Well said. That's brilliant. Something like that belongs in a locked thread for newcomers, or something.

I also second that Heywood has given some good advice here, and you should listen.

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I grew out of the dumb shit I used to say on here. Most of my posts don't represent who I am today at all.

Don't go to restaurant on your first dates, never invest in a women by taking her to restaurant this early.

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Uncertainty is the root of all progress and all growth.

It's not about the investment, at all. It's about restaurants being fucking boring.

Investing in a first date isn't a problem. This kind of mindset is genuinely counter productive. The only way you shouldn't overinvest on a first date is by doing something like renting a car to look like you're rich, or borrowing a friends apartment for the night cause it's nicer than yours, or even turning up with flowers. The date itself, though, should be brilliant. Infact, take her to multiple places - a woman will generally fuck a guy after 3-4 dates, and by taking her to multiple places in one night, you increase your chances of shortening this amount because she feels like she knows you better than she does. Don't do dinner, movies or a lunch time coffee, though. Search for "bowling alley" and you should find a post by me talking about a good first date. I'll write a thread on it when I can be bothered so I can just link it to people.

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I grew out of the dumb shit I used to say on here. Most of my posts don't represent who I am today at all.

Yes. I just said it in a wrong way. What I meant by not taking to the restaurant is don't try to impress her by "cheap" moves every mofo can do.


And by 3-4 dates throughout, we entail physical escalation every time a bit further too.

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Uncertainty is the root of all progress and all growth.

Whoa, ok, I get it now. Thanks guys.

I found it, and wow the opening is incredibly alpha. Here it is for future readers:

Another question! Do you pay for her tickets and whatnot when you take her out?

Well ideally you'll have planned a date that you haven't completely told her about, so if you're taking her somewhere expensive then yes you should pay for her to get in I suppose... but don't pay for her food and drinks and all that stuff.

Don't purposely do an expensive dates. It doesn't go down as well as you're expecting. It's genuinely just as beneficial (if not more) to take her for a walk down the beach, going in and out of arcades and on a few little fun fair rides, lol.

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I grew out of the dumb shit I used to say on here. Most of my posts don't represent who I am today at all.

Oh wow. I don't think this is the right way to go. If I ask a girl out, I pay. If she offers to chip in, I still pay. Don't get me wrong, she gets points for offering.

Then again, I don't agree with going from place to place on dates. I invite women to meet me at my house and say that we'll leave from there. Then I always have something to do that keeps us from leaving. I've come to the conclusion that if you treat a girl like your girlfriend at your home on a first date, she will be down for whatever you want that same night.

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@J.Daniels Ok, I get it! Basically have a good time and make memories, right? I am really looking forward to your thread on how you plan a date, how you execute it, where and when you go, what you say, and identifiers to look out for to keep the girl interested. I am an introvert and I can be pretty boring, but I'm working hard to improve that.

I'll concede that I've never been out on a real date before, and honestly I don't know if I am just delirious and in actuality in the friend zone or what, but I want more from her otherwise none at all. If I can't get her, then I'll just work on developing the abundance mentality. She is a full on 10 though.

@JackZero Man I don't know how you do that, I'm still working on my confidence. Confidence comes from experience, right? I've got virtually none. I don't want to just lay her, she is genuinely a lovely human being and I want to spend more time with her.

Candidly at this point as I'm transitioning from beta to alpha and the beta side says to myself, "you're still fat, you'll need another 2 years before you look muscular / sexy, and maybe she just likes you as a friend cause she never contacts you out of her own volition" but I rationalize and try to get into an alpha mindset, putting me as the prize not her. It's just easier said than done :/

We really enjoy each other's company, at least that's what I think, but I don't even know, it's confusing.

Confidence comes from belief in yourself. If you don't think you're good enough then most women won't think you're good enough...except for the ones that like projects. Each time you tell yourself that you have to meet certain requirements before you can be successful you'll find a new requirement. It's procrastination.

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I think "who pays" is needlessly focused on for way too long with pick up. Kind of like vocal tonality is... I think it generally comes down to the girl, to be honest. Most girls actually really want to pay their own way. I'm just giving this guy a general guideline, because he's not as experienced as you, so I don't want it to be like "J.Daniels said it's ok to pay, so I'm here paying for flowers to take to our second date" lol.

As for inviting a girl over to my house for a date... I do this if it's a previous flake, maybe an ex who got in touch or something... sometimes a girl I've dated multiple times. But, of course, my situation makes it a little more difficult to do this lol. I've done it in the past and I have to say it is effective, but I just enjoy the date... a lot of guys see it as some kind of chore, but once the initial awkwardness has gone, I enjoy getting to know a new girl and sharing the experience.

OP, for the record, Jackzero knows his shit. If I were you, I'd do whichever you're more comfortable with. Don't take my approach just to be a tryhard, and don't take his just because you're too lazy or shy to go out.

There's not a set formula to this pick up stuff. Some guys are like James Bond and I'm over here telling girls that they "smell intelligent" with a goofy look on my face, lol.

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I grew out of the dumb shit I used to say on here. Most of my posts don't represent who I am today at all.

Oh and by the way you're too invested with this girl.

*insert spin more plates quote* lol

Edit: I was saying that he should pay. Just if she wants something to eat or drink while they're out, there's nothing wrong with her paying her way.

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I grew out of the dumb shit I used to say on here. Most of my posts don't represent who I am today at all.

I'm amalgamating everything you guys are saying.

@JackZero Damn, I didn't think of that. Even after I look good, I'll then think "I'm still not a millionaire," I mean there will be an endless list of things to keep me from confidence because I am deriving the confidence from materialistic gain instead of deriving it from a place of principles / personal beliefs / self-esteem / self-compassion. It's like I just awoke, realizing that if I want to be confident, I then be confident. Thing is, I feel it for a few seconds, then I feel like a fake cause I think I'm just "acting as if" or have nothing to be confident for.. How did you change your mindset to derive from a "place of self" instead of materialism?

@J.Daniels Hahaha... I see.. oh! Just now laughing at your jokes reminded me that I need to work on my humor.. Girls love a funny guy. Did you always have a good sense of humor or did you work towards it? Thanks for clearing up the "who pays" thing man, so basically I need to ascertain what kind of girl she is and individually determine whether I should pay for the whole thing or to let her pay for the smaller niceties like food. As for where to take her, well she is an adventurous girl so I think she'll really like seeing something new and interesting, but when I escalate it, getting her alone at a place would be good for the lay.. The only thing is, she comes from a culture where her parents have her on a leash lol.. she can't be out too late, and while I think she enjoys my company, she's also worried about the repercussions with her parents and stuff I bet. I am too, cause I come from that kind of culture myself.

The "spin more plates" you mentioned got me into reading Plate Theory, and you're right that I need to get into the abundance mindset.. not only will that help me get the woman I want but also get my head out of the clouds.. The only thing is, I don't find any other girl on campus attractive.. this is literally the only girl I feel a very sexual lust for, and a warm emotional / loving desire to be with.