I'm in a pretty bad place right now in terms of my game, but it wasn't always that way. I had moved to a new city about 2 years ago. I was reading PUA material, I was energetic, fun, catching eyes. I think I slept with 3 girls in the first 6 months, but these were all "friends of friends" and not usually the numbers i got from random girls. I'm 6"0' and about 235. I'm definitely not a hot guy, but i have been told i'm "good looking" with very good eyes but could lose a few pounds and have been working out.

Anyway, I was a number closing bandit. Every weekend I would walk away with about 2-5 quality numbers and I would go out with them in the next week or so. We'd have fun, etc but there was rarely a date #2. It seemed like the girls I wanted to be with the most were the fastest to ditch me. (I know i'm not the only one with this problem, right).

Anyway, I have been so frustrated by this that I no longer get numbers as if I know what the end result is going to be. So, not only have I not made progress, I have actually regressed and that is not something I tolerate very well in any aspect of my life. I'm a quality male and I know it. But now i'm just outright scared to get back into the hunt again.

I have tried reading everything i can get my hands on but nothing has helped. How can ensure a 2nd date? is the simple question. Or should there never been a 1st date at all and should I aim more for taking her home the first night?

I think part of my problem is that i'm not escalating enough / not showing enough interest through Kino. But I also don't want to come accross over eager. Now I just feel all of this stuff is mixes up in my head and i'm just dying to get back on track. Other aspects of my life have improved but this has not. I think there is too much AFC built inside me from my HS days or some crap like that.

Please help! I'm desperate for answers for anyone who has been in this situation or knows how I can get out of this funk. Let me know if you need more specifics from me.

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"Walls aren't put in our life to stop us, they are there to test how much we really want somthing."
— Randy Pausch

Not enough kino is a very common problem with guys learning this stuff because most PUAs do not emphasize the importance of kino compared to how important it really is!

Not only is it underrated, but it really is the most important part of seduction above all else.

If you're afraid that you'd be coming across as too forward or whatnot, why not tone down your verbal game and kino more? Get back to us on how that works out. Also, it might be useful to show us a field report from one of the examples you ran into this problem.

Concur. Kino the shit out of them and that'll teach you a lot more about calibration.

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FREE PDF w Openers, Date ideas and Videos on Direct: http://www.sashapua.com

Ok guys, thanks for your initial responses.

I remember meeting this one girl at a concert. it was so hard to get her phone number in the first place (in fact, she said: "I don't give out my phone number?". To my reply: "Then how do you ever expect to get to know a person as awesome as me?", so then she finally gave it to me.

A week later we went to dinner; very conversational, not alot of question asking and I thought i succeeded at not being "too agreeable" and made it clear that i had my own opinions. I paid then we went to the bar. I put my arm on the back of her stool, would touch her leg when I would say something (although, i was probably leaning in when i did this which is probably something i shouldn't do so much). She responded very neutrally to me touching her (hot) legs through her tight pants. She didn't flinch, but also never Kino'd back (maybe im expecting the wrong thing here). I did this a few times throughout the rest of our talk at the bar with essentially the same reaction.

My hunch is that it was while at the bar i started becoming too agreeable / too interested in what she was saying (and it's cause i was truely interested; doesn't happen to me that often). We would maintain heavy eye contact and I she was smiling, but her other body language was still somewhat close off. When i walked her to her car, we hugged and she pulled away a little too fast for a kiss so i bailed on that idea.

A week later, I called her, and told her i wanted to see this movie. about half way through the flick, i tried reaching for her hand and BAM, she says "No (laughs), my hands get sweaty!". After that, I was pretty frustrated and I didn't even try for the kiss that night. It was a pretty silient walk to her car, as well.

After that night, I still wanted to go out with her again, but after a few texts back and forth she had her excuses lined up for why she couldn't see me on a given night. She was legimiately busy, but she obviously wasn't making time for me so I just gave up.

I'm not sure what you can read from all of this rambling, but this girl was a challenge from the git-go and I wonder if its just her nature to be difficult and play games. Even to get her out on the first date, in a text I said "I don't think you are as busy as you say; In fact, we are going to go out on Tuesday and you'll make yourself free". That worked, oddly enough.. . . .

_________________
"Walls aren't put in our life to stop us, they are there to test how much we really want somthing."
— Randy Pausch

It seems as though you aren't persistent enough and you misinterpret token resistance as rejection.

How do you distinguish the two? I know I suffer from the same problem. It's the AFC fear of rejection and scarcity problem. Do you get a feel of when it's just token resistance instead of rejection?

Can you explain more this concept of token resistance and signs of when it's being used? Is this the resistance I'm experiencing when girls are just playing "hard to get".

If I was experiencing token resistance, how do I move forward?

_________________
"Walls aren't put in our life to stop us, they are there to test how much we really want somthing."
— Randy Pausch

fr-persistence-and-honesty-now-lr-vt22137.html
Persistence involves escalation. If she matches escalating her resistance to your own escalation, it's likely genuine rejection. If you persist through her "rejection" and just try again a few minutes later, it was token resistance. The only way to know for sure is to try "making a move" a few times.

The girl I'm currently involved with actually gives a lot of playful token resistance. I might tell her something like "come here" and she would shake her head and say "no." After a pause and a few seconds later, I say "come here" again in the same tone or maybe even a slower, softer tone and she comes to me.

I'm not going to lie, I don't think I have ever tried that hard. It's not that these girls aren't worth the effort, but like many of us, I'm a busy dude and don't like wasting my efforts.

BUT your comments are appreciated and I will take this wisdom into the field of battle and see if I can recognize the signals and see if it's worth persuing. You have definitely opened my eyes to something new here. Thanks, again!

_________________
"Walls aren't put in our life to stop us, they are there to test how much we really want somthing."
— Randy Pausch

You're not getting it.

ANY girl who's half attractive, needs to sort through the dozens of guys that want to sleep with her. To do this, for the most part, they TEST the guys to see if they can handle a bit of shit, and to see whether the guy is really that interested in them. She doesn't want to keep seeing a guy who's either a pussy or just not that into her and will give up at the first sign of a challenge or a bit of resistance.

There is no special trick and no perfect time to go a for a kiss that guarantees a 100% chance of not being rejected. Both girls I saw over the weekend, when we first went out, rejected my first kiss attempts, saying "I didn't say you could kiss me!" and "what are you doing?" with my kiss being greeted by a completely motionless, unresponsive set of lips, and a move away from me.

What I DIDN'T do was (1) give up (2) be sad, angry or pouty, (3) say "I thought you liked me" or try and ask or convince them logically that they should kiss me

What I DID do was (1) give them a cheeky, quizzical look like they were doing something odd (Frame: girls always want to kiss me - what they're doing is abnormal) then (2) break off and talk about something else and (3) try again later.

Both girl also said, over FIVE or SIX times "I'm not going to sleep with you," at different phases of the evening, as more clothes were coming off and more stuff was happening. Again, I just said "ok," broke off a sec, and then re-engaged and escalated further, like it never happened. The fact that she's in my bed and we've already gone that far obviously means she wants to, she just wants to test me AND also make sure she doesn't appear too easy. All you have to do it not react, and continue!

_________________
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