So basically I've tried to just go out and have a fun time, let alone try to game, without drinking and I literally can't.

I can go about my daily life during the week and not need to drink, obviously - I'm not an alcoholic.

But the fact is, on the weekends, if I'm out with friends or whatever, if I don't drink then I sit there whilst everyone else has fun, animated conversations and I just feel bored, tired, and left out of the conversation.

Whereas even after one drink or two, I can be the life of the fucking party and totally have a blast.

Now who's to tell me that having a drink or two is gonna kill my game and is such a "crutch" that I shouldn't do it, and all PUAs should be 100% sober. Cuz personally I think that's bullshit.

i agree with you to a certain extent.

sometimes like to have a few drinks because it helps me get loose and get in state. but sometimes if i'm tired, then a cup of coffee is much better. if i'm tired and i drink alcohol, it'll usually just make me even more tired. and it goes without saying that drinking too much in any situation will only hurt my game.

the x-factor is experience. if someone is inexperienced, they will need alcohol more than someone who has been sarging 5 times a week for the past 3 years. lots of experience will desensitize you. at this point, you won't see any real advantage from a glass of alcohol. in fact, when you are indeed at that level, any alcohol at all might be more of a deterrence than an aid.

I work with girls to have fun, I drink because I like it.

Combining two things? Why not.

That doesn't have to mean I drink until I can't stand or speak properly; do what's fine for you... that's how I roll!

Dude, it's whatever. There's no rule saying you can or cannot. What I like doing is get super pumped and have a dance party in my dorm with whoever I go out with. When I get at the bar/ club I might have a drink or two if I'm in the mood but it doesn't effect my game.

this aint good. you are relying on alcohol to enjoy yourself in social situations. try change this. try to find natural energy, confidence and charisma....i have had one of my best nights out while being soba as a judge. being soba also gives you a lot of power over the rest of the drunkeds. (dont get me wrong i love drinking, but learn to socialize/game in your natural soba state and you will clean up big time. you want to be the confident 'awesome you' at all times (work,home,clubs,wherever), not just when youve got a few drinks in you.

you dont want situational confidence, you want core confidence. (alcohol gives you situational confidence)

I always get my head a full load with my friends.

When I see a chick, I go for it.

I drink only at weekends, not alcoholic..
Alcohol -> Fun.
Girls -> Fun .

Fun x Fun = Fun power 2

or...

Being drunk -> Fun.
Girls -> Fun .

Fun x Fun = Fun, but limited success with girls

...or...

Soba -> Fun. (yes, its a mindset)
Girls -> Fun .

Fun x Fun = Fun power 2886256383 + high rate of success with girls.

each to their own i guess....i do drink however I am trying to minimize my intake to become more naturally socially conditioned.

Well, I success best when Im drunk.

But its just meh.

You guys are free to do what you want. But I'm going to say what the professionals would say.

Using Alcohol in order to improve your sociability is a brilliant way to develope an alcohol dependancy. (Alcoholism)

Fucking hell Fin, he's talking about having a few drinks with his mates on a Saturday night, not getting hammered for breakfast.


I haven't really started to get into all this yet (bootcamps next month, and I'm being a bit of a hermit this month for money reasons. Primarily that I have none.) But I fully intend to keep my 'old' life and this seperate. If I'm out with my mates, I'm not out to 'game' and I'll gladly get hammered and dance like a dick head.

Similary I'm hoping to make some mates in this weird world I'm stumbling into. When out 'Sarging' I'm not Mike, I'm big.Mickey, and big.Mickey stays sober. (Although I'm not going to lie, a big part of this is that I want to be out 3-4 times a week practicing my game - I couldn't drink like that for long when I was student let alone nowadays. And...as a newbie to london...3.75 a pint? Wtf is that!?)

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Fancy hitting London sometime?
MSN/email: big.mickey.c@googlemail.com

I dont drink at all and at first I used to feel akward when I went out with my friends who all drink. However since finding this site and using some of the things I've learnt here to become a better more fun, sociable and confident person I now find it very easy to go out and have a great time now and the fact that people around me are dinking doesn't bother me (this may be different for me as I've never drunk). I would start by going out without drinking and try gaming/having a good time so that you don't become dependant on drinking while your out (which is what has happened to my mate, he cant go to a bar without a drink).

Also I don't disagree with you mickey about separating your old life and new life but I just want to say that the main reason I got into this was to get more women but I've now found that after some reading and reflection on things I also want to build a better lifestyle and be a better person as well and I want to be that person all the time whether its with my friends, out on my own or with my family. I'm also trying to always "game" women no matter where I am or who I'm with just so that I don't make excuses to myself if I see a girl I like (such as "I'm with my friends I'd approach if I wasn't with them...etc) just because when I'm in the mindset of approaching and wanting to try and get the girl I've seen I'm more confident and more fun to be around which is the vibe I want to give off to the women I approach and the people I'm with.

As for the original poster just try your best to not become dependant on alcohol to mix in a social setting otherwise when you do enter one of those situations sober and feel like approaching a woman you may be less confident and turn to alcohol to give you that "courage" to approach.

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luck is where preparation and opportunity meet

As of late, I have been on mood stabilizers, which means no alcohol, but last friday I went with my buddy AR. AR is a heavy drinker, problem drinker actually. A problem he freely admits to. We were at this place for like four hours and we had about five beers apiece. I really did not notice a difference between sober me and slightly imbibed me but AR did, he said I was more at ease and calmer, not as loud, more chill I guess. I suppose looking back on it, he was right (I even did a Karaoke song after barely one beer). Before I found PU and THe Community, I always figured whatever I did socially drunk I could do better sober and I think this is true. You can be just as chill drunk as sober. Don't think you have to be sober to game, go out saying you are the DD, which is a potential DHV. THat fuzzy feeling that booze gives you is just your senses being numbed. I would bet that because you pick-up on more stuff (body language, IOIs verbal and non-verbal) while not intoxicated, you will be more successful. However, I am as unafraid of soberiety as I am of being shit-your-pants puking-on-other-people drunk but I usually reserve the latter for special occasions. Though in the last 2+ years I have been really intoxicated a few times, I have not blacked out since August '07. So whatever, try being the DD, try having one drink an hour, your liver, head and everything else will thank you. As will the HB because you did not make an ass of yourself like the other stumbling idiots. Cheers.

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Call me Sly.
My goal: To become a Pickup Artist in everything but name.

And yeah, This is (still) just the beginning.

I love a drink when im out for a Sarge. In my opinion sarging is about enjoying my night out, its like a game to play with my wing. The drinking is just part of being out in a club or bar. It also looks better if your standing with a drink in your hand, its fits better with the social environment. Im not talking about going out and getting binned, but having a couple of drinks is fine.

The reason you feel the way you do when your sober is because you are taking away something you enjoy. You notice all the states in the club or bar because your an outsider. Ive got a mate who is tee total and he just cant handle clubs, not because of the music or because its busy but just because its full of people who are into somenthing he's not.

On the other hand i still work my day game when im sober, to balance things out. I make sure im not using alcohol as a crutch and thus my Game doesnt suffer.

As a final note remember going out and getting drunk with the lads and giving the game a break for a night is alright too. The day i realised that i had actualy taught myself how to be attractive to the sort of women i wanted was when i was out for a night with the lads. I was paying women no attention, was having a laugh, and women were giving me I.o.i's and, for all intents and purposes, approaching me and my mates. Live it, love it, and lump it when you need a break.(Repeat)

Regards, Saint

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Attraction is the insatiable desire to be irresistibly desired

Exactly.

Who the f*ck would want to rely on a drug in order to 'perform' in a social environment? You should be expressing yourself from the core whether you're drinking or not. You shoud be succeeding whether youre drinking or not.

And if you have more success when you're drunk rather than soba, you probably need to start developing REAL confidence and lay off the dutch courage for a while. Im not saying dont drink, Im saying if you cannot approach soba then you should consider incorporating your game into your core personality which will be 100 times more effective (not just in clubs, but in every day situations).
...took the words right out of my mouth.

Well, to be fair, maybe some people honestly CANT find that natural confidence. In fact, it was just this year that I got my confidence......and ironically enough it was a day that I sobered up after a couple drunk nights and realized that I can talk to girls either way. Some take longer than others and some just never get it.