Hey guys,

I have a real problem with conversing naturally with strangers. I'm sure there are other guys out there in the same boat. I'd be interested to hear from anyone who identifies with this.

Basically, the problem is with approaching, getting conversations started - at the beginning of the conversation the onus on me as the person approaching to have interesting things to say, and keep things going at least until the conversation becomes more 50-50 (ie. investment from the girl).

Anyways, I often freeze up and either can't approach or eject from the conversation early because I can't think of things to say. I've now read and listened to a number of knowledgable PUAs say things like "You're thinking too much... stop thinking so much".

The problem is: If I stop thinking, and I don't have things already in my mind (memorized) to say, I simply freeze up. There is nothing in my mind. Nada. Zippo. Empty head.

Anyway, I don't think many of these guys who are great conversationalists understand people like me. It seems a lot of people can happily approach and converse "subconsciously" without having to consciously think of things to say and have stuff memorized. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that I work in a logical job sitting in front of a computer doing logical things all day.

Do great conversationalists' brains work differently from mine? If so, how do I become more like them? Or is it impossible and I should just try what works for me (ie. memorize stuff)?

I'd be really interested to hear from anyone who's in the same boat as me, or anyone who used to be like me but has conquered these problems. Any tips would be very very much appreciated!


Thanks!

I had this problem too when I was starting out. Eye contact and conversation skills, those were my weak points. First, when you open, you should get some feedback from her, take whatever she says and turn it into a conversation. Situational conversation is good too, wherever you are there is always something to talk about that is at least semi-interesting.

Anything she says can be turned into either a question for her to answer, or a statement that she will respond to. Reframing is in my opinion the greatest skill you can have, reframe EVERYTHING she says, turn it into an exciting conversation. Also, it helps to have an exciting life so you can have interesting stories.
And if worse comes to worse, just maintain eye contact through the silence, build up the tension, the awkward feeling. Enjoy it, find it funny, she will either say something to break the tension, or try to eject, and if she says something to eject, then you reframe it and make her want to stay.

being situational is definitely good. one doesnt need to think much. use anything from the environment, whats happening, whats the girl doing, whats she wearing etc.

hey man. i can definitely say that i have been in the same boat as you about 3 years ago. i was very quiet, i had no idea what to say to anyone, no idea what to respond with. possible the puas that you tried to listen to are more into scripted game. there are puas out there like mystery, neil strausus etc that do the same routines over and over again. for one it is really boring, it does not necessarily work on every girl and most importantly, scripted material does not allow you to grow and develop. with scripted material, they are not even your words, and if they're not your words, you wont really believe in them because they dont come from you. but sometimes puas give scripted material to newbies as a basis for them to build on which work for them.

but to be honest scripted material does not solve the problem. Natural game is definitely the way to go to get rid of shyness, moments of feeling blank. most of my stuff i learnt from 'the natural art of seduction by richard la ruina'. absolutely fantastic and easy to learn.


here are some notes on attraction, building rapport, and number closing which might be of interest to you. enjoy.

one thing you should know is when to tease (push pull technique, negging etc). they should only be used if ur target is a 7.5 or above (or the girls who think they are 7.5 or above whereas in actual fact they are not). if you were to tease a girl below that rating, you would end of hurting and insulting them. in exclaimer for using negging and teasing is that one should positively validate their target before they negatively validate them. the reason to do it in this way is because one must hook their target in order to get their attention. so after the positive validation (for a set who is +7.5) you negatively validate them (tease, push) in order to put yourself at a higher level than them because at the beginning they are higher than you. the main reason why it is good to use negging is to challenge the ego of a girl of high calibre which is something that a typical afc does not do. and by doing this, it shows that u r a man that has high standards and does not go for just any girl and this will make the girl more interested and it will compel her to work harder to gain your approval because you have showed disinterest in her, told her that she does not fit your standards (negative validation). girls always want the guys that is surrounded by women and guys which are difficult to get, its a challenge for women to go after those guys.

building rapport is a very interesting process. in order to build a great emotional connection one must choose to talk about things which have deep emotional content. it does not matter what the girl does or likes, you can connect with her even if you have dissimilar interests. as you know all occupations and hobbies are completely different in their complexity, principles and structure, but there is one thing which all of them have in common/share "EMOTIONS". one must be empathetic and show a girl that u understand why she chose to do that job or hobbie by expressing the emotions that one feels when doing that activity, it shows that you're really trying to get to know her, and she will think "wow this is a great guy to talk to, he's making an effort to understand me, but wait, i dont know anything about him" and this will compel her to ask you questions and u can freely express yourself how ever much u want as long as u express urself passionately and positively. all the men dont do this at all and do not understand how much empathy is a powerful force and openly allow themselves to be perceived to see a girl superficially. you can use the concept of 'rapport' to ur advantage as well.

in order for you to build greater rapport with her, get used to asking more open-ended questions e.g. "what have you been up to?" or "What did u get up to today?", my one: "What monkey business did u get up to today?". dont use questions like "wats up hun?", thats a closed-ended question which the girl would simply answer and she wont give u much material to work on in order to reach the hook point.

and connect on her answers in a positive way. dont be afraid to tease her as well. dont be afraid to create impact. when telling a girl about a situation that happened to u on that day or in the week, give more details about it, women love details. it is also good to read the local news paper, women are usually very aware what happens in the world, u should as well. u can get her point of view on something in the news (nothing to do with which celebrity had sex with who) e.g. political, environmental, sociological etc and then she would ask you what u think and you can manipulate the conversation which can lead anywhere u want.

another way u can have an "endless conversation" is the principle of "Question, statement, Question, statement, Q, S, Q, S etc". so u ask an open question, receive the answer, and then make a statement about the last thing she said in order to ask a deeper question. this process can go round in a circle, it can go on for ages.

after you have the girl attracted to you and built rapport, here's how to make sure that you can get a definite number close and afterwards ensure a date in the future.

the way to ask a girl out is by 'offering' not asking permission, never ask "Do you want to go out tonight?" or "will you go out with me?" or "so what time are you free tomorrow?". They are all questions which AFCs do. they make a guy sound needy, desperate, dependent on doing something with her.

so before offering a date, let her know how busy and sociable you are. girls want guys who are difficult to get. usually in rapport with girls, to make sure she does not flake on u after the first meeting, there's a pua principle called 'seeding'. this is when u in plant an invitation in the conversation with her but u havent actually invited her. for example, you could say that "im thinking of going to this really cool bar sometime next week which i heard about". now usually when a guy mentions to a girl about going to a bar, club or party that u know, the girl will always expects the guy to automatically invite her. but what you would do is just to mention the party or the bar and continue on the conversation. this will catch the girl off guard and the girl will be thinking "hey, this guy is pretty cool (depending on the attraction and rapport), but he has just mentioned this party but why is he not asking me out?". she will think this and will be more compelled and desperate for you to ask her and she realises that she needs to work in order to get the invitation. women want to go to things that are hard to get into, exclusive and even more if they are told they cant go. people always want to go to things when they have been told they cant go. sounds so forbiden and interesting.

dont be in the position to be waiting for a girl to call you, women are lazy or busy but definitely unreliable. you make the contact. but when u contact, dont sound like you are too eager to see her, bad sign to show that ur desperate. in between texting a girl, act like u dont care if she ever replies back. i know it sounds crazy, but it does not feel good waiting, checking ur phone every so often seeing if the girl replies. have the frame of mind that u dont care about a reply, then u will feel less anxious, and more focused on ur game.

Hope that i have helped. happy gaming dude

Thanks for the replies guys. Glad to see there are others like me who improved. I've made a list of things to work on from your replies, and I'll be practising those. I still think I'll keep one or two things memorized (not word for word though) in case I run out of things to say.

Mickeyjackson - great post - lots of great info and effort there - thanks for that - much appreciated!

Don't worry about having interesting things to say.. when approaching it's always better to start out with a question..

For instance, I was sitting on a train today and a girl beside me was reading a book and she started giggling.. so I say to her.. "Was it really that funny?" as I also bump my shoulder into hers..

her: "yeeess it waaasss.."..
me: So what happened?
her: it was when I was with a friend yesterday.. omfglolhaha..
me: now you really have to tell me what it was..
her: haha.. ok.. so I was there with a friend.. hahahaha
me: go on..
her: and we were making food.. and I was going to put food on her plate.. and she said "I'll only have sooo little." and it was so funny.. she always eats like a chicken.. and I eat so much more.. hahah..
[I was like wtf? that wasn't even funny.. but this girl was absolutely hilarious anyway.. ]

So we talked more.. I asked her whether she was going back home from work.. then we exchanged numbers and now I have yet another contact in my address book to poke texts at..

It's rare now that my mind goes blank. But when it does.

I go up to the girl

Me: Hi
HB: Hello (In either a super friendly expression or super bitchy doesn't matter)

Me: (Extends arm to shake her hand)
HB:(Complies and shakes my hand)

Me: I'm just going to keep shaking until I think of something to say
(Now I have Kino'd and made her laugh)

HB: Laughs her ass off (Gives me time to notice something about her if I have nothing I just go with the whats your name )

Me: Whats your name?
HB: Leah

Me: Is that Spanish

Blah Blah Blah........

Dynamicpua - I like it!

redmartin - that's a good example of something I'd have trouble with:
In that scenario I would never think of that. Even simple observational things like that... I dunno what it is, my mind just aint that quick.

I can tell you exactly what would happen in that scenario... I'd sit there and not be able to think of anything, then the opportunity would be lost, then I'd beat myself up. Then later on I'd sit and think what I could have said and after 10 minutes thinking I'd finally come up with something like you said.

Bars and clubs are not so bad because I know the environment well so I can start off with memorized stuff (I want to get away from that).

But at daytime, I usually end up not being able to think of anything, say something really lame, freeze up and bail out.

I have been there. Ejected bunch of sets because I didn't know what to say.

"Your thinking too much" is a proper response. That is whats happening. Your trying to come up with the perfect thing to say.

What you wanna do is do the opposite, don't think too much. You don't need to come up with the perfect thing to say. When you hanging out with your good friends, you never run out of things to say because your not trying to hard. Your already good friends.

Where do you think I have been three years ago?

It's all about practice practice practice.. and then when you have enough practice it's like jumping up on stage and doing a fantastic solo on your guitar without even thinking. I think human interaction is a lot like that. It's like learning to play a guitar. Very frustrating at first and then once you know a little it becomes easier..

To fix this problem I went out and just started talking to people. Now I can't help but start talking to nice girls I see on the trains and buses and even on the street.. I can tell you that many of them are very shy and themselves don't know what to say or how to get the conversation going. But the easiest thing to fix this is to ask questions, then make some absurd statements and ask some more questions again..

In essence, a dialog is a series of questions and statements. Sometimes a statement in itself provokes a response, other times you have to ask a question in order to kickstart the other person's mind.