask for forgiveness than permission and thats with anything.
Even though I just got out of a relationship, I was mentally out of my relationship for atleast a year. It was only recently where I built the courage to end things. I could see myself having a relationship with this girl eventually, but I don't want one as of this minute. My intention was to go slowwwwwww but I guess I'm rusty at this stuff and I'm coming off across as to eager. And you're right. Thinking back I should have let her grab those girls numbers... I'm such a dummy! When you say to take a deep breath and let her chase me a bit, what do you mean by that? Don't text her until she texts me? Thanks for advice!
Right man - you didn't have to use the numbers if you didn't want to but why not have a few back up plans. Worse case scenario, you become friends with them and they introduce you to some of their friends; who could be hot girls for all you know. Thats how you expand your social circle.

Mentally just chill.. Be on your own a bit without a relationship and yes don't contact her. Let her move in a little bit. Its like war; you charged, charged and got defeated. Now you must retreat or risk destroying the rest of your army. Back up a beat, rebuild you army and go back with more with more skill and less aggression. No matter how you look at it; she's a rebound and once you bang her, you will not feel the way about her that you do now. And that is certain.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:40 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I wanted to break my computer while reading that dude! lol

Dude dude dude.. Slow the F*** down lol

Why are you so eagerly thinking about a relationship when you just got out of one? Thats is not attractive dude. A girl is attracted to a man that can stand on his own two feet and be happy with or without them. All you were projecting to this girl is " She's all you want", almost as if you're incapable of getting other girls. Next time a girl goes to grab another girls number for you, let her do it. Take a deep breath dude and let her chase you a bit. She'll contact you soon but just slow the hell down. Bang her a few times first; she's not as innocent as you think. And last but not least, never ask for permission to kiss a girl ever again; its always best to ask for forgiveness than permission and thats with anything.
Even though I just got out of a relationship, I was mentally out of my relationship for atleast a year. It was only recently where I built the courage to end things. I could see myself having a relationship with this girl eventually, but I don't want one as of this minute. My intention was to go slowwwwwww but I guess I'm rusty at this stuff and I'm coming off across as to eager. And you're right. Thinking back I should have let her grab those girls numbers... I'm such a dummy! When you say to take a deep breath and let her chase me a bit, what do you mean by that? Don't text her until she texts me? Thanks for advice!
Right man - you didn't have to use the numbers if you didn't want to but why not have a few back up plans. Worse case scenario, you become friends with them and they introduce you to some of their friends; who could be hot girls for all you know. Thats how you expand your social circle.

Mentally just chill.. Be on your own a bit without a relationship and yes don't contact her. Let her move in a little bit. Its like war; you charged, charged and got defeated. Now you must retreat or risk destroying the rest of your army. Back up a beat, rebuild you army and go back with more with more skill and less aggression. No matter how you look at it; she's a rebound and once you bang her, you will not feel the way about her that you do now. And that is certain.
If I don't hear from her in about a week, should I text her again or should I still wait it out? Also, for what its worth, I forgot to mention in my original post that leading up to our Sunday date, she sent me a few selfies and demanded that I send her one. She also joked about how she was accepting resumes for the position of husband.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:56 pm 
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No.

Worry about today and today only. Who cares if she'll text you in a week or not. Worry about today.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:46 pm 
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One thing I don't understand that I would love for someone to explain to me... how can this girl go from asking me on the first date "How come we never dated?" to her flaking on me? I just don't get it!!!!!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:48 pm 
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One thing I don't understand that I would love for someone to explain to me... how can this girl go from asking me on the first date "How come we never dated?" to her flaking on me? I just don't get it!!!!!


WOMEN ARE ILLOGICAL!

You're not going to get it, they operate on emotions, not logic. Stop trying to get them; this isn't they're fault, its the fault of there nature. Grow some big ones and let it go.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:45 pm 
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So I've been doing some thinking over the past couple of days about this situation and I realized that yes, I'm rushing way too fast into wanting another relationship and that I should be enjoying my new found singledom. Thinking how this girl was so eager to get those girls numbers for me made me also realize that she would make a great wingwoman. We are both single and I'd think it would a lot of fun to hang out with her at places where there are lots of singles. Is there anyway to reverse course and somehow let her know that I just want to be friends with her and hang out with her at fun places?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 12:53 am 
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Quote:
So I've been doing some thinking over the past couple of days about this situation and I realized that yes, I'm rushing way too fast into wanting another relationship and that I should be enjoying my new found singledom. Thinking how this girl was so eager to get those girls numbers for me made me also realize that she would make a great wingwoman. We are both single and I'd think it would a lot of fun to hang out with her at places where there are lots of singles. Is there anyway to reverse course and somehow let her know that I just want to be friends with her and hang out with her at fun places?
Get your mind off this girl man. Women do this all the time: They find reasons to spend more time with you to see if they can flip your mindset and date them after all.

I understand you want to see this girl, but you've dipped pretty deep into the "I'm really into you" pool. It'll take time for her to re-calibrate her brain to look at you as something other than "that guy who is really into me."

Stay away from her for a while, and don't mention anything that has to do with her being a wingman, it'll sound needy and clumsily manipulative. If/when you do start hanging out with her again, part of it needs to be luck and part of it needs to be her taking the initiative. Don't initiate anything. Remember, if she is into you, she WILL get a hold of you. If not, that ain't a coincidence.

The best thing to do, and everybody will tell you this, is to hang with other women. If you absolutely need to get this girls attention, make her see you with other girls and don't pay her any mind.

Good luck!

Ry


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:00 am 
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Quote:
Quote:
So I've been doing some thinking over the past couple of days about this situation and I realized that yes, I'm rushing way too fast into wanting another relationship and that I should be enjoying my new found singledom. Thinking how this girl was so eager to get those girls numbers for me made me also realize that she would make a great wingwoman. We are both single and I'd think it would a lot of fun to hang out with her at places where there are lots of singles. Is there anyway to reverse course and somehow let her know that I just want to be friends with her and hang out with her at fun places?
Get your mind off this girl man. Women do this all the time: They find reasons to spend more time with you to see if they can flip your mindset and date them after all.

I understand you want to see this girl, but you've dipped pretty deep into the "I'm really into you" pool. It'll take time for her to re-calibrate her brain to look at you as something other than "that guy who is really into me."

Stay away from her for a while, and don't mention anything that has to do with her being a wingman, it'll sound needy and clumsily manipulative. If/when you do start hanging out with her again, part of it needs to be luck and part of it needs to be her taking the initiative. Don't initiate anything. Remember, if she is into you, she WILL get a hold of you. If not, that ain't a coincidence.

The best thing to do, and everybody will tell you this, is to hang with other women. If you absolutely need to get this girls attention, make her see you with other girls and don't pay her any mind.

Good luck!

Ry

Thanks for replying. I was thinking of telling her lets just be friends because she has many hot friends. In the past, when she had a boyfriend, she did try setting me up with a couple of her friends so I could see the same thing happening again. So you think I shouldn't even bother with the "lets just be friends" as well? Also, I just want to add, this girl asked me about a month ago, when I was still in my relationship, "If you were single, would you ask me out?" WTF??????? I don't get women, but I'm trying to learn.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:47 am 
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As was mentioned above, never assume people are logical. This is for men and women both.

At the time, she was working with limited information so it was easy for her to throw around phrases like that gauge what kind of person you were.

Imagine meeting a super hot girl, then finding out she's been terrorizing ex-bfs with her nutty, controlling personality. Wouldn't that force you to kind of back away say things like, "well I don't want to ruin our friendship" ?

Point being, you were well-established in her mind until you started giving her reasons to doubt you. As soon as she felt the needyness from you, she realized that she doesnt have much more stake in this "game." She already won.

If you TREAT her like a friend, she will come back and start acting normal. For now? It'll look like a "if you can't beat em, join em," move, born out of defeat if you go and ask "lets just be friends."

If she texts you: Be cool and don't try to rekindle anything you had before, it will just validate her assumption of thinking that you are just trying to get with her. This is also a reason girls text you, to kind of boost their ego and gauge interest. Part of her wants you to still want her, part of her doesn't. If you dont succumb, you will come across as "over her", which is a shot at her ego (which is good). This MAY get her looking at you differently, but DON'T count on it. Be cool.

Let me go back to this though:
Quote:
Also, I just want to add, this girl asked me about a month ago, when I was still in my relationship, "If you were single, would you ask me out?" WTF??????? I don't get women, but I'm trying to learn.
Going through things like this you'll start putting together a stock of things that she has SAID or DONE. You'll have to analyze whats been said, how shes reacted, what you've said etc. etc. and try to form them in a way that gives you an educated guess as to what to do next. A lot of things will be an essential part of the equation, some will need to be ignored/cut out.

What happens in the beginning will ONLY tell you how much stock she has in her attraction towards you. You'll know if the possibility is there. BUT, she doesnt know anything about your personality so the bulk of the important information will come out following the attraction phase. You can throw out most of the IOIs that she was throwing you during this phase.

Men are remarkably positive when it comes to "I think she's still into me" situations. Its easy to focus on positive events that happened prior to shitty events happening so you can say things like "girls are retarded." Part of it is their fault, part of it is yours, this is how life works usually.

"What have you done for me lately?" is how people think in most aspects of life. Relationships function on timing, spontaneity and social proof. If you WERE funny two months ago, great. But if you ARE funny every time you hang out with her, she's gonna want to hang out with you more, and so are other girls (DHV/social proof). All of this helps in the equation, yet many people still find a way to focus on the one or two good things that they did that makes the situation confusing ("she was into ME first," for example).

Point is, if you see inconsistencies with women, don't trip. Most of the time they are acting in a way that is self-serving and irrational. But that's OK. At times you will be taking advantage of women BECAUSE of the self-serving agenda (she is hooking up with you because she resents an ex that broke up with her, for example). So remember to stay grounded and get perspective on your situation or else you are blinded by your own hope, and that ain't too alpha-male is it?

Hope this helps man.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:21 pm 
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So it's been a week since I last texted this girl. I know you guys have mentioned not to ever contact her again, but I read a book called Text Appeal for Guys. If a girl flakes, the author suggests waiting about a week and then sending a re-starter text. The author goes on to say that there is 50 percent chance that this will work, and he gave an example how it worked for one of his clients. What do you guys think? Is there any harm in doing this?


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Can we be honest?

We want your email address. Let me send you the best seduction techniques ever devised... because they are really good.
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