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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:42 pm 
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The Most Attractive Women Have the Least Casual Sex


What I’ve always suspected now has some solid evidence behind it:

Less attractive women seek casual sex as a compromise, and more attractive women avoid it.

The University of Notre Dame has issued a press release highlighting the research of sociologist Elizabeth McClintock (H/T: Stuart Schneiderman):

Handsome Wants as Handsome Does: Physical Attractiveness and Gender Differences in Revealed Sexual Preferences

“McClintock studies the impacts of physical attractiveness and age on mate selection and the effects of gender and income on relationships.”

Perfect for HUS!

By way of background, McClintock buys into the sexual economics model of relationships:

Couple formation is often conceptualized as a competitive, two-sided matching process in which individuals implicitly trade their assets for those of a mate, trying to find the most desirable partner and most rewarding relationship that they can get given their own assets. This market metaphor has primarily been applied to marriage markets and focused on the exchange of income or status for other desired resources such as physical attractiveness, but it is easily extended to explain partner selection in the young adult premarital dating market as well.

…Just as good looks may be exchanged for status and financial resources, attractiveness may also be traded for control over the degree of commitment and progression of sexual activity.


This confirms what David Buss said in The Evolution of Desire nearly 20 years ago:

Women desire a lasting commitment, and the most desirable women are in the best position to get what they want.

The study also features a methodology that should please those HUS readers who put little faith in surveys and hypothetical “what if” questions:

Rather than using a direct measure of sexual and romantic goals, this paper uses reported outcomes to infer goals. The advantage to this approach is that individuals may not know what they most value in partners and relationships and/or may answer questions about preferences and priorities in accordance with gender-stereotyped sexual and romantic scripts. Indeed, for men there is evidence that the sexual behavior they expect of themselves is not consistent with their actual experiences.

McClintock also points out that a preferred strategy isn’t very useful if you don’t have the power to bring your dreams to fruition:

Actual sexual and romantic outcomes are interesting because they reflect compromised rather than ideal choices: Individuals’ ideal preferences may be unattainable, forcing them to compromise and enter sub-optimal unions (or to remain single).

McClintock’s background summary cites many studies that show physical attractiveness to hold a relatively low place in the hierarchy of desired attributes, for both women and men. However, she questions the validity of these responses, much as HUS readers did when looking at the results of the Single in America survey.

In contrast, in experimental studies designed to measure individual’s acted preferences (as opposed to stated preferences), physical attractiveness is highly valued by both genders. The consistency of findings over a wide range of studies makes the conclusions reasonably credible: Both women and men value physical attractiveness highly in actual choices but value it less when reporting their preferences.

McClintock hypothesized that the most attractive people should be able to more effectively realize their goals in mate selection. She explores and contrasts “social structural” effects, i.e. a sexual double standard constraining female sexuality, vs. evolutionary theory, i.e. genetically determined gender differences, on outcomes.

Social Structural Perspective

Gendered sexual norms vary over time and place and respond to changing social conditions.
Women’s and men’s relative valuation of physical attractiveness and financial potential have become increasingly similar as women’s labor force participation increases, and this trend is stronger in more gender-egalitarian regions of the United States.
Age, education, feminist ideology, and political orientation are also important, modifying the effect of gender on the valuation of partners’ physical attractiveness and status.
The sexual double standard, still prevalent today, penalizes women and forgives (or rewards) men for accumulating sexual experience.
Women favor committed, long-term relationships.
Evolutionary Theory Perspective

Men may choose between short-term mating strategies, in which they mate with many women without committing resources to potential offspring, or a long-term strategy, in which they offer support in raising offspring in exchange for sexual access.
Women may also pursue a mixture of short- and long-term mating strategies. They use short-term mating to acquire “good genes,” generally identified by physical attractiveness and bravado. They use long-term mating strategies to acquire material support in raising offspring.
Women will be more selective than men in picking casual sex partners.


Findings

Women

1. For women, the number of sexual partners decreases with increasing physical attractiveness.

2. Very physically attractive women are more likely to form exclusive relationships than to form purely sexual relationships.

3. Attractive women are less likely to have sexual intercourse within the first week of meeting a partner.

4. Underweight and normal-weight women are more likely to report romantic experience.

5. Overweight women report approximately 10% more partners than normal-weight women whereas obese women report approximately 10% fewer partners.

6. For women the effect of being underweight on within-relationship outcomes resembles the effect of being very physically attractive.

(This suggests that the factors influencing romantic and sexual desirability are at least in part socially structured because underweight women are less fertile so the evolutionary perspective predicts that they would be less able to obtain desired outcomes.)

These results are consistent with the social structural model that posits that women’s romantic and sexual goals are shaped by the double standard of sexuality.

Men

1. For men, the number of sexual partners increases with increasing physical attractiveness.

This suggests that men seek a greater number of sexual partners than women: Physically attractive men do better in the resulting competition for sexual access.

2. For men, being very physically attractive increases the chance of reporting purely sexual relationships (versus exclusive relationships).

3. Being physically attractive also increases the chance of having sexual intercourse in the first week of acquaintance.

4. Normal-weight men report the most partners.

5. Underweight men are predicted to report 17% fewer partners, and obese men are predicted to report 27% fewer partners.


These results are consistent with an evolutionary model in that partnerships characterized as “only having sex” and partnerships in which sexual intercourse occurs after a brief period of acquaintance are indicative of a female short-term mating strategy.

General

1. Very physically attractive individuals are more advantaged than unattractive individuals are disadvantaged.

In many instances, only very physically attractive individuals differed significantly from average/attractive individuals (the reference group) whereas unattractive individuals did not differ.

2. Women and men who are more educated and/or who have higher-status parents are rated more attractive and tend to have lower BMI.

Conclusion

It is clear that sexual and romantic outcomes are at least partially socially structured.

First, the sexual double standard unequivocally indicates that women will favor committed sexual relationships whereas some formulations of the evolutionary perspective suggest that women may pursue both long- and short-term mating strategies.

Second, the sexual double standard predicts that women will prefer delaying sexual intercourse whereas the evolutionary model does not make a clear prediction regarding gender differences (or similarity) in the preferred timing of sexual intercourse.

Third, the evolutionary model clearly indicates that more physically attractive men will have a greater propensity to form casual sexual relationships whereas the social structural model provides less guidance in predicting men’s behavior (the sexual double standard is directed at women).

McClintock notes that the two theories may overlap:

Perhaps the sexual double standard has persisted in part because the difference in sexual behavior that it enforces is evolutionarily determined and would exist regardless. An alternative explanation is that evolutionary theories of human mating behavior have been developed post hoc to explain observed behavior: Insofar as observed behavior is consistent with the sexual double standard, evolutionary theories will tend to make similar predictions.
You're welcome.
You're citing a study that only has 2 citations while related studies have more.

For those who want to check the soundness of the methodology of this not so reputable study, here: http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1 ... 011.615172

The reality out there is that normal women (HB10 or not) have pussies and they get aroused to have promiscuous sex with certain types of men, here: http://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/ ... -by-gender

If you want to look deeper into the more reputable (well cited) study, here: http://faculty.oxy.edu/clint/evolution/ ... 0Mates.pdf

:twisted:


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:51 pm 
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Learn to eye fuck and your sexual attractiveness increases by more than 60%. Get a scar on your face and your sexual attractiveness increases some more. Make women laugh and you get another turbo boost in your sex appeal. When other women see that so many other women are touching you here and there, your attractiveness shoots up tremendously again.

Sexual attractiveness for short term mating has many variables that the learned PUA uses to his advantage. It's totally defeatist not to use these odds in your favor.

:twisted:

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:11 pm 
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Your studies further prove my point, all I could find was how women were pickier than men, this is a well-known fact we call Hypergamy. Only the top males get to mate in any species, men are no different.

Women are hypergamous and only want the elite average men are invisible and ugly men are repulsive.
this study highlights this
http://www.omg-facts.com/Sex/Female-OKC ... To-H/54553


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:33 pm 
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Your studies further prove my point, all I could find was how women were pickier than men, this is a well-known fact we call Hypergamy. Only the top males get to mate in any species, men are no different.
Nah. None of the studies I linked proved any of your points.

Moreover, you're quite naive to think that ordinary males don't get laid. If that was the case, this planet should be made up entirely of winners and good looking people. Another thing is that many beauty pageant winners were sired by ordinary men.

:twisted:

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:44 pm 
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Your studies further prove my point, all I could find was how women were pickier than men, this is a well-known fact we call Hypergamy. Only the top males get to mate in any species, men are no different.
Nah. None of the studies I linked proved any of your points.

Moreover, you're quite naive to think that ordinary males don't get laid. If that was the case, this planet should be made up entirely of winners and good looking people. Another thing is that many beauty pageant winners were sired by ordinary men.

:twisted:
Of course lots of ugly men reproduce(or think they do). When women are too old to keep riding the alpha cock carousel, they settle for a beta provider who will give them the stable family they need. Women breed more than men also.
Paternity test are banned where I live it would be too much of a reality check for the French society. Lots of beta cuckholds raise bastard childs.

Winners and good looking people get the casual sex with hotties while most men have to wait on the sidelines until they come back for a provider.

I like your exemples of ugly successful men. Stuff straight ouf of the blueprint like "al pacino is charismatic height doesn't matter". Yeah right. Keep bringing your hopes up using milionaires as exemples.

If your study is serious and proves low-LMS men can get casual sex with hotties please quote the actual parts and start making some sense.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:55 pm 
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I actually already read that study you linked before you had even posted it a while back, as well as a few others that had to do with partner preferences during speed dating and casual sex propositions that were made in germany to over 100 strangers, on top of their findings the healthier the girl today in the west, the more increasingly rare it is to see, since with the way food has become so readily available, cheap and processed the easier it is to gain weight, also most things are designed with convenience in mind here, you barely have to move to do most things making a life with too much food and not enough exercise easy live out

with that in mind, I fail to see the point of this strawman-esque thread, you are more or less just projecting your own ideal of what pickup is on to this forum, this isn't the neil straus ''the game'' forum or anything, the forum is just labeled the pua forum and used to have some guest posts with dating advice from some guys involved in that book, there isn't really a set belief system here or a cult of dogmatic views, it's just a forum filled with random guys and random dating tips for all different walks of dating goals, yes of coarse more desirable attractive women are more rare and more difficult to connect with and obviously being more attractive leads to an easier dating life, if that weren't the case every guy in the world no matter the circumstances would be with any girl he wanted at any time, just because it's difficult and rare doesn't mean you shouldn't search for those girls you are interested in or take a shot at meeting someone,

out of those pictures you linked, none of those girls you listed are perfect to me but more or less no girls really are and I know none of these women, that doesn't mean that there isn't a guy out there somewhere that wouldn't find those girls perfect for them, and on top of that very few people require perfection to be sexually satisfied and cultivate a relationship, most people are more then happy with just finding someone they like that likes them back, some people will even hook up with someone just out of sheer ease of availability and boredom, it isn't impossible to sleep with an attractive girl, on the contrary it's quite possible and in rare cases where the logistics are good, it's even fairly easy, sex is a fairly readily available commodity if it wasn't then there wouldn't be billions of people living on the planet, I'm not saying you're going to be living in some fantasy land where every 2nd hottie you talk to is going to drop to her knees immediately but, you never know mate, that random girl you think you got no chance with at the bar might be your next wife if you just go give it a shot, and after taking a lot of shots you get a bit better at not getting in your own way, you probably don't need me to tell you this but I'm sure you've already come pretty far with women from when you were a virgin to now, I doubt it's the exact same for you and you learned a thing here and there on the way

in the end really what do you even have to lose? a conversation didn't end in sex?, it's not that huge of a deal in the grand scheme of things and you might be surprised that there are quite a few girls that would be up for being your FB or your friend with benefits as long as it was presented in a tasteful manner that seemed like a beneficial situation for her


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:06 pm 
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I like your exemples of ugly successful men. Stuff straight ouf of the blueprint like "al pacino is charismatic height doesn't matter". Yeah right. Keep bringing your hopes up using milionaires as exemples
I never gave any of such examples. I'm done with this thread.

There's no point in an argument when someone says A and the other mentions a totally unrelated Z.

:twisted:

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:18 pm 
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Your studies further prove my point, all I could find was how women were pickier than men, this is a well-known fact we call Hypergamy. Only the top males get to mate in any species, men are no different.
Nah. None of the studies I linked proved any of your points.

Moreover, you're quite naive to think that ordinary males don't get laid. If that was the case, this planet should be made up entirely of winners and good looking people. Another thing is that many beauty pageant winners were sired by ordinary men.

:twisted:

His problem is... HE doesn't get laid so he uses these "studies" (conducted by OKCupid... You lost all credibility there buddy) to make him feel better about himself. It's his way of justifying his excuses to himself as to why he can't get what he wants.

Keep making excuses.

All the guys out there who are "elite" men were also once ordinary guys. They worked hard to get what they wanted... Seems like that is something you refuse to do. You want something that will "just get hot women to sleep with you" but you refuse to put in the work that comes along with it.

Champions don't make excuses bro. Even if you are an ordinary guy, you can change your mindset to start thinking like you are a champion and you will become a champion.... and you will get the women that a champion does.

Otherwise get the fuck off this forum and keep being a loser who thinks that looks and money matter. Maybe for girls who are gold diggers... Sure. However, they will still fuck the guy behind your back who makes them feel good and they can have fun with. I will personally say that I have hooked up with some super sexy women who are extremely down to earth, funny, dorky girls, who like having pillow fights, playing Zelda, and talking about aliens... that don't give a FUCK about money or status. BECAUSE THEY MAKE ENOUGH MONEY FOR THEMSELVES!!

Shit, the girl I am dating right now looks like Zooey Deschanel (who is a 9 or 10 in my book), she makes more money than me, she buys me stuff all the time, she rubs my back for me, she cooks for me, she does my laundry, she cleans up after me, she takes care of me when I'm sick... And after doing all of that for me, she expects me to give her a mind blowing orgasm before she goes to bed. Poor, pitiful me, right?

You know why she does all of that? Because I make her laugh, make her feel good and because I make her horny and fuck her right. Looks, money, or status won't do any of that for you, dumble dick. Hate to burst your little bubble of reality but you can't wrap a 100 dollar bill around your dick and make a girl get off.

Go back to your PUAhate bullshit and you tools can talk about how bad PUA sucks there.

The guys who are on this forum get the results we want and we like to help others achieve the same results.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:19 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
long post

with that in mind, I fail to see the point of this strawman-esque thread, you are more or less just projecting your own ideal of what pickup is on to this forum, this isn't the neil straus ''the game'' forum, the forum is just labeled the pua forum, there isn't really a set belief system here or a cult of dogmatic views, it's just a forum filled with random guys and dating tips for all different walks of dating goals, yes of coarse more desirable attractive women are more rare and more difficult to connect with and obviously being more attractive leads to an easier dating life, if that weren't the case every guy in the world no matter the circumstances would be with any girl he wanted at any time, just because it's difficult and rare doesn't mean you shouldn't search for those girls you are interested in or take a shot at meeting someone,

out of those pictures you linked, none of those girls you listed are perfect to me but more or less no girls really are and I know none of these women, that doesn't mean that there isn't a guy out there somewhere that wouldn't find those girls perfect for them, and on top of that very few people require perfection to be sexually satisfied and cultivate a relationship, most people are more then happy with just finding someone they like that likes them back, some people will even hook up with someone just out of sheer ease of availability and boredom, it isn't impossible to sleep with an attractive girl, on the contrary it's quite possible and in rare cases even fairly easy, sex is a fairly readily available commodity if it wasn't then there wouldn't be billions of people living on the planet, I'm not saying you're going to be living in some fantasy land where every 2nd hottie you talk to is going to drop to her knees immediately but, you never know mate, that random girl you think you got no chance with at the bar might be your next wife if you just go give it a shot, and after taking a lot of shots you get a bit better at not getting in your own way, you probably don't need me to tell you this but I'm sure you've already come pretty far with women from when you were a virgin to now, I doubt it's the exact same for you and you learned a thing here and there on the way

in the end really what do you even have to lose? a conversation didn't end in sex?, it's not that huge of a deal in the grand scheme of things and you might be surprised that there are quite a few girls that would be up for being your FB or your friend with benefits as long as it was presented in a tasteful manner that seemed like a beneficial situation for her

I dont have any problem with guys exchanging tips on how to maximize their success with the women they are attracted to. I'd gladly take part in it but the amount of bullshit and delusion in the community is unbearable. It's like discussing what works in martial arts with Steven Seagal fans and practionners of traditionnal eastern martial arts when we have the UFC today. The attraction process is part of nature, it's tough and cynical. Becoming a slayer of hotties is only for elite. The analogy with fighting is pretty good since most guys think they can fight and that they can throw devastating punches, at the doors I see guys bragging about their ability to fight when they are threatening each other but they nearly all are pathetic. It's the same thing for picking up girls every guy thinks he is a legend of the game.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:24 pm 
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Champions don't make excuses bro. Even if you are an ordinary guy, you can change your mindset to start thinking like you are a champion and you will become a champion.... and you will get the women that a champion does.
You know nothing about high level sports fatty. Quit talking about things you don't understand. Champions are genetic freaks who worked really hard indeed but this dream isnt for everyone.


Sure your girlfriend is a 9 :lol: How many times did you have to watch the blueprint to actually believe that? You are an ex-fatty who landed a decent girl and mentally masturbated to the point of deluding himself he was a slayer of 9's.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:28 pm 
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Quote:



Champions don't make excuses bro. Even if you are an ordinary guy, you can change your mindset to start thinking like you are a champion and you will become a champion.... and you will get the women that a champion does.
You know nothing about high level sports fatty. Quit talking about things you don't understand. Champions are genetic freaks who worked really hard indeed but this dream isnt for everyone.
Michael Jordan, unarguably the greatest basketball player of all time, was cut from try outs on his high school basketball team.

The Beatles were turned down by Decca Records because they "didn't like their sound" and told them "They have no future in show business."

Albert Einstein was unable to speak until he was 4 years old and was told by his teachers that he "wouldn't amount to much."

Walt Disney was fired from a news paper company for "lacking imagination" and "having no original ideas"

Oprah Winfrey was demoted from her job as a news anchor because she wasn't "fit for television."


Go fuck yourself in the mouth


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:37 pm 
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Quote:



Champions don't make excuses bro. Even if you are an ordinary guy, you can change your mindset to start thinking like you are a champion and you will become a champion.... and you will get the women that a champion does.
You know nothing about high level sports fatty. Quit talking about things you don't understand. Champions are genetic freaks who worked really hard indeed but this dream isnt for everyone.
Michael Jordan, unarguably the greatest basketball player of all time, was cut from try outs on his high school basketball team.

The Beatles were turned down by Decca Records because they "didn't like their sound" and told them "They have no future in show business."

Albert Einstein was unable to speak until he was 4 years old and was told by his teachers that he "wouldn't amount to much."

Walt Disney was fired from a news paper company for "lacking imagination" and "having no original ideas"

Oprah Winfrey was demoted from her job as a news anchor because she wasn't "fit for television."


Go fuck yourself in the mouth

Any legend of any field failed somewhere sometimes in his early life you moron. Every single artist was called a failure sometimes in his carreer does that mean anything you retard? None of that facts is meaningful geniuses like Einstein usually are awkward when they grow up.

You are basically telling incel virgins they can become slayers of nine's and tens? It's like telling a fatty midget he will make it to the NBA. Jordan was a fantastic athlete who worked hard but he didnt have your shitty genetics.

Keep scamming naive guillible nerds and deluding yourself you have the ability to pump and dumb high level hotties. But for your own sake take that picture of your ugly mug away from your site your customers will never take you seriously, as a salesman you should be aware of the HALO effect, right?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:51 pm 
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Any legend of any field failed somewhere sometimes in his early life you moron. Every single artist was called a failure sometimes in his carreer does that mean anything you retard? None of that facts is meaningful geniuses like Einstein usually are awkward when they grow up.
Yet you failed at pick up and gave up... Because you are weak.
Quote:
You are basically telling incel virgins they can become slayers of nine's and tens? It's like telling a fatty midget he will make it to the NBA. Jordan was a fantastic athlete who worked hard but he didnt have your shitty genetics.
Anyone can do anything they want with hard work... YOU HAVE TO WORK YOUR WAY UP TO THAT DUMB ASS! Did you really think you could read a pick up book and go start banging models right away? If you did... You are extremely gullible yourself. I hate students like you. You want the quick fix. You've got to put in the time.
Quote:
Keep scamming naive guillible nerds and deluding yourself you have the ability to pump and dumb high level hotties. But for your own sake take that picture of your ugly mug away from your site your customers will never take you seriously, as a salesman you should be aware of the HALO effect, right?
LOL do you really think I need/give a fuck about your validation or approval? Do you really think myself or anyone on this forum cares about what what you think of them? We are all simply trying to, again, help you... but you refuse to admit your way of thinking is wrong. So you are therefore helpless. If someone doesn't want help, I can't help them. Nobody can help them. This is like talking to a brick wall except the wall may or may not be more intelligent. I'm done wasting my time on you. Good luck bro... Seems like that's all you have got going for you.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:17 pm 
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This whole thread has moved beyond being childish.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:44 pm 
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Fact: PUA (Game) are techniques and theories designed to make you more attractive to the opposite sex

Fiction: Learning PUA will get you the elusive 30/30

Fact: Power, Money, Status will allow you instant access to beautiful women

Fiction: It is impossible for your average male to date the elusive 30/30

Fact: Good looks will help snag you hot chicks

Fact: Learning how to socialize and mentally penetrate people will get you more attractive friends (male and female) (Underlying skills taught in PUA)

Fact: Having more attractive female friends leads to having more attractive women around you (their social circle)

Fact: If you can't make due with having a larger social circle to get you attractive women then it's a personal problem. The fact is you have done alot of reading but still haven't learned anything about inner-game (self-esteem). I'd say you need to have a little more confidence in yourself and say: "Hey, I'm great enough that she would be missing out without me in her life." If you believe you deserve a perfect 10 then go find her, charm her, be unapologetic about who you are (confident) and take what you deserve.

Otherwise no need to start some useless thread bashing a skill/hobby that you have obviously taken no time to actually practice.


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