Video: Getting KICKED out of a restaurant for approaching



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:20 pm 
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He isn't even responding. He did this in the other threads as well.
Honestly he probably thinks our advice is beta. Advice coming from a bunch of liars and keyboard warriors who don't post infields like him so we aren't worth the time to give feedback to.

I've gotten several guys laid, setting up dates, and n closing with the advice I give out on this forum. I currently have a student who joined the forum on Jan 9th and couldn't close or talk to women at all. We worked together and he pmed me getting 3 n closes in a night today.

This is more than I can say for certain individuals who give out terrible advice. Their advice is terrible because they are coming from a perspective of just keep repeating the same actions over and over and eventually you will get better. I repeated the action of soliciting women over and over and got reported and my account deleted. My frame was extremely strong. "Listen, I don't feel like chatting, give me your number and I'll text you my address later so that you can come over and suck my dick."

This was pretty ridiculous, but in a sense it hit a lot of the PU "advice" this guy/you are following. Hit numbers, keep a strong frame, either they will accept it or they won't I'm already good enough. Which is probably why said individual reacted so intensely. I pointed out flaws in his advice supported by real world examples and his pride won't let him accept it.

This basic shit does not work on it's own, giving you a free pass to say and do what ever you please. Case in point I was reported and escorted off okcupid temporarily. Thankfully, it was a woman observing my account so I was able to charm my way back into the mix through a combination of honesty and and clever word play.

You are being reported to security guards and being escorted out of restaurants. It's the same thing. If you wanted I could have used one of your lines instead like dead cats or black magic, and the results would have been the same.

I did in one night a microcosm of the same stuff you have been doing over these 268 approaches.

My student had a very detailed field report so I can tell it's not just some made up bs, and some of it did not go smoothly like it's supposed to. In fact the first night he didn't approach anyone at all. I appreciated his honesty. He got the closes the second night out. This guy in less than 11 days has progressed faster than you have.

OP if you aren't closed minded send me a PM and I'll get you closing stuff easy. The contingent. The PM should contain your entire framework that you use. I want to look at it then clean up what you already do instead of trying to turn you into a copy of myself.

I haven't encouraged my student to make field reports on the forum. There is no need for him to do so. He has the good fortune of having me as a mentor.

I threw down a challenge to about 11 or 12 newbs to pour knowledge they found on this forum into a basic framework I designed for them. The advice we are giving you now was already given to you a while ago... You ignored it. I specifically targeted guys who said they were new so I wouldn't have to climb any hills trying to help a know it all. Many agreed, but only one took action. You seem to be an action taker which is the only reason I'm willing to work with you.

Other than that I'm staying away from the weird videos and awkward approaches. If you expose yourself to something for too long it begins to be absorbed into your personality, and I would rather not have this sneaking it's way into my interactions.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:27 am 
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There's a difference between showing genuine interest, letting the chips fall where they may and learning how to have basic normal conversations with someone. If you're awkward and creepy to girls, nothing wrong with working on your conversation skills ,style and appearance.
For sure but, i would not care what people think or show validity to those of disinterest. They are a glitch in the matrix. I do not want to hurt feelings but i am not going micromanage and filter what I say in order to accommodate her.
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PU=improving your dating options and yourself in the process, not finding chicks who are interested in socially awkward guys.
Not sure I agree. Some women deem Russell Brand as weird, creepy, and physically unattractive yet, he has shagger of the year award and its known in the PU community he pulls tons of hot women. One woman may deem a many creepy and the next sleeps with him. One man's trash is another man's treasure.
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Accept your flaws and work on them. If you're looking for a girl who accepts you being socially awkward to marry and have a family with one day, keep going and eventually you may run into one.
Exactly. The thing being, no matter how far off you are, you are already someone's perfect 10 at birth. Bonsai from TAF has an article I highly recommend you read. Its pretty awesome. I have pointed out some flaws in the PU system like all systems. PU is not antifragile. All systems have issues and are flawed in one way or another. One observable flaw with PU is all the introspection which tends to put more people in their head and yield more keyboard jockeys and internet warriors.
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But let's be honest, if your looking for dick in vag action on some kinda consistent basis, you gotta bring more to the table than accepting yourself and bad conversations.
Not sure i agree with you. I always deemed pulling as a numbers game long before my days in PU. Before PU, I dated a couple women throughout a year on a longer term. There was more longevity. Now, there is "abundance," I have more choice, and I often meet women so, I do not care about outcomes at all. There is another girl around the corner or in a coffee shop next store. I think the biggest PU flaw is all the obsession, introspection, and belief that every situation can be manipulated or molded into your favor. There is too much attachment in such a model. I know if I do PU, I will meet more women, and increase the probability of sexual encounters which may provide longevity or not. I love to find out.
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Inner game isn't going to get you laid by itself.
True but, nor will simply just approaching. Most guys try these bullshit routines, fabricate some ridiculous excuse to talk to her rather than, cut the crap, and display immediate interest. Sometimes, I am more indirect, flirty, and leave a little ambiguity for her to figure it out.
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Props for approaching and I'm not bashing you, just calling it as it is. Most if not all of the girls you approached were creeped out. And yes, you can't win them all, but that's not an excuse to not improve and adjust what you're doing.
007 did some good approaches especially ballsy PU on women with family. I have been successful in this situation but, what guided me was the fact I would not forgive myself if I did not do it. I liked her. I liked her energy. She was bubbly, a complete firecracker, positive, she smiled a lot, and I felt immediate chemistry. Even if it doesn't work, I am always happy for the experience, and I take something away.
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PS- damn your views shot up. The comments are bad though. Someone said your vid was uploaded to reddit or something. I don't know the laws in your state but you may want to check them out quickly as the faces aren't blurred
This is why i would rather just wing with someone and we could watch from a mecam or something like. I do not want to display my life or what I do.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:33 am 
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One of the things I notice is a desire to "kino", without a plan. Sort of like lamenting that only Lois went for the "K-close". It's good that you didn't, as that's not socially calibrated.

I was just watching the Daily Show and saw a clip of Secretary of State, John Kerry doing very uncalibrated touching.

http://youtu.be/hK01GxUeq00?t=1m21s

Jon Stewart does a good job highlighting what's often so weird about forced, unnatural touching. And why it's not even gender specific. This type of thing is weird. You need to pay attention to the other person's signals and go from there.

Too much is often made of "kino escalation", but too little of how to gauge progression. Test, test, escalate. If ever you hit resistance, back off. Reattempt later. Even the Secretary of State messes it up. And he's not even horny when he's doing it.
Thanks V. I will have to check it out. This is what I loved about JB. If anybody asked, I really liked rsd, and could have been called a fanboy prior to the incident. What is alarming is that, they film audience, they do not aware students nor do they blur individuals. If you were to bring it up, they dismiss it based upon nobody noticing you prior to the JB shit storm. Going back to the point about being meticulous in PU and socially aware with kino, if attractive, women are okay with kino and being in their space. If you are not attractive, they will get uncomfortable, and could potentially freak out. Great post. I think mainstream called JB on bullshit, outraged by what he was doing in fear of copy cats, and worse.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:36 am 
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@ Fudge Boy: Generally speaking, hijacking threads isn't cool.

DA
Its kind of getting annoying with all the detering. I brought up JB but, only in response to kino, his ability to read into situations better then most, and the JS kino youtube post.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:04 am 
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Can't quote Joe but my reply is you gotta bring something to the table. If you're good looking enough you can suck socially and girls will still sleep with you. To sleep with a girl you always have to be giving her something positive. Girls don't typically do pity sex. Either she's so attracted to you physically your looks are enough for sex or you exchange material things or you exchange good emotions. Not going to get into the "you are enough" stuff because while it's a nice philosophy for your own self esteem, for nearly all women your confidence in yourself doesn't matter unless you can attract her with it. If you suck at conversations, you're not physically attractive and you lack much better than average finances girls won't sleep with you. Everyone who gets laid, however they do it, offer something to the girl that gives her good emotions. Balls to approach is great but doesn't get you much. Why would a girl sleep with OP? Because he has balls? Because he's honest? Good qualities but doesn't mean much if he's awkward. Direct and awkward doesn't equal lays unless hes really attractive. He seems like a good guy but it's not a matter of what he says but how's he communicating. He needs to be able to communicate with people normally. Again kudos got balls but those are more something guys get hyped for..Girls need more.

Doesn't really matter...I'm hoping these videos are for trolling. If they aren't I don't think there's much anyone can really help here with


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:49 pm 
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I do get the sense that he needs to fix his looks, badly. Ever girl he direct approaches goes "Awwww. Thank you!" in the cute little puppy, rolling over to get its belly scratched voice. They think they're so far out of his league just at a glance, that they don't take him seriously.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 11:09 pm 
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Can't quote Joe but my reply is you gotta bring something to the table. If you're good looking enough you can suck socially and girls will still sleep with you.
You are preaching to the choir. It is know fact, if you model, are actor, have social status or rich, and good looking, you get laid without game. Not till this past year, rsd has negated such an argument until most recently. Looks trumps game. Not sure what point was to be made here?

Pebble freaked out about a comment I made about boycotting products, using torrents.
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To sleep with a girl you always have to be giving her something positive.
I am going to have to disagree with you. Paul Bernardo is a known rapist and murderer. He is getting married despite his life sentence in jail and he will have sex with her. Many men are assholes with women and douche bags which does not hinder their ability to get fucked or sucked.
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Girls don't typically do pity sex. Either she's so attracted to you physically your looks are enough for sex or you exchange material things or you exchange good emotions.


Which is why men are going their own way with mgtow or sexodus. Man is a utility to provide free dinners, dates, foot bills, raise her children from other men, marry her, and pay child support when she leaves. Tyler Durdan has tons of content about women getting fat and done with the hot guys at 33 when they need a beta male to support them.
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Not going to get into the "you are enough" stuff because while it's a nice philosophy for your own self esteem, for nearly all women your confidence in yourself doesn't matter unless you can attract her with it.
rsd recently lost Alex who has gone onto do something else with his life. A recent rsd thread posted on the main forum had Tyler inform members recently. "More than enough" was his philosophy. I believe he was among their best instructors of not the best. There seems to be two thoughts at work when it comes to PU: that all that matters is looks; rely on looks vs game trumps everything which seems to be what Fudge suggests. Relying on how you look has little to do with game. I feel like a variety of things are at work here but, looks are definitely a big part of attraction. Neediness can make a attractive person unattractive. PU has never been about "her" validation or opinion. As I stated several times, i don't much care for opinions or what people think. I do not care to micromanage her feelings or expectations although, I do intend no harm. The approach is based upon my interest. She is either interested or not and there is always the next girl.
Quote:
If you suck at conversations, you're not physically attractive and you lack much better than average finances girls won't sleep with you. Everyone who gets laid, however they do it, offer something to the girl that gives her good emotions.
I agree that there is definitely an exchange rather than, "love" that gets promoted so much.
Quote:
Balls to approach is great but doesn't get you much. Why would a girl sleep with OP? Because he has balls? Because he's honest? Good qualities but doesn't mean much if he's awkward. Direct and awkward doesn't equal lays unless hes really attractive.
As i and many others have been saying, PU is a numbers game. So, what one woman deems as weird or creepy, another woman has sex with or marries. You keep going back to looks so, I am sensing a lot of obsession with how a person looks. You know it wont last forever right? I am not sure what advice you have here besides the obvious being, she was not interested or attracted to him. The PU being done should be chalked up as a victory. Everyone commenting on him as well as the youtube comments are from people who typically do not do PU, do not approach or pull. Instead of random discussions or lets say, in this thread, random deterring from the OP jumping on little random tangents about irrelevant crap. At least, you are talking about the subject of OP video unlike another poster in the thread.

I am not sure where you are going with looks. Its like a dead horse. You are beating it death. Unless you are suggesting a cosmetic surgery place to 007, I am not sure where you are going with it? Frankly, I think he did the right thing by approaching.
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He seems like a good guy but it's not a matter of what he says but how's he communicating. He needs to be able to communicate with people normally. Again kudos got balls but those are more something guys get hyped for..Girls need more.
Much of what you said has validity but, there is a lot of appearance obsession going on. Not everyone is David Beckham. The sexodus article reveals that there are men who are becoming aware of the scheme; that being women are sleeping with the David Beckham like males throughout their teens and twenties. Once they start getting fat, they stop getting called from the good looking guys, women begin to seek security in a new form: 1) children 2) marriage 3) beta provider disposable male. I think checking out of society is ridiculous however, the current court system panders towards shitty quality people. I will repost links shortly.


Lets say, a system is in place where in a business arrangement, no matter what you do, you lose half of everything? Its simply a bad deal. Relating it back to, "girls need more," this is evident in divorces, in male disposability, and in cases where a man is court ordered to pay child support for 3/4 children despite dna proving they are not his. My point is that, the current system spoon feeds women. Women do not need PU. They will get dick without game, education, a active gym membership or becoming a quality person and valuable member of society. Why? Because some man will foot her bills, raise her children from out of wedlock, and if all else fails, social assistance, child support, and faulty unjust court systems provide her a safe haven from the cruel reality of her poor lifestyle choices. But women "need more?"

From the moment they bud, they get the attention no matter how shitty a person they are. What if instead of providing women "more," man prioritized his needs, his wants, and desires? 007 did just that. Emphasizing looks, you eliminate everything prioritizing on something he cannot change nor alter and play back into the PU batting average. Play life safe. Don't take risks. Essentially, be a woman in 2015. Men are behaving more and more like women. Its not doing the world justice or helping out the sexes. It did not happen but, pandering to female entitlement is not the solution either.

http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-39117.html

http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-39117.html

Mod edit: Not a big deal but in the future please dont post links to SH.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tItc6VnBHqk

I have met tons of women like that above; not her specifically but, of low level consciousness. We live in a time where everyone is a sissy promoting you cannot say or do that. Promoting censorship or bans into countries while promoting bdsm in mainstream movies. BDSM is illegal btw.
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Doesn't really matter...I'm hoping these videos are for trolling. If they aren't I don't think there's much anyone can really help here with
I think if 007 got more into actually pursuing women, had other interests, passions, and pursued women worth his time, he could make something good happen.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 1:22 am 
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I am going to have to disagree with you. Paul Bernardo is a known rapist and murderer. He is getting married despite his life sentence in jail and he will have sex with her. Many men are assholes with women and douche bags which does not hinder their ability to get fucked or sucked.
By positive I mean positive to her. Abuse and drama can be positive emotions to a woman, I'm talking "positive" as she enjoys whatever the emotion is, not positive as in inherantly "good" or "bad." And why do you have to use obscure examples to prove a point sometimes? Yes there are women who like guys who fuck kids, who wear panties and who wear makeup. But I won't tell someone to do those things or use those as examples because generally that's not what happens and what attracts women.
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Which is why men are going their own way with mgtow or sexodus. Man is a utility to provide free dinners, dates, foot bills, raise her children from other men, marry her, and pay child support when she leaves. Tyler Durdan has tons of content about women getting fat and done with the hot guys at 33 when they need a beta male to support them.
Why do you always focus on women using men in some way? In one breath you say Tyler is woman hating, yet use his women hating points of view. And these thoughts are coming from Tyler, a man who runs a pickup company, has incentive to lie to you, and whose reality if it is indeed going out 5 nights a week for whatever amount of years constantly, is a different lifestyle than most. That's not even a slight at tyler, you're the one who pointed out he has some twisted views.
Quote:
As i and many others have been saying, PU is a numbers game. So, what one woman deems as weird or creepy, another woman has sex with or marries. You keep going back to looks so, I am sensing a lot of obsession with how a person looks. You know it wont last forever right? I am not sure what advice you have here besides the obvious being, she was not interested or attracted to him. The PU being done should be chalked up as a victory. Everyone commenting on him as well as the youtube comments are from people who typically do not do PU, do not approach or pull. Instead of random discussions or lets say, in this thread, random deterring from the OP jumping on little random tangents about irrelevant crap. At least, you are talking about the subject of OP video unlike another poster in the thread.

I am not sure where you are going with looks. Its like a dead horse. You are beating it death. Unless you are suggesting a cosmetic surgery place to 007, I am not sure where you are going with it? Frankly, I think he did the right thing by approaching.
Huh? I mentioned looks as one of other things that make a girl sleep with you. My other posts to the OP haven't even mentioned looks, I spoke about social skills. So I mention social skills, finding a coach, agree with another poster he should join clubs and make friends then a few posts later I list traits women find attractive for sex, looks being ONE point, and I'm obsessed about looks? Please, read my posts again before you get into obsession with looks.

Look, the guy creeps girls out in his vids. He's not RB or a doucebag jock. He should approach, but not in such a creepy way. And it's not his routines, his normal conversation patterns are creepy. I don't know what he looks like, but that's not the big concern. It's how he talks to people. Telling him kudos on approaching but work on the creepiness should not deter him from approaching and is not meant to by anyone here. Someone telling you nice outfit but your breath stinks is trying to help your bad breath. You can say I dont give a fuck what people think of me, but you're just losing valuable feedback that can actually help you. You can be the badass with bad breath and keep offending people, or you could be the guy that buys some mints and keeps it moving.
Quote:
rsd recently lost Alex who has gone onto do something else with his life. A recent rsd thread posted on the main forum had Tyler inform members recently. "More than enough" was his philosophy. I believe he was among their best instructors of not the best.
A guy like Alex who is fairly normal and in shape, telling you you are more than enough is bs. Far different from a socially awkward guy telling women their teeth are yellow or other awkward things. That's the same logic as when a guy asks if height matters, people say "no, look at Tom Cruise!" when the guy has 5% in common with TC.

And yes, girls have it easier in many ways. If you're choosing a woman for her beauty, what does she get out of it? You better bring some humor, some money, some status, good genetics or something to get her. It's fair. Why should a girl choose a guy if he can't offer her anything...emotionally or financially or whatever? I can't get on the boat of saying you deserve a hot woman or any women if you're boring or don't have something to offer yourself. And sadly, being a guy with balls to approach or dedication to approach isn't what girls are attracted to, at least to some great extent. Be funny, or be stylish, or be good looking, or be rich, or be powerful..,heck...be SOMETHING that girls find attractive. I've never fooled myself that when I slept with a girl she did so soley because of my balls to say open. This "you deserve a 10" is good for self esteem, but isn't enough. Let girls be with guys they find attractive in some way and if you have nothing to offer besides balls to approach, fix that.

To OP:
Tweak the shit that isn't working and don't take it personally. The way you're going has virtually no chance of success. It IS better than not approaching, but that's not an excuse to not change things.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 3:23 am 
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And yes, girls have it easier in many ways. If you're choosing a woman for her beauty, what does she get out of it? You better bring some humor, some money, some status, good genetics or something to get her. It's fair. Why should a girl choose a guy if he can't offer her anything...emotionally or financially or whatever?
I've always looked at it as, everyone dates the best person they can get.
That's going to vary from one person to the next, but in just about any case, you're going to have to catch this person's attention in a way that they are drawn to. Whether that's being the cool GQ model looking guy, or the domineering drug dealer guy, whatever she's into, you'll need to be.
And it works the same on the other end. If I like tall, dark, girls with a fierce attitude, I'm not going to settle for a short, pale girl who's shy and socially awkward. Even if they're objectively on the same level of beauty.

One of the dumbest things I keep seeing in the community is looking into Asian philosophy. I'm sorry, but religions and philosophies designed by eunuchs are pretty clearly not the path to getting better with women.
If you want to do that because it interests you, cool. But much like getting lots of XBox Live achievements, it's not going to help you with women at all.
I see all these quotes from Bruce Lee and it's genuinely baffling. He was famous, rich, in perfect physical condition, and wifed up the first homely white chick he could snag. Looking up to Bruce Lee as an actor or a martial artist is one thing. But mentioning him in regards to women is asinine. Bruce Lee sucked with women.
Quote:
I can't get on the boat of saying you deserve a hot woman or any women if you're boring or don't have something to offer yourself. And sadly, being a guy with balls to approach or dedication to approach isn't what girls are attracted to
This is true. I've found GLL's opinion on being "above average" to be extremely, extremely, true. You don't need to be great at much. Just better than 3/4 of guys in a few areas that really matter.
From there, it really is mostly just handling things intelligently and playing numbers.

I think a lot of guys come into PUA because they lack something critical(or several things). And they want to make up for it in some particular area. It's the same reason some guys chase money. They think this ONE thing will fix it. It won't. "Game" is basically one of 5-6 critical areas. But I would argue it's not even the most important one. I'd say it's #4(assuming we define "game" as basically "charisma". #1 is looks. #2 is vibe, #3 is sexuality, #4 is charisma. #5 is relevant status, but it relies for most people on #4, which is why I think it's less important. It's difficult to have useful status and poor charisma. But charisma can be useful with no status at all.

But what I see from OP, is not even the type of "Game" that develops charisma, but the type of "Game" that falls into the "tips and tricks" box. I'd rank that barely in the top 10. It does matter. But it mostly matters once you have the other stuff down. If you have a lot of girls who are into you for a while, but you lose them somewhere along the way, that's when the tips and tricks help. But it's a skill for people who already have their fundamentals down. It's not very useful for someone lacking in the major categories. It's like strapping Nitto R2s onto a Toyota Echo. What possible purpose could this serve?

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Build trust and comfort by holding their hands and covertly rubbing your elbows on their nipples.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:39 am 
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And yes, girls have it easier in many ways. If you're choosing a woman for her beauty, what does she get out of it? You better bring some humor, some money, some status, good genetics or something to get her. It's fair. Why should a girl choose a guy if he can't offer her anything...emotionally or financially or whatever?
I've always looked at it as, everyone dates the best person they can get.
That's going to vary from one person to the next, but in just about any case, you're going to have to catch this person's attention in a way that they are drawn to. Whether that's being the cool GQ model looking guy, or the domineering drug dealer guy, whatever she's into, you'll need to be.
And it works the same on the other end. If I like tall, dark, girls with a fierce attitude, I'm not going to settle for a short, pale girl who's shy and socially awkward. Even if they're objectively on the same level of beauty.

One of the dumbest things I keep seeing in the community is looking into Asian philosophy. I'm sorry, but religions and philosophies designed by eunuchs are pretty clearly not the path to getting better with women.
If you want to do that because it interests you, cool. But much like getting lots of XBox Live achievements, it's not going to help you with women at all.
I see all these quotes from Bruce Lee and it's genuinely baffling. He was famous, rich, in perfect physical condition, and wifed up the first homely white chick he could snag. Looking up to Bruce Lee as an actor or a martial artist is one thing. But mentioning him in regards to women is asinine. Bruce Lee sucked with women.
Quote:
I can't get on the boat of saying you deserve a hot woman or any women if you're boring or don't have something to offer yourself. And sadly, being a guy with balls to approach or dedication to approach isn't what girls are attracted to
This is true. I've found GLL's opinion on being "above average" to be extremely, extremely, true. You don't need to be great at much. Just better than 3/4 of guys in a few areas that really matter.
From there, it really is mostly just handling things intelligently and playing numbers.

I think a lot of guys come into PUA because they lack something critical(or several things). And they want to make up for it in some particular area. It's the same reason some guys chase money. They think this ONE thing will fix it. It won't. "Game" is basically one of 5-6 critical areas. But I would argue it's not even the most important one. I'd say it's #4(assuming we define "game" as basically "charisma". #1 is looks. #2 is vibe, #3 is sexuality, #4 is charisma. #5 is relevant status, but it relies for most people on #4, which is why I think it's less important. It's difficult to have useful status and poor charisma. But charisma can be useful with no status at all.

But what I see from OP, is not even the type of "Game" that develops charisma, but the type of "Game" that falls into the "tips and tricks" box. I'd rank that barely in the top 10. It does matter. But it mostly matters once you have the other stuff down. If you have a lot of girls who are into you for a while, but you lose them somewhere along the way, that's when the tips and tricks help. But it's a skill for people who already have their fundamentals down. It's not very useful for someone lacking in the major categories. It's like strapping Nitto R2s onto a Toyota Echo. What possible purpose could this serve?

Exactly. Bruce Lee, Tolle etc. Good ideas, but guys act like it's some jedi stuff. I get why it's peddled in pickup now; it makes you feel good and allows you to reframe rejection or being a creep. As you said, play things INTELLIGENTLY. This gives you options of who to choose. Now "abundance" means you have little AA, you approach 1000 girls, 1 likes you....so you have abundance....as if the 999 were options (rolls eyes). Is being able to get 1 out of 1000 women interested in you helping you get an abundance mentality? No, you have less abundance than the guy who does 10 approaches and has 3 women interested. Somewhere down the line, being able to get one woman to like you became you "screened" for your type.

One thing I liked abt GLL was he told it straight up. Work out if you're ugly. Make moves. Don't be weird. Not read a million books and meditate 2 times a day and do whatever you feel like. The guys who the whole "do what you want to do" stuff works for are the guys who have the other aspects in place or at least enough of them, that approaching and showing interest is all they need.

It's a numbers game. Everything is a numbers game lol. The more you do something = more probability of success. Like the more resumes you send out = greater likelihood of getting a job. But you still should work on your resume writing and interview skills to increase your success.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:54 am 
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Quote:
By positive I mean positive to her. Abuse and drama can be positive emotions to a woman, I'm talking "positive" as she enjoys whatever the emotion is, not positive as in inherantly "good" or "bad." And why do you have to use obscure examples to prove a point sometimes? Yes there are women who like guys who fuck kids, who wear panties and who wear makeup. But I won't tell someone to do those things or use those as examples because generally that's not what happens and what attracts women.
Instead of using examples not relevant to PU, I will bring up a personal experience; the gang bang woman doing toilet cocaine. Her need was to feel negative emotions from a asshole male in order for her to get turned on. You combine that with cocaine and this woman was ready to do anything include group orgy gang bang. I found this disgusting since I was the one to pull her back. I am not suppose to be with her and I am content with that. There is PU thought here from guys like Fudge who believe essentially, you sprinkle game, and suddenly every woman is ready to have sex. As you stated, I wont change who I am or what I am about to accommodate women. I am not going to become that kind of man in order to sleep with more women. I wont do it.
Quote:
Why do you always focus on women using men in some way? In one breath you say Tyler is woman hating, yet use his women hating points of view. And these thoughts are coming from Tyler, a man who runs a pickup company, has incentive to lie to you, and whose reality if it is indeed going out 5 nights a week for whatever amount of years constantly, is a different lifestyle than most. That's not even a slight at tyler, you're the one who pointed out he has some twisted views.
It was if you read the post again in response to what you had said; that being "women want more." No. I am saying there is embedded misogyny in rsd. Lately, every since the JB shit storm, they have toned that down. Misogyny or not, the proof is out there, and in response to types of women I have come across, I linked you several who embody exactly what I am talking about. The one link included a woman who did a a handful of men bbc gang bang. Pics were linked to the thread. Apparently, a video is somewhere out on the web. Guaranteed, she is not spending thousands of dollars for PU BCs or instructor advice on how to pull. PU promotes that sort of introspection with men who typically are already way too into their head.

In reference to low level consciousness, this is what I am speaking about. In response to 007, the PU advice is usually not the least bit constructive nor productive. Its not like anything could be taken away or even suggestions provided for he could apply going forward. Even the youtube responses were about the same in value.
Quote:
Huh? I mentioned looks as one of other things that make a girl sleep with you. My other posts to the OP haven't even mentioned looks, I spoke about social skills. So I mention social skills, finding a coach, agree with another poster he should join clubs and make friends then a few posts later I list traits women find attractive for sex, looks being ONE point, and I'm obsessed about looks? Please, read my posts again before you get into obsession with looks.
I could be mistaken but, I counted a handful of times you kept bringing up his looks. As I stated, its not like he is about to do cosmetic surgery to look better. What is ironic is that, the amount of money people have spent on boot camps, they could have used on cosmetic surgery, and got better results.
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Look, the guy creeps girls out in his vids. He's not RB or a doucebag jock. He should approach, but not in such a creepy way. And it's not his routines, his normal conversation patterns are creepy. I don't know what he looks like, but that's not the big concern. It's how he talks to people.
Most men who turn to PU were creepy, introspective, and incapable with women. If I am to believe everything you say of your personal history with women, I am to believe you did not ever need PU cause you already had a fair bit of success with women. This is likely not 007 experience.
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Telling him kudos on approaching but work on the creepiness should not deter him from approaching and is not meant to by anyone here. Someone telling you nice outfit but your breath stinks is trying to help your bad breath.
My point is that, most who are commenting on youtube do not approach themselves, do PU or even go out. I brought up youtube to depersonalize the topic. Someone has already been spamming this thread and deterring from the topic who has been quoted as saying, they have not left their home this past month and yet, that same forum user has commented in here more times than anybody. It is ridiculous. Zyzz use to troll forums but, he got laid and gave advice. YaBoyDave was the biggest troll but, he pulled and made laughs. More inspiring in some ways since he actually said he was a forever aloner before. Not sure what changed for him? Time? Age? Life experience.
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You can say I dont give a fuck what people think of me, but you're just losing valuable feedback that can actually help you. You can be the badass with bad breath and keep offending people, or you could be the guy that buys some mints and keeps it moving.
I simply just do not care for validation or following the beaten path. I am torn. I was brought up with specific values, certain dating behaviors, and even years later, I am conflicted at times. Wait for sex? Pay for dinners? Use money to get women seems to be the message in society. Get married. Have a family. It is of course not promoted as men becoming manginas, raising children from other men as if they are their own, and being a utility or safe haven for women and their poor lifestyle choices. This does not depict every woman but, a great deal of them. Again, the current system does not provide the kind of stressors to provide a quality woman who is attractive, has her own ambitions, life goals, dreams, and morals. It is pretty much a license to kill.

007 should not give a single fuck what anybody including these girls think nor care for validation from anyone. Yes, listen to constructive feedback if valuable at all. Yes, learn from others where ever possible but, stay true to who you are.
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A guy like Alex who is fairly normal and in shape, telling you you are more than enough is bs. Far different from a socially awkward guy telling women their teeth are yellow or other awkward things. That's the same logic as when a guy asks if height matters, people say "no, look at Tom Cruise!" when the guy has 5% in common with TC.
Not sure where you are taking things with Alex. Other than, Alex is a fairly attractive guy yet on the shorter side of height. He is pretty normal, decent shape, a little on the shorter side in height but, he pulls a lot of girls. I met him a few times now. One other reason I think PU is a faulty system is all the trying rather then just being. I am not trying to get girls through PU. I am just being. In a moment; here and now, I see somebody I would like to know and I act upon that. I am sure there are bullshit routines, tactics, games or being a real asshole that may get me more women. I do not care to change nor practice bullshit.
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And yes, girls have it easier in many ways. If you're choosing a woman for her beauty, what does she get out of it? You better bring some humor, some money, some status, good genetics or something to get her.
A woman like K.K. is attractive but, she is far from what I deem as a wifey or even a girl I date. More like the trophy pull one night after a lot of partying. I value something else. Unfortunately, there are a lot of qualities that are valuable that make a woman even more attractive than simply how she looks. I agree with you on the trade off. While I do not agree with sexodus or mgtow, its the fact that they are like 007; awkward and despite their best efforts, not pulling nearly enough or at all. After she has burned through her beauty years. these men are now to become a utility to support her bad decisions, poor finances, aging physical form all of which she traded away to men who will not give her what she wants?

Something I have learned about PU and of society; we men tend to respect other men, value them more if they pull but, this is gynocentrism. This is valuing above all else what women want, desire, and accept. Men like Zyzz, Russell brand, YaBoyDave, AfcAdam, JB. We do not know of them because they changed the world, they cured cancer or ended hunger. They get laid. This is what we as a society value which stems from female entitlement.
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It's fair. Why should a girl choose a guy if he can't offer her anything...emotionally or financially or whatever?
I will return to your question but, I need to hit a few points. you stated not doing PU now while in a LTR. Fair enough. What is your long term goal with this woman? If she is in her mid or late twenties, she will want something like marriage and children at some point. Even if no children, she will want marriage and what will you say or do then?

If you were to lock down yourself or say, I were to do so, set PU aside, it would have to be worth it. The further I go down the rabbit hole, the farther away from every indulging in that white picket fence tale. The trade off is promoted as being love but, the majority of the experiences is a security for women. They want children, marriage, and a variety of other things. The trade off should be reasonable without possessions or materialism involved otherwise, something else is going on. Emotional? Like love?
Quote:
I can't get on the boat of saying you deserve a hot woman or any women if you're boring or don't have something to offer yourself. And sadly, being a guy with balls to approach or dedication to approach isn't what girls are attracted to, at least to some great extent.
Again, the first thing you went to is "hot" woman. It about her looks. It being about looks again. Yes, I agree with you on the point about fair exchange. Typically, this is not what happens though amongst the sexes. Sex is traded by women throughout their peak in youth. They than look to lock a man down on the tail end of their appearance most times.

Now, I did not make this personal but, you personalized it so, I will go there. Personally, it has never been about just looks for me with women. I want a person of quality meaning, she has some value rather than just the way she looks. I have been on a bunch of dates over the the past few weeks. As I stated before, each and every time, they were caught red handed with active dating accounts. This is again the passive dating rolling of women. This again is the cock carousel I speak of that women ride, trade, give away for free. Some of them I hooked up with. Some of them I did not. Some of them, I do not care to know or see again due to their lifestyle choices (wants babies now despite just meeting or gang bangs and toilet cocaine). What about a woman despite role models like KK actually has a brain, she reads something other than celebrity gossip and cosmo? Rather than saying she doesn't need a man, she actually is independent? What if instead of saying she is not a sloot, she just continues being a awesome human being and therefore, let it be self evident? I commend you on your relationship. I find it very cut throat with PU. I indulge and continue to enjoy every experience I have. One of my wings came to me and said, "most women our age are damaged." It was shocking to hear because he is a genuinely great guy who has had more LTR than myself and has been pulling quite a bit while single.
Quote:
Be funny, or be stylish, or be good looking, or be rich, or be powerful..,heck...be SOMETHING that girls find attractive.
this is not something I can agree with. It again goes back to what women want; gynocentrism, impress her. It being always about her. No mention of us. Despite being happy about my PU life experiences, enjoying every ounce of it, honestly, in rare instances have women matched my pace. I have seen a lot of weird and crazy. I have seen a lot of dark shit. In my experience, there is not that equal trade off and a new trend is developing. Women who proposition men (me). Women who promote fwb or gang bangs. Women who promote being hip, alternative and not needy. It never ends well.
Quote:
I've never fooled myself that when I slept with a girl she did so soley because of my balls to say open. This "you deserve a 10" is good for self esteem, but isn't enough. Let girls be with guys they find attractive in some way and if you have nothing to offer besides balls to approach, fix that.
Read Bonsai from TAF. You are someone's perfect person. Awesome read.

So, we all know 10 e standards are ridiculous and nobody here is pulling that. Moving on, again it has never been about that. Just not handling someone damaged.
To OP:
Tweak the shit that isn't working and don't take it personally. The way you're going has virtually no chance of success. It IS better than not approaching, but that's not an excuse to not change things.[/quote]


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:08 am 
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The OP is not going to take any points we say here seriously. He essentially already knows he is creeping girls out... I mean he made a thread called "The Essential Traits of a Pickup Artist + CREEPINESS"

I think he is just posting this stuff for the same reasons of: back when I played starcraft I would turn on and betray my allies in the middle of the game and laugh at their pissed off comments every now and then.

I think his behavior is that of a guy who is trolling people in real life, and that is why. He has no intention of becoming good with women.

A note on the bruce lee thing. His philosophies are translatable. He didn't make them to pick up women. Correct. He did make them essentially for the reason of "create your own system" you CAN and I do use the "create your own system" in pick up. By grabbing the best PU stuff testing it out discarding crap and building on a solid foundation by adding new skills from PU that work.

The OP does not follow a guide of discarding crap so we will see many more of these videos to come, but I will not watch another!

_________________
I am a hunter of human excellence. I seek out those individuals who break the norms
and demonstrate to all of us what’s really possible. I learn what those few
extraordinary individuals do that’s different from everybody else, and then emulate
them.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:15 am 
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Anything is possible. Success is possible.


Last edited by oceanx on Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:22 am 
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Quote:
In response to 007, the PU advice is usually not the least bit constructive nor productive. Its not like anything could be taken away or even suggestions provided for he could apply going forward. Even the youtube responses were about the same in value.
Quote:
Ok. First of all props for doing the approaches.

Second, I watched this video and a few of your recent videos. You're creeping girls out tbh. I mean I literally groaned and twisted my face while watching it was that painful. I saw your wing's "kiss close" where he lip raped a chubby girl. Putting your lips on a womans while she is pushing you away is not a k close. You're socially awkward in all of the vids and the women's face show that they are creeped out. Find someone who is legitimately good and get coaching. Indirect, direct, doesn't matter...it's awkward either way. I mean no disrespect, but if you want to improve things need to drastically change. You're doing the same bad things over and over.
Quote:
You keep "running game". This is not how socially normal people behave.

You don't need "game". You need to learn to be socially normal. You circle the dude at the table and call him "beta". The thing is, he has an attractive female friend, and you don't. He's cooler than you are.

I'm not sure what kind of odd stuff is going on in your head. You are entirely too gamified.

You need to step away from "game" and have normal conversations.

If you simply must view everything through the prism of "pickup", then please, please go find Swingcat's "Natural Vibing" program and listen to it.

And then google up GLL's "shy guy" game.

I still think you need to join things like social clubs, or a church or something, and get some regular friends, before you insist on talking to strangers, but I get the sense you're not interested in doing things that way.
Quote:
No one learns how to do this, the way you're attempting to do this.
Randomly chatting up strangers is much more difficult than having a reason for them to hang out with you.

You've been at this for how long? 6 months at a minimum. How many girls have you dated from this? How many lays?

If the answer is "zero"(and I'm pretty sure it is), that's exactly why you need to shift things in a new direction. 6 months was more than enough time for you to have gotten into groups, made friends, and dated at least a girl or two. And the best part is, it would all be building momentum to even further expansion. I don't see a lot of improvement in your delivery from when you first started. You're still creeping people out. This seems to be a dead end.

I'm telling you right now, if you keep doing this for the next six months, your results are going to be what they've been for the previous six months. I notice only mild improvement. At this rate, a year from now, it's still not going to be going well.

Wandering up with "opinion openers" is not how any normal person makes friends or gets dates. It's socially bizarre. Yes, someone who is socially well adjusted can do it. You can't, right now.
Normal conversations come up, from you already knowing the person and saying something like "how was your weekend".

Again, if you need to learn from PUAs, then check into Sinn. He has an "opener" he uses that's roughly "Hi! You look cool! So I thought I'd come say hi! I'm Jon!" and then he "stacks" into some observation about them or the environment.

At least focus on your vocal energy projection and body language. Every video I've seen, you're dead in set within 5 seconds, because you never hook them. You're so focused on saying words, and that is literally the least important part of communication. The most important part is your vibe, tonality and body language.

Edit:
Ok, looking at the video Neo mentioned, the teacher you approached. Yeah, that actually was a major improvement. You're doing better when you move away from these odd routine and opinion openers. Granted, that girl was not into you from the start and is just nice, but the conversation was vastly less awkward than the restaurant(on your end).
Your buddy is going to end up getting his ass kicked if he keeps doing that type of "kiss close", though
.
Quote:
Perfectly stated.

This is where the "assume attraction" and plowing stuff are taken the wrong way. You should be looking at feedback from your conversations, and adjusting accordingly next time. Many of the girls showed no interest off that bat, this should be feedback to improve your style and body first. Most of the conversations the people look creeped out, stop using those topics. Even if you're plowing (and I don't really even like plowing), the next approach should be adjusted. You shouldnt be having to plow every girl. In one approach, I saw you compliment a girl and tell her she had yellow teeth, then you spoke to her in a made up Asian language which would surely offend her. This is just simple social skill stuff which should be handled before gaming. As V said, join a social club or make friends first. I suggested a coach. What I think the underlying point is, find a reference point for being a socially normal guy. Even if you ignore this advice, take the feedback you receive (girls wanting to leave, blow outs, nervous stares) and adjust what you're doing until girls and people seem comfortable having conversations with you.
Quote:
You are running an insanity loop. You're using nearly the exact same framework that I saw you use in videos 1-10. You cannot expect to get different outcomes by repeating the same actions over and over again. I already explained to you that you need to sit down and restructure that shit, other people have said that as well. Yet you keep using it. Creeping people out and putting the conversational pressure on strangers trying to get them to chase you.

I love your attitude. I love your courage. I would totally wing with you because I would just make up for your craziness, but that's not going to help you get better. I see your problem. It's a problem I had when I was just an average chess player. I focused on my by the book chess techniques and didn't bother analyzing or reading my opponents.

You have to start learning context and timing. When is the proper time to apply this specific technique. You have plenty of infields to study. Doing all of these approaches and still being at the level you are is inexcusable. Since your in a get laid or die trying mode do this.

Write out your framework on a piece of paper. Or create a flow chart if you know how to do that. Then sit down and watch every single one of your videos and fix the framework. I suggest adding to the framework an endgame. You seem to be going with an endgame of just talking or getting rid of awkwardness. Fuck that. Run an endgame of getting a number, following up for a date and sticking your dick into some pussy. Or something else that results in the intercourse at the end. Enough of this baby step shit.
I could keep quoting, thats just page 1 and tired. So lengthy suggestions, props for attitude.....

Quote:
Instead of using examples not relevant to PU, I will bring up a personal experience; the gang bang woman doing toilet cocaine. Her need was to feel negative emotions from a asshole male in order for her to get turned on. You combine that with cocaine and this woman was ready to do anything include group orgy gang bang. I found this disgusting since I was the one to pull her back. I am not suppose to be with her and I am content with that. There is PU thought here from guys like Fudge who believe essentially, you sprinkle game, and suddenly every woman is ready to have sex. As you stated, I wont change who I am or what I am about to accommodate women. I am not going to become that kind of man in order to sleep with more women. I wont do it.
The gangbang woman enjoyed how she was treated. That's my point. It's positive to her.

You're going to extremes. Avoiding a creepy communication style does not = changing to accommodate or accepting less than what you want. No one does or says exactly what they would like to. Even if you're direct, you still filter. You still avoid certain topics. You still tell a girl she's coming to your place to watch a movie. Changing who you are and fixing conversation skills are different things.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:29 am 
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^ I disagree. He wants to get better, but he's been sold on advanced stuff that doesn't work without fundamentals and doesn't seem to be interested in doing what is truly important. Basically, he has bad premises that he refuses to challenge. Until he does, he won't see much improvement.
Quote:
Again, the first thing you went to is "hot" woman. It about her looks. It being about looks again. Yes, I agree with you on the point about fair exchange. Typically, this is not what happens though amongst the sexes. Sex is traded by women throughout their peak in youth. They than look to lock a man down on the tail end of their appearance most times.
I don't agree with this. Most women marry in their mid-20s, and to men of their choice. Only the ones who fail to find a man AND really want a family, start scrambling and making pretty big concessions on what she's willing to accept.
Quote:
It again goes back to what women want; gynocentrism, impress her. It being always about her. No mention of us. Despite being happy about my PU life experiences, enjoying every ounce of it, honestly, in rare instances have women matched my pace. I have seen a lot of weird and crazy.
Unless you're having a problem screening women, then that's not the issue. Cupid's problem is not that he's banging too many chicks that aren't good for him. It's that he's dead in the water on attraction. You need to be attractive to some women, before the option of selection appears. Right now, working on self is important.

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Build an emotional connection through your hard throbbing cock.
Build trust and comfort by holding their hands and covertly rubbing your elbows on their nipples.
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