What do you mean by reminder mails? Do you send one message, not get a response, and then send a follow-up? Or have you already spoken to these girls through messages, and the stats you're giving me include some on-going conversations?

As for the "hoping they see your profile again" you can kind of nudge them into doing so by looking at their profile again, and since you will come up on their Visitors page, they will sometimes visit you again. It worked for me for a few girls.

[/quote]

i tried doing the online thing but its shit loads of effort cuz u have to send tons of messages before u get a reply.i thought it was just me but most men say the same thing plus its work filling out profiles but good luck honestly i feel u will have more luck with going out and getting the number cuz online u have to work your way up to a number and you wont get over AA cuz your in a comfort zone cuz she is just a picture and words....well thats if it is her picture.but whatever works for you buddy i say keep up and send shit loads of messages

_________________
Im on my G-mac s**t so put that ho on the squad

i tried doing the online thing but its shit loads of effort cuz u have to send tons of messages before u get a reply.i thought it was just me but most men say the same thing plus its work filling out profiles but good luck honestly i feel u will have more luck with going out and getting the number cuz online u have to work your way up to a number and you wont get over AA cuz your in a comfort zone cuz she is just a picture and words....well thats if it is her picture.but whatever works for you buddy i say keep up and send shit loads of messages

_________________
Im on my G-mac s**t so put that ho on the squad

[/quote]
Hi zeigeist909,

I don't think I made it clear. I will post an opener email to girls, if I do not get a response in 4 days (choose any period that you think is suitable) I send those ones a short reminder. The reminder is a generic template so takes less than a minute to personalise and send. I normally do a gentle neg about them being busy or not on the site to meet people. The reminder email contains very little but is NOT a repeat of the opener.

Sometimes girls will reply to the opener but can be unresponsive to the 2nd email. I usually send a reminder for those, again giving a 4 day response 'deadline' and just use a slightly amended reminder but this time with more personalisation.

I have been in the situation where the girls are very slow in replying and I've sent opener, then reminder, they replied, then I send my 2nd email, no response, then another reminder...invariably I've never arranged meetings with those girls. If you have to keep reminding girls it's not a good sign. So for me I only send 1 reminder at any point to any girl. What was your experience with the recon profile and guys sending reminders? With mine I think I had 3 men out of about 40 send a form of reminder, well 1 guy just kept mailling getting angrier and angrier, the other 2 were just continuations of their previous lame one liner opener mails - pointless. Very few people are doing it and those that do are not doing it well

My aim is to get their number so I can call them or a meeting/date arranged within 3 emails. I think it's a comfortable amount and stops it slipping into a cyber-penfriend thing.

Nowadays I would estimate that if I contacted 10 girls I would get to date 1 of those. I would probably spend about 2 hours maximum on ALL the emails to achieve that. Once you have a few decent mails templated it really doesn't take a long time.

Profile checking. I think this is an interesting aspect which hasn't been covered by online gurus.

Here's my experience. Firstly it's good practice where possible to save or copy every profile of each girl you contact. One thing that comes across as super-creepy is seeing someone has checked your profile several times in a short period of time. When I ran a recon profile I saw that this obsessive guy had checked the profile sometimes 3 times a day! Scary. Don't put yourself in that position. IMHO check profiles 2 times max.

Secondly, contacting girls who have viewed your profile. Always assume that a girl shown as viewed your profile IS interested, and mail them. It is rare for girls to initiate anything. It does happen and is a good boost to your confidence. Do not rely on them contacting you first, you'll wait a very long time.

Ok just 2 pieces of random advice for online game.

Know your sites quirks and functions inside-out and use them to your advantage. For example Swissfriends website messaging/mailing system has a quirk where if you post text with a photo it notifies the receiver at their normal email address and it prompts that girl to login to the site and check mails. I think a lot of girls only check once a week if that. A text only message would possibly sit there for week or two.

If you plan on using a pay site for just a trial period or for a month or two, always include an external email address in your mails. Over the last month I've had I think 7 girls contact me from original mails I sent out nearly 3 months ago!

Thanks for the replies on the recon profiles. Wow, this is a lot of work, I heard it was supposed to be like shooting fish in a barrel. I wonder if I've sent any emails to guys. lol. Anyways I was just wondering if you guys thought it was worth setting up a recon profile?

It's not a lot of work. I think it took just 30 minutes to set up the recon profile I've used. Visit a site save the photos of a girl you find attractive. Visit another profile for a similar girl copy the profile text. Set up a dummy email for your recon profile possibly 10 minutes max - use Gmail as it doesn't ask for much to set up an email address. I think the thing which can slow it down is photos if you have to edit out site watermarks.

Is a recon profile worth setting up YES. Within a week you will learn so much about online dating from a girls view. You will see the volumes of mail they get (higher than you think), the quality of mails men send (generally low). Anything that disturbs you as a man is likely to REALLY disturb a girl. You are likely to get fed up with men trying to chat to you when you logon to the site to check mails etc. Typically within a minute some guy will be wanting to chat. One thing surprised me was how many profile views I had on my recon profile and just how few men proportionately actually mailled. I think mine got over 300 views in a week but of course never got that much mail.

Online sarging is NOT shooting fish in a barrel. Once you spend a bit of time and stop doing the lame things that other guys do your results will improve. If you find one site is not particularly good switch to another.

Yeah, I made a recon profile once on okc. I intentionally chose used a pic of a girl from another dating site that was not really hot (maybe only a 6-7). She got quite a few mails but not a humongous number. Like everyone else, I was surprised how short and meaningless most emails were. I don't see why any girl would waste their time responding to an email that only said "you have a nice smile.".

Alright, so I've been pretty busy this week but I'll have to post an update on the OKC situation.

So after I fixed up my profile, I was definitely getting a lot more responses. One even got to the point where I asked her out, but she just stopped responding at that point! Definitely a buzzkill for the momentum I was on.

I'll post it here, I know there are some weird things I said especially the story about my weekend which was a horrible attempt at DHV (but true). But I feel that I did well in the other quadrants. [things I changed are in brackets and some are in italics]

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Girl 1
ME:
It's a stretch, but I'm guessing that for Halloween you were the villain from Ichi the Killer. MAJOR stretch though.

You have great taste. Quick, what's your favorite Radiohead song? Or at least Album. Besides Paranoid Android.

And are you a fan of Carl Sagan???

HER: i was actually the black dahlia! but that's a good guess.

my favorite radiohead song? that's too tough. but my favorite album is probably amnesiac.

and of COURSE i'm a carl sagan fan! i'm very pleased to see you listed carl sagan's cosmos under television.

ME: Ha, I'm glad to find a fellow fan of Carl Sagan, RIP. You should also check out Neil deGrasse Tyson. I think he shares a lot of Sagan's enthusiasm and energy.

I like that you spend a lot of time thinking about the cosmos. You seem like a very interesting person, and you're very cute! Tell me more about yourself. How was your Friday night?

HER: I'll look into him. the cosmos are endlessly fascinating.

my friday night was pretty decent. saw "the imaginarium of doctor parnassus" which was kooky and fun. then played darts and had a beer at a bar. now i'm home. how was your friday night?

ME: How was the movie? I used to live across the street from Heath Ledger when he passed away. He was a great actor, RIP.

My Friday night was pretty good. I went to my friend's girlfriend's birthday party in the East Village. Then last night, a bunch of friends and I went to a couple of bars in the Greenwich Village area. There was this crazy Michael Jackson reincarnation dancing in the middle of one of the bars. He was all "FEEL the music!" It was a sight to see.

But anyway, I'd really like the opportunity to take you out for some coffee with conversation or dinner sometime. =) I just have this feeling that you're really interesting and fun to talk to. [ stole this entirely from one of Jsmooth's posts - not my style TBH, but gave it a shot anyway ]

You're welcome to message me back here, or feel free to shoot me a text. [555-555-5555 name].


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And this is from another girl who is actually cuter than the one above, and seemed interested but I don't know why she didn't respond. Here it goes:
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Girl 2
ME: I'm also a bit of a health freak, except unlike you I gained about 20 lbs in the past couple of months. Muscle baby! But I'm not a meat-head, trust me!

I'm very impressed with the Neuroscience degree. I'm also a senior at [school] studying Biochem and Physics. We have a lot of similar interests, and you have great taste. I love 90's cartoons as well - I'm more privy to the ones about superheroes though.

You seem very interesting, and like a easy person to talk to. You're also very cute! Tell me more about yourself. How was your Friday night?

HER: hey there. [school] huh? I'm working on getting into their neuroscience summer research thing this year. If I get maybe Ill see you around there lol. I'm thinking about going to grad school there too or as we all know MEDICAL school for us science majors. lol.

Friday night was good. Just chilled with my friends, drank and played rock band (its so much fun when you play while you're drunk! lol). Last time I'll be drinking for awhile too cuz I'll be busy doing my hospital internship this monday. (I'm nervous/excited) how are you doing tonight?

ME: Ha, good luck with the summer research. It's a great school, and if you're lucky you may just bump into me.

Rock band, that's cute. Are you the designated singer of the band? Or do you like to hit things, ie. drums? I think it'll be funny and would tell me a little bit about your personality.

Last night, a bunch of friends and I went to a couple of bars in the Greenwich Village area. There was this crazy Michael Jackson reincarnation dancing in the middle of one of the bars, it was hilarious. He was all "FEEL the music!" It was great.

Do you visit NYC often? By the way, my name is [name]. [/i][/b]

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SO I thought I did well enough to get some enthusiastic responses, and they were asking questions too. But it just fizzled out. Girl 1 may have been entirely turned off by me suggesting to meet her, and in hindsight I should have modified Jsmooth's post (like "you're fun to talk to" instead of "i jsut have this feeling that you are very fun to talk to" and "feel free to IM me" instead of "feel free to msg me" because we have established some type of rapport already). But if she wasn't interested in meeting me anyway, then I guess it's good that I didn't waste anymore time and was direct.

Girl 2 though, I am just baffled. It seemed to be good, but I have no idea why she didn't respond. These were all a few days back too.