Hey man, great post, read the whole thing.

Being really into MM and that kind of indirect approach i was a little in disagreement with a couple of your points and would like to know what you think:

1. When you say sorry to bother you, isn't that like a DLV? aren't you conveying the idea that you're a bother and she's more valuable so you have to excuse yourself? I'm not saying its bad i think it has some merit in showing that you're a respectable guy and care for her time but isn't it a bit of a DLV?

2. Im curious how you handle groups in day game? say perhaps this HB9 is with her friends at the mall having a frappucino or whatever, and you approach her saying you love her style, wouldn't her friends try to CB you? i'm only asking because, as you know, women of beauty are rarely found alone and are usually hit on so often her friends have to interject...

So i guess i'd just like to hear a little bit of how you would handle group dynamics in the day?

_________________
You miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

Thanks man, I'm happy you guys are taking the time to
read the whole thing. It's great to know I've established
a common ground in how serious you guys are in
improving yourselfs Keep it up!
Not at all, you're over analyzing the idea of apologizing when opening.
You're actually DHV'ing...Women do actually like gentlemen or even
guys with manners attractive. Girls wanted to be treated with
respect and buy showing her in early stages that you're a
confident and mannerful gent, that's already a big
investment in her book (a guy who is charming, confident
and insightful...what is his name? ), and although
you're not there, in early stages of approaching,
to her contact details it is very likely for her
to have these thoughts all the while gaming
her. It's makes it that much easier to
win her over.

Weather you tell her that you're
sorry to bother you is irrellevant, it will be up to her about what her initial interaction with you will fold out
and how you come across / convey towards her
if she thinks you're a bother. It's all in the approach...
if you put on a friendly smile, show genuiness (is there a word? lol)
and respectable it will all go smoothly and she won't mind you
approaching her at all...she WILL thank you for it.

If you also read in the beginning of my post I
hindered that many of you guys tend to over-think
or over analyze a simple technique The whole point
of it is to not think about it all! The second
you're out there and looking for a girl to open
and you start thinking about the different
scenarios that can play out if she doesn't
like you etc...you start losing, not only
out there, but with yourself. I spend
alot of time in my head before approaching,
but I just turn around and fucking run back
and approach her anyway!

Infact, you've given me an idea. I'm going to post
another video for you guys in 2 days (Tuesday) and I'm going
to show you how I approach direct to give you perspective
of how easy it is on using the routine given. I think, wait,
I KNOW it will help you guys even more, because
it goes without saying "Seeing is believing" Fair?

That's simple. Approach her friends first. Even better if their not as
good looking as the one you're after because you're making it
seem like you're not even interested in the hot one! It
works like this: If you approach a small group, lets
say 3 girls (2 of them are 6 and 7, but the 3rd
is you're target and she's the 10). You approach
by complimenting her friends first. This creates
social proof within her circle because they
can already see you like them
and aren't paying attention to
the one with the most value in the group (the hot one).
After giving value to the 6 and 7 you have now been
pre-selected by 10 because she's wondering
"Why is he not noticing me? I'M HOT!",
and she will want you and she hasn't
even met you! Do you know how
often guys make that mistake
of approaching the hottest
girl in the group and ignore
the one's with less value or
quality? That is the perfect
time for those girls to make
you're life hell because they
can see you're trying to
get with their queen and
not with them.
Imagine what she's thinking
when you're not even trying to go
fer her?

Me:"Hey guys, sorry to bother you, but I just HAD to let you know
I really like you're guys style (the 6 and 7)

6&7:"Oh wow thank you We don't get complimented much..."

10:"Hello? I'm the hottest in the group? Can I have some attention?"

6&7:"No he's ours!"

See how that can play out? Win over her friends first, then use their
the social proof gained from them to get pre-selected by you're
target. Of course, this breaks into a whole new spectrum
of how to proceed further.

This can get tricky so it is best to stick to approaching
1 girl for now...

_________________
'Bitches aint shit' - Chai

Yeah, i see what you mean. With a direct approach you're already letting her know of her intentions and she'll either like your energy or not, but even so the TC works well because even if she wants you to leave you've already established you're going to... do you have any games or general teasing you use to create attraction?
Yeah man, this is too true, haha. I overanalyze everything, not so much during but really afterwards I'm thinking about everything that went down and what i could've done better or change... i guess it does help when it's constructive but most of the time it's just stalling and avoiding going for the next approach.
I think i'll try to be more like this, after all your method is more about getting over the fear of approaching and learning desensitizing yourself from the "what if" questions. I think i really need to get into that "i'm the shit" mindset that get you in that talkative mood...
Cool man, i feel like big problem i have aside from opening is getting the conversation going even further, usually I'm thinking of what cold reading i could do or some quality about her i could talk about... always trying not to be that guy that drags out his comments (oh you have a dog? and you feed him treats? AND he can sit on command? nice... ). So i think seeing you in action might help me with the opener delivery...
Yeah man, this makes sense. its better to start small and slowly warm up to the bigger sets until i feel comfortable running game in any situation. Hey if you don't mind my asking, would you say running game has helped you in more aspects than just getting girls? have you become a more social and outgoing person u think?

_________________
You miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

Exactly.
I'm not really into games in pickup to be honest If however you're
referring to teasing per say I'd use a simple and playful neg
like "You're pretty cute You're like my nieces goldfish!",
I try to use childish negs too...If she swears I might say
"Didn't your mother teach you about bad language?
That's naughty!".

Take into consideration you should never reward compliance
with a neg as it's counter-intuitive to what she actually
qualified herself for.

I've also noticed, forgive me if I'm wrong, but
are you the kind of guy that likes to cover up true
feelings or emotions with humor? I'm just asking
cause it's pretty common for guys to stand
behind a wall of smiles or comedy to
mask a true feeling (I do too
sometimes. Like, if someone hurts
my feelings I just smile and say "haha ok"
you know?)

Like, If a guy is too scared to give a girl a hug
he'll say something funny to mask his
intentions to avoid deeper interaction,
he'll say "You feel like a fluffy bunny ",
but what he doesn't realise that the more
he hides behind that humor wall he's getting
deeper into the friend zone...and that's why
guys always wonder to themselves "I'm a funny
and friendly guy, why do girls only like to see me as
a friend? What's wrong with me??"

I may be digressing but I just wanted to
point that out too, don't use humor too much
than you should to mask you're real intentions.

What I do (not very often, but sometimes) after the approach
I whip out my phone and make a note and jot down any
points that could have gone better in the approach.
Generally after approaching I walk away and
notice the girl smile before I leave, so
the only thing I guess I could really
work on is my timing. More so,
how long it takes me to turn
around make that approach.
Sometimes it takes longer
than 5 seconds to turn
around and run...sometimes
it's 3 (I don't use Mystery's 3 second rule that
often), one time I turned around instantly
The more approaches you do the easier
it will become. Don't move onto things
you know you aren't comfortable to
get into yet...it fucks you up,
I know.

A few months ago I was doing really well
in my approaches and I thought I should
make a in-depth hidden video on how
to transition and number close!!
I went out nearly everyday and
I didn't make any approaches
because I kept freaking myself
out cause I was trying to move
into a field of game I had no experience
or calibration to even attempt! I
thought I was that good, when infact
I wasn't..and I wasted a whole
month of trying a routine
where I had ZERO confidence
in myself of doing!

I let myself
down and I let the community down
by promising a video I couldn't post
and a routine I couldn't achieve, all
cause I wanted to move up fast and
skip more levels instead of taking it
slow, gaining that inner
confidence and just acknowledge
where I was at in my game.

That's when I realized, if I just focus on
making my approach awesome
the rest of the routine will follow.
Lesson learnt! And what I learnt is
that if you know and acknowledge
within yourself that you're
not ready to move onto
a specific routine...don't
force yourself into
that ground until
you're 110% confident in
yourself that you can pull it off,
cause if you cant, you'll be back to square 1.

But I digress lol. Anyway...

Don't get too critical into the minor shit man, like
don't say to yourself "I shouldn't scratch my face
when in set", that doesn't help and it's not even critical.
A good observation would be "How was my
body language? Did I seem jumpy or
fidgety? *Make a note* Don't
stand too close to target and
smile more!!, and then
remember the good points
you did follow in the approach..."I smiled, I went
in confident etc"
Criticize where and when it's needed.
I've been going to self-esteem course lately man (generally
I'm always a pretty happy-go-lucky guy but there's always
room for improvement and key knowledge to learn from
esteem). I've learnt to tell myself to use 'Replacement
Vocabulary'. If I use 'I think I can do it', say to myself
instead 'I KNOW I CAN DO THIS!!'.
It's a great habit to get into cause you start
adjusting your mindset to think positively
in given situations Little things like
that can greatly improve you're
attitude towards things you
are going to come in
contact with.
Start doing it today. Whenever
you use a word with 'think', 'maybe' or 'try'
in those instance, use Replacement Vocab.
and internalise it immediatly to start
thinking positive thoughts and
creating POSITIVE energies...
The moment you think
'I'm going to try and approach a girl' replace
that with 'I'M GOING TO MAKE THAT APPROACH!"

Trust me, this a good stepping stone to creating that
positive approach, pardon the pun!

Ah! What's wrong with this sentence? You know how to correct
that now.
In all honesty, Game has changed my life and opened my mind
up to so much knowledge I never knew possible, it's unreal man...

Back in school I was a really shy kid and very socially
awkward to talk to people...to the point that when
break came, I was the first one to get out the
classroom so I could go and hide inside the
bathrooms so I didn't have to talk to
anyone. It was horrible man...

I would hear people come into the
bathroom and just think to myself "Don't do
or say anything!! JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP
AND THEY'LL GO AWAY "
It was bad cause I had no
social skills to talk to
anyone, simply cause
I had no-one to teach me
how to communicate effectively with
others.

Learning Game has helped me grow in so many ways. It's
made me become more outgoing definitely! It basically
can be applied to anything in your life. The premis of
Game to me is: To build the confidence in yourself, overcoming
you're fears and accessing that power within to become
that rockstar.

If ONLY I had learnt this stuff when I was 13 and not when I was 18, life
may be completely different...but I know that's everything up until now
has happened for a reason. Like, if I mastered the game (hypothetically)
at 16, would I be on the forums helping you guys out so that you wouldn't
make the same mistakes? FUCK NO. I wouldn't even consider helping
anyone cause I would keep all that knowledge to myself haha.

But as I'm now 21, I'm much older and wiser to where I was
and where I am now, and I know that if keep up what I'm
doing and continually learn, grow and help others
I'll lead a really fulfilling life in the future.

To be honest, I'm happy I haven't mastered game yet cause I
enjoy giving advice to you guys...and although I'm not
a PUA (yet) it makes me happy to see that people
take kindly to my advice given so they don't
make the same mistakes I have. I've
messed up alot and the best way to
prevent similar events happening
to others is about writing about
it here...that's my goal, to get
you guys good and to succeed.
That's all I want...and I know you guys
will get there soon. Just wait and see.

_________________
'Bitches aint shit' - Chai

Interesting you would ask, what got u to that conclusion? I do at try to keep a
light-hearted joking attitude most of the time and this may sometimes cover some
feelings, sure. I try to keep the unaffected attitude though, like nothing's a big deal
and this is just kind of the person i am... i'm like that guy that never gets mad and
always tries to make the best of a bad situation, it's a life choice, haha.
See, i don't take it this far though... when i'm in a romantic interaction i try to make
my humor as c&f as i can, always socially calibrating it... and the only real sticking
point i ever have is knowing when to close with a kiss, even when i know i could i
never know quite how to engage, like Style says "If you're wondering when the right
time to kiss her is, you're probably already there."

Yeah man, this is my new goal. I've been so concerned on getting every step right
and always having the right line or DHV routine to move on and get more kino in
there and all that good stuff... I've really neglected the approach all-together, like:
when i do approach it's generally a warm approach (someone i know, or a friend
of...) and the interaction rarely goes awry but i think that's directly a result of the
fact that i haven't done enough approach to see how it could go wrong and learn
from that as a result, u know what i mean? So now i think, no.. KNOW , i'm solely going to learn the
approach and feel comfortable around random people and HBs and then i'll take those
baby steps that will eventually lead me through the rest of the game to LTRs or MLTRs
and all the rest of that good stuff. After all, with game we should be patient right? can't rush it...
This is actually a really cool tool that i have learned before, but i guess haven't
been enforcing all that well, haha. When i make goal lists for what i want to
accomplish long and short term i always make sure to write the goals in present
tense, like instead of "I want to be..." or "I will be..." i write down "I am..." instead
and though it's only a small change it really does make a difference because you
put yourself in the shoes of someone who is like you want to be and soon enough
you get that feeling of being that person and well, eventually you become him...
It's a little like doing chores and rather than saying "I have to..." you say "I want to..."
and soon enough your chores become something pleasant that leave you
feeling accomplished rather than a burden that turns the minutes into hours.
I feel you man, i know what it's like not to have friends and being completely helpless
and it's really comforting to see that you went from that to teaching people like me
how to approach strange women successfully I'm still getting there and though i
can break up a conversation and talk with people who i've been introduced to easily
it does still take me quite a while to approach a random woman and even more to
be able to build comfort, but slowly but surely...

_________________
You miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

Wow Chai, this is exceptional. I am that newbie you described, read the game, tried some of it on The Strip. Literally got called out on the "lint on the clothing neg," she straight up said don't try that pick up shit on me. Was stupid enough to get and stay in a shitty relationship for a year, now I am out and ready to go out again. Wasn't sure how to since "The Game" stuff didn't fly so well. Will definatly use this more often, only problem is I am in the military, so half the women I see during the day are in uniform, making the fashion really hard, let alone the whole respect rank structure situation. I'll be sure to use it on more civilians though.

Once again thanks for the enlightening post! Can't wait to get started changing my social life

Dunno Just a random observation lol.


Exactly. Don't make the same mistake I did when starting out
of thinking that if you miss a few steps everything should
workout...NO! Take the time to really internalize
everything in critique yourself accordingly so
you know how to better yourself for the
future so you can in fact pass what
you've learn on to others. It's the circle of
life...

I haven't got that much more to say as far as your replies go
as you've nailed all the subjects down great, you're identifying
and acknowledging you're weaknesses and you know
what you need to do. It's up to you about
what you're gonna do about it from here on
I can see you're getting the
idea or even the main premise of what I'm discussing. Fantastic.

I'm glad I posted this, it's good to know I've helped
a few people make small changes to impact in big ways.

_________________
'Bitches aint shit' - Chai

I surely hope you only'd copy and paste that post.

Cause I am not sure if anyone will ever read that LONG WALL OF TEXT.

_________________

Nope, wrote it off the top of my head in one go.

I can't tell if you're using sarcasm or genuine intent but I don't
expect anyone to read this stuff, if you say you read the
whole thing then I'll take your word for it. In the end it's up to
you if you want to read it all and really change within.
I'm not forcing anyone...

If you cant spare 10 minutes then that's your loss

_________________
'Bitches aint shit' - Chai

Great post.

What's your take on night game and direct approaches when the bitch shield comes up?

Interesting...

Although I prefer daygame to nightgame you must
remember that NG is more fast pased. Also take
into consideration that in the night or even in clubs
the girl has been hit on nearly 100 times already
in the morning so of course they'll be very
quick to judge a guy on the approach. She
already knows what to expect without
even giving him the time of day.

Many times
the dudes who try and approach either crash
and burn from using bad lines or routines,
lack of confidence, too much energy (or
lack there of), awkwardness and even
just lame conversation.

Take into consent how many guys
have hit on a gorgeous 10 and run
a routine like it was a job interview: "Whats your name?
Where you from? What's your favourite food? Who lies more,
men or women?" That gives her all the more reason for the
girl to give you a bitch shield cause she doesn't want
to be hit on! Why would she want to talk about
'who lies more' in the club?

Before I go on...Have you ever done any direct approaches at night or had
any trouble on how to deal with BS's before or are you just asking
in general?

_________________
'Bitches aint shit' - Chai

In general because I want to improve my game at night
and just feel that low risk approaches doesn't suit my style.

I've been going direct recently at nights verbally and non-verbally.. (60yoc stuff) and got blast out . . Everyone does

But once i get in set I forget about routines and I find it easier to close the deal. I'm not a great talker, so I do Shit talk + heavy kino/escalation.

But I'm not over AA yet, mixed sets, very low energy girls.. at night are still a trouble for it. But that's why im here, to fight it

But then wouldn't it make more sense
to first overcome you're AA first instead of
rushing into an unfamiliar field and
expecting an outcome you know
you can't achieve or attain to yet?

It's like I said in previous responses,
rather take you're time and to get over
that fear and then take action from there.
Don't feel compelled or rushed into a
space you know you won't succeed...
you'll be setting yourself up for failure
if you persue that.

That's fine and that's personal preference, but low-risk approaches
hold good inner game learning value. Although you don't intend
on running these kind of sets, what you can learn from
approaching within them can be beneficial to your
game in the future: Girls like conversation
and don't bite/scold upon approaching,
you're approaching stamina improves,
you learn how to calibrate and transition accordingly,
you learn when to and when not use KINO, escalating
correctly...these are just the few points to consider
that low-risk sets offer.

That's what this whole topic is about...fighting that
anxiety inside of you and learning to condition your mind
to overcome that stigma of thinking of the
'what if's' before the outcome! That's
what's stopping you from approaching,
you haven't been exposed enough or
haven't internalized the approach is
not the only problem...it is yourself which
is you're problem. You are allowing
yourself to 'restrict' YOU from
learning these minor steps.
You need to crawl first
before you can walk.
These are those stepping
stones... All the great PUA's
had to approach head on (pardon the pun)
and now their living rockstar lives.

You wouldn't
jump into a pool before seeing how
deep it really is would you? You get in slowly, and
even though it's cold waters you've never felt before
it doesn't seem natural so you'd be inclined to just
get out and do something less threatening.
But instead you say "fuck it" and proceed anyway
and dive right in...!
cause you know you can have fun inside that pool,
but you're not allowing yourself not to explore
what is at the very bottom, cause lets face
it we all know when we were little when
we wanted to swim the very first thing
we though about was "Can I touch
the bottom floor? ".

Overcome your AA in daygame first to really see
what you're capable of and how far you can push
yourself in set. DG and NG aren't all that
different. The only difference is that
the music is softer, the pace is
slower and the women
are more open to chatting
and conversing. That's the benefit.

Once you feel more confident to open, talk easier
and transition faster then proceed to nightgame.

_________________
'Bitches aint shit' - Chai

Thanks man that's an awesome way to get over aa.
I didn't have any method for this and my friends used to embarrass me until i got over it.
Really dire and hard but fast

Awesome thread, thanks for the post man. I have terrible AA unless i'm in my own social environment.