Sean, what you wrote is what I have been trying to convey since I arrived in the PUA society.

You don't need to plug every hole who walks your way, guys. Find ones that fit nicely and stick with it, until it no longer fits. And, find more reasons to stick with it than just sex.

I am the 42 year old in the club. One thing...I am not the old guy in the club. I am also not looking for women who were born after I graduated high school. The woomen in DC clubs include women in their mid-20s to 40s. They have a career. You gotta be 21 to get in a club, and most don't bother leaving the old hangouts until they are well into their 20s.

Young guys don't understand. They think either I say keep your wick dry until you find some woman worthy of it because I don't understand or that things were different 15 years ago. They are not different, and, I do understand.

But I am old enough to have wisdom. Been through enough to have experience.

My dick dipping got me into trouble for the last 15 years. It won't happen again.

Unlike most of the PUA community, my goal is to meet incredible women and not have sex with them, but have a great time with them otherwise. It's a lot more fulfilling because i can have intimate times with them without the sexual baggage.

But, like you, I don't do the club thing any more, except to help friends get over their sticking points in PUA. It is where I learned my initial skills of approach. And, now that my focus has become to grow as a person, the women io am attracted to tend to be in those place...lectures at the Woodrow Wilson Bldg, ultralight and hanggliding. ballroom dances at foreign embassies.

good good quote

This is why I have lots of non-gay love for you man! I am recently unemployed, but I'll be back in the UCP as soon as I can.

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Artax
Devil's Advocate

"You're only as young as the women you feel."
"I am the Master of my unspoken words, and the Slave to those words that should have remained unsaid."

see, those are your limiting beliefs.

if only you could channel your feelings into GAY love, you could have lots of money very quick!

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Sean Messenger
http://LVo3.com

"War is not the answer. Love is."

I don't view The Game as a path to happiness or enlightenment or anything like that. All I see it as is common advice/techniques/philosophies/theories on picking up chicks. I'm interested in picking up chicks and that's why I'm here. Whether that's to fill a void or not is irrelevant. What is relevant is I love women and I love sex. I'm not too fussed whether I stick with one woman or go with many at this stage.

If I may contribute my meager 2c.

First off, great post Sean.

Secondly, I'm relatively new (I guess I've been practicing the Game since 2007), but I'm 100% happy with my 'love-life'/seduction skills. (Other areas of my life, I'm not, but that's irrelevant.)

We've probably heard the proverb 'repeat a lie a thousand times and it becomes the truth' ... I think that's a large part of the Game. Don't misunderstand me. Most of the main precepts are true. Women want a masculine, solid, sexual man who is also fun to be with (funny, unpredictable, socially 'smooth', etc.)

Is what we are defined by what genes we were were born with or is it what we make ourselves? I believe it's what we make ourselves.

And that's what the Game teaches. Some men aren't funny. Some are shy. Some are immature. Some are pussies. But all that can be changed. And the Game teaches how to fake those attractive qualities (confidence, masculinity, unpredictability, funniness, sexuality). Fake it long enough, and it gradually becomes part of you.

Once you are that real man. A true Alpha Male. Most women will find you attractive. And that's the reality. Women like sex just as much as we do. But just as men don't like ugly chicks, women don't like bitch-ass (for lack of a more eloquent term), boring men.

Once you've become that attractive male, what are your goals? Some, sex. Some a better social life. Some just want to become a better man. Who knows.

A lot of people have made the Game all about sex, but that isn't the point.

I haven't fucked a girl in probably a couple of months. A few years ago, and my self-esteem would be hurting a lot. But now, I don't care. Why? When you log onto facebook and have to respond to, say, 15 different pokes and flirtatious msg's, when you turn on your cellphone and look at 10 different names in this city you're visiting that you KNOW are only a phone call away from sleeping with, it doesn't mean anything anymore.

I've become what I wanted to become. Someone confidence in my masculinity, in my attractiveness. I'm the kind of man my friends envy, and women want. I can walk into any bar and walk out with a girl to go home with. I know this. But I don't even care for it anymore.

I met a girl through the Game who I love. Does a girl rejecting me on the street hurt me? Not in the slightest. Would she rejecting me hurt me? Unspeakably. Because I really do love her. (I haven't slept with her though, recently, because I'm miles away)...

I view the Game a little bit like a school. Ever seen the movie School for Scoundrels? A guy who spent his life in that school is a loser. A guy who learns from it, improves himself, and continues in life a better man, contributing to techniques to improve yourself. That's a good man.

If you've been in the Game a year and your still spending your time learning lines and routines, it's done nothing for you.

If you've been a year in the Game, and you're ad libbing negs and spitting material which other men want to imitate. Then you've succeeded. You've become a real man.

Women enjoy sex just as much as we do. Ugly (and attractiveness in a woman is scientifically proven to be directly proportional to how 'feminine' she looks) women don't get laid much. Men who are are pussies (men who act 'femine') won't get laid.

Women have makeup, attitude, clothes, plastic surgery. We have the tricks from the Game to give us ideas on how to act more like a real man.

Once you're a real man, choose what you want in life.

great post, it seems you given some very deep thought on the subject

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"Crushing requires a crushing mood" Miyamoto Musashi

the way I see it is, If thsi makes u happy (with the effects it has in your life) then keep at it, but if its making you miserable then don't. you really can't preach to everyone because there is no one right answer.

" I wish would never with this many women" "I wish didnt settle for this one woman" you'll always want the opposite of what you have.

The point is that the homosexuals who promote the industry are not going to make anyone happy. Look, I have spent the better part of almost six years in Eastern Europe. I could give you a list of towns (Tallinn, Riga, Kaunas, Minsk, Odessa, Varna, etc.) where beautiful girls are common and will want to go out with you. In the end does this make you happy and content with who you are? Hell no. It is a mirage of happiness. True contentment begins from within. It doesn't take anyone or anything from outside. It all starts from within. You can feel it this very moment if you choose.

The question is how do you find it. Well, I would suggest mindfulness. Maybe buying some cheap books by the likes of Watts or Suzuki. Eastern Philosophy can be combined with whatever religion or beliefs you currently have. Don't be scared of it. It will open your eyes to cherishing the very moment. Not attaching yourself to feelings or things. Being here at this very moment in time. It will also increase your ability to focus and concentrate. I can now actually read a book with my mind at peace. I can watch a sporting event without any thoughts creeping up. Peace within is true beauty. Empty your minds and be free.

Yes, sex and "hot chicks" are really unimportant. Only the small man lets them define who he is.

Peace.

Sean,

Absolutely.

Posted this on another topic blog.....

the-rafc-stage-and-text-game-a-must-read-vt39844.html

....... but thought I'd spill my 2 cents on what I get from PUA'ing and I guess in relation to the "Game" (seems like it applies here as well).

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The hotter they are, the harder they fall....for me.

it's all balance... i think that was actually the message of Neil's book.

but much like Marilyn Manson, Erik and TD both knew how to portray themselves as the villain, knowing the villain of any story gets more press (and therefore more business).

After all, the American dream has nothing to do with balance. We're all excess, all the time. Mo money, mo women...

and as the late great BIG said, mo problems.

:p

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Sean Messenger
http://LVo3.com

"War is not the answer. Love is."

Old post, but I found it quite interesting. I came into this topic expected to be offended, considering The Game was how I learned of the PUA community and that I hail to it almost as a Bible. But I had a quite different reaction.

I disagree though, in no way have you stated cold hard evidence that "The Game" is a lie. It's not everybody's choice in the game to sift through hundreds of women and be Casanova.

I know this through personal experience. I read "The Game" at a shitty point in my life. Being introduced to the pickup community has helped me as a man, not just with women. (In fact, I haven't even truly closed a woman, yet I already feel like a more fulfilled person.) It gives people the social tools and concepts to help out so many aspects of their life. In fact, I didn't see the main message of The Game as "picking up tons of women" (although, in fact, that was ONE of them ) but rather as a self improvement sort of thing. Neil even acknowledges it himself.

This isn't a court of law, right?

"The prosecution did not demonstrate BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT that Neil Strauss is a snake and his book is a evil, evil thing! If the rant don't fit, you must acquit!"



As anyone who knows me will tell you, I love to venture forth my opinions based on my observations and personal experience. And there will always be others with a different experience. I want to play the role of contrarian to question accepted wisdom... and sometimes I will say some things that do not fit your experience.

And sometimes I'll just talk complete shite.

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Sean Messenger
http://LVo3.com

"War is not the answer. Love is."

Love is nice, but what to do if all girls you ever loved are either taken or don't like you unless you enter a state of numbness in which you can't like them? Or if your self-esteem has been crushed to pieces by a horrible childhood, that has made you doubt your ability to give love back? I see no other option than the game, or suicide, to restore the missing pieces of my brain given that start. That, or some girl I could actually like just magically starts hitting on me and she magically knows of my problems but is willing to help me with my broken mind - but I haven't seen a flying pig yet.

Your posts just seems like a poorly disguised way of bragging about someone actually loving you. Which she probably doesn't, she just:
1. thinks you're not a psycho she needs to be afraid of
2. she thinks the logistics you can offer (money etc) are a comfortable basis for her future life
3. she thinks you'll accept her getting her children with someone else, because she thinks you're either too stupid to catch her cheating, or that you're meek enough to not care

I'd like things to be different and I'd love to be able to trust someone who is simultaneously attractive, funny and so on, but honestly nobody has given me reason to believe this exists. On the contrary, just a quick glance at couples passing me in the streets etc, I'd say 95% aren't experiencing anything that can be described by the word "love".

If you want to start a revolution of love, a PUA forum isn't the right place. We're here because we're fed up with trying to change a f-ed up society, instead trying to succeed within the limits set out by society. Try taking over mass media instead if you want to make propaganda about love. Surely, I wouldn't mind a more loving society in which also the love as in trust could be shared among friends as well as with a wife.

The game isn't a lie, our society is. It's really absurd with a society that requires you to abandon all your behaviors that come natural to you in order to succeed in getting women. However, what's equally absurd is that society brainwashes us to lose our really natural instincts first, so that the PUA "tricks" are really about trying to recreate the pure and undamaged person you were at birth.

You probably feel, when writing this post, that God is looking down on your and smiling at you, and that you're smiling broadly back towards him, as a good sheep and follower of His morality. A man who spreads love and baby Jesus must surely be laughing and the angels singing. But honestly all you're doing is trying to break down the hope of all who have been deprived of hope. You're trying to extinguish the wavering flame of a candle lit in a dark subterranean grotto, telling us to let the sunlight guide our steps, where there is no sunlight. Your Judeo-Christian hypocrite morality disgusts me greatly.