Masculine identity vs androgyny



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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 4:57 am 
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So I notice most all PUA's emphasize the importance of masculinity and stereotypically male qualities. My question is, why is this emphasis on gender identity so important?

My identity would moreso be considered androgynous than stereotypically masculine and rugged (think, Prince, Ville Valo and other similar examples)
My style of dressing and hygiene can be considered androgynous as well as my interests (I'm more interested in things such as art, fashion and empathizing with people rather than sports and competition.) And my experience with women has been just satisfying thus far.
To me, this emphasis on gender conformity puts an unnecessary pressure on aspiring PUA's and makes them unnecessarily conform to a a socially crafted stereotype which they feel they must fall into it.

I will admit, I do tend to attract bi women to uniquely attractive feminine & androgynous women (which is what I tend to go for anyway), but it certainly has not hindered my success with women in general.
Some of you may say that masculinity is more universally attractive though I often find women who like people who are uniquely attractive as well.
So why this emphasis on gender identity rather than finding and building your true character?
Hope to hear your thoughts.

- Charade


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 3:37 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2012 1:10 pm
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Quote:
PUA-ism is in my opinion all about building your own true character and style of game without clinging on to the "universal stereotypes" of what it means to be a man. With that said, there are some core values/characteristics that i believe any male should be able to possess and display. Some good examples are leadership, self confidence and, as skills360 wrote in one of his posts, humility.

You also wrote about aspiring PUAs and the pressure they face when feeling they need to live up to the masculine stereotype, but it seems to me that you yourself enforce stereotypes as well:
Quote:
My style of dressing and hygiene can be considered androgynous as well as my interests (I'm more interested in things such as art, fashion and empathizing with people rather than sports and competition.)
I believe it to be a faulty assumption that masculine men can not find satisfaction in anything else besides watching american football while arm wrestling eachother with a beer IV strapped to their arm :) Which is what the quote above seems to suggest.

The examples you gave of Prince and Ville Valo are spot on but perhapts its fair to consider the fact that, among other things, their build allows them to adapt this 'alternative' identity. If i compared Prince to myself i would say thats like comparing a hummer truck with a fiat punto and i could probably pick my teeth with that dude. This is not meant to be degrading in any way, its just an over the top way of trying to prove my point.

Someone who is 6ft4 carrying 210lbs of weight perhaps has little choice than to assume the masculine identitiy because that's congruent with... reality? Also someone of Prince's size maybe doesn't have much choice either but to adapt the subtly feminine or androgynous style. Im not saying that a man should act as others expect him to act, but simply to acknowledge his own qualities and shortcomings and try to make the best of what he has to work with provided he isnt a celebrity.

I'm 5'9" and about 160. I'm thin, not muscular (though I am toned). I have long thin fingers. I don't have a square jaw or a scruffy beard. . . I am not the stereotypical "masculine manly man".

I am (and men can be) masculine in other ways though. I have no interest in dating women who are hung up on guys being X many inches tall with biceps Y many inches around.

I'm not arguing, by the way. In fact, I'm agreeing with you. Any person with any type of physical appearance can have the following attributes:

Confidence, leadership, wit, charm, humor, success, sensuality/sexual prowess.

In other words: Charisma. Charisma is attractive to ALL people. Men and women.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 4:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:28 pm
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Location: England, UK
This is a fair point, the best normal example I can think of is how Mystery dresses.
He dresses uniquely to most other guys, however he can still get the girl.

If someone in my town dressed the way he did though, people would tend to think he was in fancy dress or just peacocking which is way over the top.

In essence, theres nothing wrong with wanting to stand out a little from the competition.


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