Yea, is that bad?

Anyways a few things, I've never had a girlfriend, the women I have liked were assholes to me, used me for things. I've put a stop to that however I no longer try to hard.

Now one thing I'm wondering is do you think it's worth me going out and giving pickup an attempt? I mean I've basically given up, though I'd be curious to see if the techniques had any effect at all.

Why have I had no girlfriend? I just never connected well with anyone, and the one girl I did put be in the friends zone of over a year till I decided no matter what I'd cut all ties with her. I did it and boy did she flip out, she then continued to try and force me into being her pal, I told her no and get lost. Very tough one because I'd cared alot for her but I did it never-the-less because I'm no ones bitch.

Alright........... where does someone with 0 experience and luck with women go?

There's a few hot girls where I work, well more than a few, I can talk to them and make them laugh, but they ALWAYS seem unaware I'm hitting on them, or just act innocent like nothing is going on. There have been times I've been utterly perplexed by these women........ for example

This guy that's a jerk, he somehow got this 20ish girl to fuck him, then he and she break up, he gets with her again, then she hates him and they're through? But he still fucked her and I was like "wth, why would she fuck him he's a jerk?" Anyways I was trying to figure her out and decided she's to hot for her own good, probably a princess type idk. This guy told me she liked tough biker like dudes, ones that could defend her, but it sounds so childish to me. Hell she had more risks with this idiot around than any protection he offered.

Oh one thing that I wasn't sure about, perhaps you have insight. There is an older woman where I work, one day she came up to me and asked if I wanted her number. I said sure thinking it might be fun, but later I found out she has 2 kids and recently got divorced. So I was considering the past and the last woman like this I was kinda talking with ended up getting pregnant by some weirdo and now has 3 little idiots around her lol Her fault though.......... soooo I figured same thing here? She is just desperate and wants assurance she's hot, so looks for some loser like me and uses him? I mean I paid for all 3 dates, but NEVER made a move.......... then listen to this, one day a few nights ago she left a voicemail while I was at work, it said she wanted to make out and would I meet her at a restaurant.

All I could think of was that past girl and how bad getting some chick pregnant would be, I mean from my experience women ALWAYS want something besides sex. This woman to me felt like she wanted some guy around 1. to make her feel better 2. to start replacing daddy.......

So I didn't return her message but was at work anyway so couldn't have gone.

You see my issues here, I know some may have gone to her after work but seriously it felt kinda out of place after those boring 3 dates. Someone told me maybe I'm not that into her, well I'm not. Divorced women with kids are bad news IMO

But anyways I always give that creepy vibe off too btw, but I have given up talking to women because the conversations go nowhere but in circles and it's sooooo boring. I want to sleep with them not listen to them, wth.

Whatever, you guys can ask me anything or just give insights, I feel pretty fucking weird though being 31 and a virgin, but what can I do force them? LOL There are alot of hot girls at work but no matter how friendly I am with them they never seem to get the hint. Should I just goto a random bar alone? I have few friends....... anyways bye

i would suggest you goto South East Asia better still goto Philippines there you can meet a nice girl who will give you what your looking for.

My 2nd bit of advice is dont tell any girl your a virgin, unlike girls theres no way of knowing so just keep it to yourself

Best of luck
JK

you seem like you might want to check out a counselor or something, you might have some more deep seeded issues and resentment going on,

almost all of this post sort of seems to be comming from a very negative place, there is a lack of true expression towards these women and alot of negative assumptions,

people are only able to manipulate you as far as you allow them to, you are the master of yourself

you don't have these people in your life because you are needy, and when you can't get something of value from someone, you de-tach, this is fairly anti-social and emotionally reactive behavior, it is damn selfish

you also say women you have liked are assholes to you, same thing as the manipulation, people will only treat you how you allow yourself to be treated, they say that interactions with others merely give you a reflection of yourself, almost any girl, even with absolutely 0 sexual interest can be gotten along with (although obviously there are just some naturally mean spirited people, and people with mental problems, you don't have to surround yourself with these people that are negative all the time)

does a random forum think you should go out and give pickup a try?, that's really a question you have to answer for yourself, but you might want to fix yourself first and learn to love yourself before you go out and try to love someone else, all the techniques won't help you when you are in a needy, depressed, lonely state of mind and you feel like you have low worth, you have to see past this hatred

really you can tell the world what you want, but you can not lie to yourself and you know how you feel, there are ways to feel better and make a positive change, but it isn't easy and will take alot of hard work

I get the sense you are very judgemental and critical of people, and women especially, if a girl is not good looking to you she is a write off and you would never be caught dead even talking to a girl you didn't find physically attractive, girls absolutely know when you are inexperienced and needy, they can tell, you can sense the lack of confidence, the inability for someone to express what they are thinking, there is a constant incongruence in what they are doing, and neediness is a turn off to anyone, male or female, a lack of generosity and compassion for others, always looking for something better, something to make you feel complete, even when you get something that you wanted it is never enough, never satisfied always looking for more, having an idea of what someone is like and forming an opinion is fine, everyone naturally does this, but if you can't keep an open mind and allow yourself to see as they are and let them change your opinion, and be forgiving as well as open, then you are blinding yourself

happiness is simply a state of mind, you can be happy, just because you choose to be, it will never come as the result of getting anything, sure you might get a temporary rush from accomplishing a goal, a flood of dopeamine in your brain from reaching a new height, but it dissipates and eventually the feeling is gone

people are attracted to an abundance, when someone has it all, it is attractive, when someone has nothing it is repulsive, demonstrating to others behavior that shows you have nothing will repulse them, because naturally, most people are needy and don't have an abundance, but they want that abundance, so they are drawn to those that demonstrate that abundance

you are very caught up in the past, and worried about the future, there is alot of clouding going on from this need, you are holding on to the negatives, there is no forgiveness

so what if some girl sleeps with a guy she likes, so what if you think he is a jerk, obviously she really likes him, or she would not spread for him, why does this even matter to you? are you attached to this girl in some way? does she owe you something? you don't need anything from her and there are other girls everywhere

some lady gave you her number and you rejected her because of something that was outside of her control, you are a 31 year old virgin, how will you ever get experience if you can't walk into something new with an open mind?

all these rationalizations of all these women either hating you or wanting to use you, you are not a victim here, and if you act like one, eventually you will be treated like one and a self fulfilling prophecy comes to life, you could be spending your effort solving your problems, instead of avoiding them, avoiding those negative feelings, even though you control how you feel, and those feelings are your own, it's really interesting but you can actually change how you feel about something, simply because you look at it from a different angle, if you are always focused on the negative, you will always feel negative

you take a girl on a date you willingly pay, you don't make a move, you don't get laid, then assume she is trying to use you?, why not just work your way around this and try to solve the problem, instead of being so negative?, stop paying and start making moves? why must you dis-connect from everyone as if they are trying to hurt you, no one is out to get you, it is all in your mind, everything is so clouded through a judgemental and negative mind frame, that girl even told you she wanted to see you again and make out with you, this is more then you will get from most girls, most girls sit on their asses and expect you to do all the work, and from what I gather, you are acting like a girl and when these girls finally do step up, you push them away cause of your own insecure negative thoughts

all these negative fears and rationalizations seem to be linked to anxiety in some way (just my own guess), it all stems around escalation, women can't want sex! they must just be using me, how many girls have you even tried to kiss in your life without needing the girl to do it for you, without needing the girl to say ''yes kiss me!'', how many times have you walked into the unknown and been ok with just seeing what happens without knowning what will happen? how many times have you only been willing to do something for someone only because you will get something in return? why is it such a problem that girls want something of value for no cost, just like you seem to want something of value for no cost?

have you ever stopped to think that just maybe, girls are frightened to death of sleeping with someone who doesn't truly care about them but just wants them for sex like some sort of meat dumpster to jack off into without hands, maybe they get something from guys they feel are just being their true selves and expressing their negative sides as well as their positive sides, at least with these guys they know that when the guy says he cares, he probably means it and it is congruent, because he is brutally honest and congruent with everything else he does, have you ever thought that just maybe girls want to feel loved and want you to kiss them and give them a real effort and perservere even when they put challenges in front of you, just so they are sure you actually want them for them and find them special instead of just want to have sex and if it isn't easy for you just cut them off and get mad, doing so just shows them how little they matter to you, and that is the thing, you can say anything, but they don't care what you say, they care about what you show them, everything you do shows them what kind of person you are

forgive everyone, forgive your old friends, forgive your old enemies, and most of all forgive yourself, it is ok, you are not hated, you don't have to let others treat you poorly, you don't have to respect those that dis-respect you, but at least try to understand them and offer forgiveness, if you can't forgive them, you will not be able to move on from these terrible emotions, you are carrying a heavey weight and you might want to talk to someone about it

you say there are a lot of hot girls at your work and no matter how friendly you are with them, they never seem to get the hint, no, they get the hint, they are not stupid, they know what you are wanting and they don't think you are friendly, there is just something you want from them, and they realize this, they can sense the little comformities in your actions towards them, the way you judge, the negativity, the vibe, everything shines through always, the way you are truly feeling and what you are thinking, shines through like a bright light, and if the window does not offer a clear vision of the light, you can sense it, it is incongruent

they get that same feeling from you, as you get from those girls trying to ''use'' you, there is an incongruence going on and they don't feel you are being yourself, you are trying to manipulate them into something that they should just want intrinsically

fix the inside, before you put effort into the outside, when you are ready then it will be time to get to work, and it will be a hell of alot of hard work and improvement and could take you your whole life, making yourself vunrable and being ok with the unknown is not an easy thing, but it certainly is rewarding

giving to others and expecting nothing in return, is one of the best gifts you can give yourself

I'm not sure what to make of that, but I would say that is considered being a suck-up. I'm not a Christian, and thats what Christians do is forgive everyone. I don't have to let girls know who i don't like or like. I have people I'm at odds with and they wronged me. And they were not women I wanted, just people who I thought were true friends.

So at 31 we can't sleep with young girls who don't have kids? We have to take the leftovers of the all the other guys she screwed?

This awesome post and totally correct!

Thanks for this Pump.

You must have a secretary for all your work.lol

i am copying pumpington post for myself too!
I learn more from pump's post than going to church. seriously man!.

moonlightmile listen to pump. I can't make better word than this. He is a true friend of life.

'
Hey man, I'm heading toward a divorce after painful seperation. I'm not too different from you other than the virginity thing, no offense but I know where you are coming from on the massive introversion thing for sure. It is damn hard for me out there and I'm doing this rollercoaster thing right now between weird success and shutouts from creeper vibe. I'm older ..38 but I look like a rock star, in shape, make a fair amount of money etc but the massive introversion/social anxiety still cripples me which I'm trying to work against.

I'm also a pretty serious atheist after having Jesus shoved down my throat when I was a little kid and forced to conform to religion..didn't renounce it until college when I actually went and studied it for myself instead of accepting what I was given.

HOWEVER Jesus, or at least the idea of forgiving others has a lot of merit on it's own. It's the golden rule right? I don't know what you are besides not a Christian but personally as an atheist I believe we all only have one go round so why not make it the best for others as well as yourself.

Dude, this entire thing needs stickied somewhere.

31 is not late, period. I actually gave up the pain from my life 6ish months ago. Ive never felt better, more alive, and successful around all humans not just women. Just go for it!

Well I never said 17, thats under age of consent in some states. !8 maybe? More realistic is girls between 20-24. As for my unrealistic standards, I think I have a problem with what the other guys are doing. Like, if they can have this, why can't I? Idk its just that I guess. I want to be successful and more than just with women. But I worry about time and I just want to get that slice of life before its over.

I do believe in God I just am not a Christian, I know that a lot of girls may not feel attracted to a guy who thinks he's not Heaven-bound SPAM, and many don't want to believe what the Bible touters tell them. And its dangerous to call yourself a Righteous man and then do wrongful acts. I couldnt do it, and it has nothing to do with being from the south. The churches all over teach this that have a denomination. Those that don't tend to not want to scare anyone and basically say the Light is shining on the wrong ones. I talked to a Church member recently about this? I wouldnt talk about religion with women, unless they give me a nasty outside attitude and then I probably would tell her to "Find God". If people believe in God and want Heaven, then they shouldnt have an attitude with other people.

As for the forgiveness thing....I know of a guy who gets along well with his family, but he sucks with women. I don't believe the closer to your family the better you are with women. I think its basically putting yourself in a positive environment and away from drama in anyones lives you know. This is something Im having a hard time getting away from.

Welcome!

I could be wrong, but I think what Tony is saying is that sometimes you have to learn to crawl before you can walk, and walk before you can run.

Before you start aiming for the 20 year old honeys, you may have to date a few women your own age or possibly a little older. There's nothing wrong with this! There are a lot of very good looking older women out there and just because woman has had kids doesn't mean she's some used up skank.

Firstly, older women (post 30) generally know what they want in bed... And if they don't, that's fantastic too because you can show them what they've been missing out on, and that, my friend, is a powerful thing. Furthermore, women in their 30's are in their sexual prime... This means they want it as much as you did when you were 18.

Once you get some confidence and experience with a woman like this, it's much easier to transition to a younger girl and knock it out of the park. She'll wonder where you learned all of your tricks and think of you as experienced. Keep in mind, most of the guys SHE'S slept with have been inexperienced, selfish, or completely boring.

But it seems a lot of younger guys are good in bed because of being sexually active in their teens and all. And the downside to older women is the lack of youthful fun during sex. I just don't want to tell people I'm a 31 yo virgin in a bar or somewhere.

Your over thinking things too much. If a girl is going to give you her number let her. Let the whole office see it (as long as it does not get you fired) it is social proofing.

DO NOT BE AFRAID OS SUCCESS!

You need to change your mindset. Yes obviously you want to sleep with them but once you do that you will want something more as she will too. Start testing her and have standards and see if she is willing to jump through some hoops for you.

If you really are that desperate to get laid then wait for a holiday like st.paddies day and pick up some drunk older women.