There seems to be a fair bit of confusion going on about negs, and since I couldn't find a post that clarified the simple rationale behind a neg, I decided to share my perspective. I play MM, so I will be using the M3 model terminology.

A neg is used to initially disqualify the PUA as a potential suitor. It's not meant to be rude. It sends the message that you are initially not interested - that's it. It does not create attraction.

The neg fits in A1. If dealing with a woman of particular beauty, you may drop another one in A2. This is the phase where you DHV and create attraction. But again, negs alone don't create attraction. A lot of guys seem to think that they just have to neg the girl till kingdom come and she'll love them for it because they are not being the nice AFC. No, no, no.

At some point in the pickup - namely in A3 - the girl wins you over and earns your interest. Here you are already interested, and she feels like she has earned it. A3 follows the bait-hook-reel-release model

1. You prompt her to make an interest
2. She jumps through the hoop by responding (in an interesting way)
3. You reward her with an IOI
4. And then you take away.

You are allowed to send mix signals. You are allowed to be cocky and funny (PLEASE, for your own good, DONT overdo it). But at this point, stop negging. It's not gonna help. Backhanded compliments don't create attraction, period. She's earned your approval, so why punish her for it?

'Wow, I gotta say, your first impression kinda sucked but now that I've gotten to know you better you're absolutely incredible. I feel foolish for thinking otherwise!'

Credit: Mystery

The general point to take from here: a lot of guys seem to have this idea that you're supposed to throw negs around like condoms at a sexual awareness summit. I used to be one of them. Until yesterday, when I did that very mistake again, compared it to how much better sets where I eased up on the negs went, and it clicked for me. One at the beginning is all you need, unless she is exceptionally beautiful. And for your own good, be objective - remember that Mystery reserves 9+ for models, not just pretty faces.

Hope this helps, and experienced members, please correct me if I'm wrong/clarify if my explanation is sloppy anywhere.

Happy sarging.

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Love,

Ace

NEGS! nice post ace

Just so i understand when you give them a compliance test and they dont accept, is it ok to neg then or just stick with the IOD.
but a neg is a IOD, but i mean like other IOD's.
When your already in A3?

The first three stages of a MM sarge are

A1 open, Time constraint, NEG
A2 Female to male interest - this is where you DHV and reach the 'hook point'.

Once you've done enough DHV and received IOIs, you can try and transition to

A3 male to female interest. This is where you prompt her to DHV.

'tell me something interesting about yourself. Matter of fact, tell me three interesting things, and make one of them a lie, and I'll try to figure out which ones are true. Then I'll do the same thing for you' (She tells me two interesting things, we talk about it for a while, I give her IOIs - now my interest in her is justified and we're in comfort-building. I tell her three things about myself in C1, she guesses that 'Im a software engineer' is the lie).

If she doesn't jump through the hoops - it means you're still in A2. You haven't hooked her enough and need more DHV before you try to transition again.

Ace: name three things off the top of your head that would wanna make me get to know you better
HB: Oh... I don't know.
Ace: Right.. you know, I was just making conversation and being polite, I'm not really that interested (cheeky smile + credit: Mystery). So get this, I was doing a magic trick at this actor's birthday party in the VIP lounge around here a couple weeks back...

I guess, yeah, if your transition fails you do neg. My bad, should've made it clear in the previous post. The general idea I'm trying to bring down is that you neg the hell out of her no matter what.

Another thing: negs and C&F are separate ideas. I do use C&F lines in comfort-building too

HB: I'm serious, I think I need to lose weight
Ace: well.. My mom told me not to be rude to strangers, but yeah, you have serious work to do...

But she knows I'm teasing. It's not serious, whereas negs are at best ambiguous.

Hope this helps

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Ace

yeah it always helps

good stuff by the way!

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To effectively communicate, we must realise that we are all different in the way we percieve the world and use this understanding as a guide to our communication with others.

Yes, you are right in what you are explaining.

However, something that is often overlooked is the difference between girls themselves. Some girls can't handle negs at all, while other girls can handle negs all throughout your relationship. So, you have to calibrate yourself to which type of girl you're dealing with too.

Tripp: I feel in no position to argue with someone who's had a good decade of experience more than me... But don't you think it's because you're using C&F as opposed to a genuine neg?

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Ace

ace, C & F does have it's place, that's true, but again, it does still depend on the girl. If you are gaming a girl that has a big frame, which most girls honestly don't have, then continuous negging on down the line is no big deal. It's like a friend said to me recently . . . we can neg the shit out of each other and it doesn't bother us because our frames are so big, yet an outsider looking in thinks we are tearing each other apart, when really we're not.

Another thing I figured out a couple weeks back (took me a while to find this thread, too): the number of negs does not depend on your rating of the girl - it depends on how she views herself.

I was out having a smoke with my wing, and just to keep the ball rolling we opened a girl standing around. She was, honestly, a 6 at best, but must have thought she was a fucking 10. Ego the size of a planet.

So things weren't going on very well and she clearly got the wrong idea we were trying to pick her up. I lit a cigarette for her and she said something along the lines of

'I bet you carry a fancy lighter to impress girls, huh?'

What the... oooh, I get it now, you think you are the shit, little girl? Let's see if that works

[Ace - ignoring the previous remark completely] Say something again... No fucking way, your nose wiggles when you speak! Awesome! (I touch it) haha, it's so squishy! You're cute, like a little bunny chewing on a carrot... Anyhow, Diamond, remember the moves that salsa instructor was showing us earlier on?

She opened up after that and started talking about how self-conscious she was about her nose. Not that I gave a flying fuck, but I think you will occasionally get situations where an 8 thinks of herself as a supermodel, and although you don't think she deserves it, you will need to throw a couple extra negs in there.

Calibrate for her ego (which you should have a good idea of by the time you finish your opener), not your subjective rating of her.

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Love,

Ace

EXACTLY ace.