Day6. How to get a day2 without being an AFC

This is a question that has circulated the forum forever, I don't say I have the universal solution, just like with everything I post in this thread, these are things that I'm using myself to overcome difficulties in my game, there might be better ways but I'm posting what works for me!

The main issue with setting up a day2 is that if you asked her out on a date then 3 horrible things are likely to happen
1. You are expected to pay for everything!
2. She will assume that you are more interested in her than she is in you and you are ok with this.
3. If she has sex with you its a favor from her to you! She owns sex and gives it to you!

The paying part is obviously not the worst of these three, if you thought so please stop reading and go get a new job!
The problem in the traditional "Man-chase-woman-game" is that you are responsible for all the action, the ideas, the money, the logistics, the conversation, etc. All she has to do is put on a pair of victoria secret panties and make sure they are slightly visible above her pant line and the guy will do whatever she wants. After this she can lean back and watch you attempt to prove yourself to be the man and the provider she needs to never have to lift a finger again. And if she chooses to have sex with you, she doesn't really want it, she gives it to you because you deserved it for spending enough money on her, because women don't like sex, and men need it to survive.

All of this is the biggest and most horrible lie in society today, the worst part is that it happens all the time! In this post I want to get your eyes away from this nightmare scenario and open your eyes for something simpler.

First of all, I never ask her out, I just don't! If I want to go out with a woman and not just bring her to my apartment I say something like, "hey I'm going down town to chill out this weekend but my buddy flaked on me, do you wanna come? we could just hang out and do whatever feels good?" If you have played your game well enough before she will agree without a doubt, the funny thing is that many girls agree because they think you are asking them out, but they don't really apply the classical date mind-set only because you did it so casually. I pull causal hangouts all the time, it is not only better gaming than a date, it is also more fun. Don't use my line straight off, just pull something similar, or invite her for coffee, you can buy her a cup of coffee, but if you end up going for dinner after that, make that sound as a mutual decision.

Recently I was in a long debate with a group of fun people on the PUA chat about the topic of who pays for dinner.
I have a simple rule, I never buy anything for a girl I haven't slept with, this disarms the girl and she can't use sex as a weapon against you anymore. Most girls assume that the guy will pay so be careful.
I usually tell the girl that I have a principle of not paying for anything until I know her and I know she is a good person, I have met resistance while doing this but never rejection, so you need to say it with confidence and keep a good frame not to come off as a jerk!
By telling a girl something like this you come off as different and also you sort of force her to DHV herself which is always amusing.

I met a girl last summer, I suggested that we should hang out and she said "as long as you pay" I told her my principle, and she said that she didn't want to see me, then I told her how I backed up my principle, I told her about trust and all that and we ended up splitting it 50/50 and had a great time! Any girls reading this will think I'm an asshole and you would be absolutely right, but I'm a charming asshole!

The best "date" I had of my life was actually also with the most beautiful girl I have ever gone out with (so far) 18yr old brunette, a perfect 10, rare as they get!
We went out for a coffee, my suggestion, this girl had game though, she picked the place, and she picked a coffee place that closed less than two hours after we met, so if she didn't like me that was the perfect opportunity for her to escape, but I charmed her good After the coffee place closed we wanted to do something else, so she suggested a late night movie, we bought tickets to the late viewing of the movie at 12am, we had 2hrs to kill until then, so I took her to a place where I was a regular, We got all the drinks for free because everyone in the place knew me (big time involuntary DHV) after that we went to the movie and then we kissed goodnight. No we didnt have sex but the date was perfect, we had a great time and the chemistry between us was great.

My point with this story is that it was meant as a causal hangout and drink coffee but it turned into a six hour perfect evening, the best dates are completely spontaneous!

I hope you learned something form this long post about how untraditional dates are the best, I said I never pay for anything, I can flex that to a drink here and there, its not black and white, but she won't get a free dinner just for spending time with me!

I want to give another dating tip while I'm at it. Many guys panic when they are on a date because their date is too beautiful, so hot they can't speak to her. Guys here is my trick: focus on her flaws (keep them to yourself though!), look at her, she isn't perfect, noone is, this makes things a lot easier and brings her down to earth.

When it comes to sex, if you are gonna have sex with a girl after your date, make sure it is a privilegie for her! You are the price, kino her and make her soo horny that she begs for it before you begin!

[EDIT] I found an old lay report that I thought fitted here. I didn't read "the game" first thing like man other guys on this forum, but right after I read it I wanted to try if it really worked, so this lay report is kinda fun because it is a mix of my own stuff and mystery routines. If you like to incorporate routines in your game this is the perfect example!
lr-perfect-from-start-to-fisnish-vt3753 ... highlight=

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Slywalker

10 things I wish someone taught me about Pick Up 10-things-i-wish-someone-taught-me-vt53087.html

I have very good day 2 skills myself and agree with what you've said. One thing you seems to be doing to and I just want to verbalize is that bouncing help to build familiarity.

Don't sit down at the same place for 6 hrs and pic your brains appart. Getting too familiar is not good for attraction. So you could get a coffee, then if everything goes well, go shopping for a little while. This will build more familiarity and make her feel more comfortable. It makes it seem like 2 dates. During the shopping don't focus 100% on her and be the little puppy that follows her around. This will show non-needyness and leadership. Be playfull, make jokes, tease then go your own way for a while to check some merchandize. Wait to see if she comes to join you. This works great also in a museum.

Cheers!

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Drink me, make me feel real
Wet your beak in the stream
Game we're playing is life
Love is a two way dream

All girls are the same my friend. Yes they come in different shapes and colours, and yes they all have issues lol but if u got solid game you can attempt it anywhere. just change your style for the postion or play. you wouldnt use a bar opener if your at your uni library

Day7. Kino-escalation basics

The term Kino escalation for me was interesting when I first came to the forum, I didn't really get what it was about, I thought Kino escalation was some sort of tanta-like routine that made girls go nuts and gave you endless satisfaction in bed.

Now i know that Kino escalation is just a PUA term for increasing the sexual energy by increasing the way you touch her.
This was something I had worked on to find a basic formula for since I first lost my virginity.
The truth is, there is no universal formula here either, although I want to give Vincent diCarlo credit for being pretty damn close, you can download his 30page e-book free online, just google it.

The basic tricks I use are fairly easy and work very good, one thing many guys do is that they dont touch their girls enough and this becomes a problem..
Let me explain it like this, imagine that you are sitting somewhere, a very beautiful woman sits nearby, you just can't think of a way to open and you get frustrated, its like there is a glass wall between you and her that you have to smash, I bet this has happened to all of you, I know it has happened to me.
But then something happens, say that a bus filled with drunk japanese tourists drive by and they are all screaming profanities that they just learned on their first visit to america. You both start laughing, at the same time, this is your opener, you comment on it and all of a sudden the glass wall is gone! Talking to her is easy and feels natural!
Here is the thing, it is the same with kino!!

This is why I love the hand shake when you first introduce yourself, some guys go in for a hug immediately, but I can't recommend this, the first hug is always quick and awkward, and there is no eye contact!
When you shake her hand, you can vary it in a ton of ways, I usually look her in the eyes and smile, touch her shoulder with my other hand. Sometimes I play with it and don't let go of her hand.
This is your kino opener, it is very simple but yet effective.

After you have opened her and you start working your game I found kino-escalation to most effective if it is constant.
Use the classic method of two steps forward one step back! In other words you are always the one who pulls back first, so you are not coming on to strong.
Alternating between giving her positive and negative body language is also very efficient, she will feel very comfortable when you open to her and you will force her to work for more attention when you give her a "cold shoulder". I know Mystery has used this method, there might be a youtube video up, if you find it please link it for the rest to see!

I also find it very efficient to bring up sex as a topic early in the conversation, as an example I'm gonna losely paraphrase David DeAngelo: Guys who are nervous and can't get sex off their mind (AFCs) tend to not be able to talk about sex, while guys who are comfortable with their sexuality and have other things on their mind will have no problem talking open about sex.
Most girls know this, you can even call an open discussion about sex a DHV if you want to!

And when you have had an open sex discussion I have also found that this helps your kino escalation, sex will no longer be something that you are both nervous about, you are comfortable together!

If you were hoping that I would explain kino escalation in depth step by step, Im sorry to disappoint you, I leave that to DiCarlo.
But mainly because like I stated earlier, there is no universal forumula that you can use, you have to feel (literally) your way to escalation. But remember, constant escalation is very efficient and I will explain why.
If the escalation is not constant and it slows down too much there is a risk she will lose interest an you will have to start over again.
If you move constant and all of a sudden speed up and move to fast you will probably freak her out!

Kino is fun to play with, start easy and don't be afraid to touch girls, just go step by step and increase the touch to more erogenic zones as you progress, don't just jump straight to her ass or tits!

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Slywalker

10 things I wish someone taught me about Pick Up 10-things-i-wish-someone-taught-me-vt53087.html

Could you give the exact title. I'm sure all his stuff is helpful but stumbled across more than one. Cheers.

good shiz mate!

Vincent DiCarlo - "Escalation Ladder" like I said its free online!

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Slywalker

10 things I wish someone taught me about Pick Up 10-things-i-wish-someone-taught-me-vt53087.html

Cheers man!

Day8. Using NLP in your game

Of all the things I'm posting in this thread, this is probably the one that turned out to be most important to me!
Ironically I was in a discussion today on the PUA chat with a guy who didn't understand the importance of NLP and were very closed minded to it.
NLP has helped me to improve my game by miles, it has also helped me to improve many other aspects of my life!

For those who are not familiar with NLP: NLP stands for Neuro Linguistic Programming and is basically a way to teach you how to control yours and others unconcious thinking!
Therefore NLP gives you advantages like - improving your selfconfidence, improve your persuasion ability, improve your ability to build rapport, improve your mood, improve your interactions etc etc.
Do not neglect the power of NLP, it can be very efficitent if it is used right!

If you are new at NLP and wish to learn about it there are a few good pointers I wish to give you!
1. Never try to learn NLP from a pick up artist! NLP in its origin is unrelated to pick up and should be learned that way and then you should attach the strings yourself and connect it to your personal pick up game.
2. Try to find NLP books in hardcopies(paperbacks) rather than ebooks, you need to focus and meditate a lot while you are processing it, something you simply don't do by your computer.
3. NLP takes time, you don't learn it over time, study a book that offers exercises and do all of them, be patient and don't stress the results! You can however get the basics down in about a month.

Some people think that NLP is some sneaky tactic that creepy guys use to fool women to sleep with them, this is all wrong, Like I said before, NLP helps you control your unconciousness, in a perfect world everyone would know NLP and all interactions would be so much better! I seriously wish that NLP was a mandatory class in highschool, things would just be better this way, The world would be a friendlier and a more understandable place.

Now since I have said that you shouldn't try to learn NLP from a PUA I'm not gonna give any instructions, but I will let you know how I use it!

First of all, I use NLP exercises everyday where I scan my thoughts and ty to find happy and sad memories that affect me positively or negatively, I can use these memories and turn them stronger or weaker and by doing this build up my mood and selfconfidence! This way it is easy to get ready to sarge!

When I interact with someone, I know how to read them, simple cues will help me to see which wordings I can use to better communicate with this person.
I know how to use my body language to communicate with this particular person, everything becomes very personal. You learn how to categorize each individual in his/her own box and you are able to communicate with everyone differently. This way all your interactions will become better.

Having mastered the communication then motivation and persuasion of others is just a small step ahead!

The way I use NLP in my pick up is to create a comfort zone with the girl, and withing minutes she will show me the same behavior as she would with a friend she had for ten years. I don't need to tell you how valuable this is!
Yet, in NLP you also learn all the opposites, so if you want to end the interaction for some reason you can just work the opposite way.

You are however not digging in any deep feelings, noone will ge hurt, the entire process is unconcious!

As a starter book of NLP I recommend "NLP: The New Technology of Achievement" edited (written) by Steve Andreas.
This book is great since it is not really written by one person, Andreas has mainly collected information from others into one great informative book, even for beginners! It costs only about 10bucks and is worth every penny. It is a good intro to this method.

If you have questions to me about NLP please feel free to post them in this thread and I will be happy to answers them. However, like I wrote here above, NLP should be learned on your own from a book in the privacy of your own comfort zone, so don't expect me to get deep into any particular exercises.
I'm also happy to answer any other questions you might have, but again please post them here rather than sending me a PM.

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Slywalker

10 things I wish someone taught me about Pick Up 10-things-i-wish-someone-taught-me-vt53087.html

I noticed a thread that popped up in the newbie forum, further discussing the issue on who should pay for dinner or not, I figured that as a clarification of my stand point I want to post my reply here as well so its all collected. I also want to say that in this thread I think Kasabi had some good views!
who-pays-for-what-need-advice-vt53431.html
Hi, I'm afraid you kind of misunderstood my post. I know I said that whoever asks the other person out for dinner, I stand by that, it is common courtesey. But, this is why I suggest you don't ask her out on a date. You simply meet up to hang out together, and when you get hungry you eat. And going to grab some food as a mutual decision usually includes splitting the bill, this is also common courtesey!

Just hanging out together, spontaneously and improvise as you go along is ten times better than a date, even in a romantic sense. There is less tension and more room for expression and sharing of feelings. I've had my fair share of ltr's myself so Im not just some guy trying to squeeze just sex out of every woman I meet.

In my oppinion, I think that taking her out to dinner and paying for everything, food, drinks, taxi, entertainment, and then expect sex in return is the real dickish attitude!

Also I would never tell a woman that I don't pay until we have sex together, saying this out loud is just stupid! I usually make up some fancy story about trust and connection and simply tell her that I'm not the kind of guy who tries to buy friendship, I tell her let's share things from the beginning until we share a connection build on mutual respect and not bribes.

I have gone on dates where I have paid for everything, this is why I know that this is not the best way of doing it. My method of splitting the payments is not because I'm cheap, it is because this is the way to create a real connection with a woman, a connection based on trust!

I hope this makes things more clear to you!

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Slywalker

10 things I wish someone taught me about Pick Up 10-things-i-wish-someone-taught-me-vt53087.html

Slyyyyy, bro. Just read from day 2 - 8, I agree with you on pretty much all you say.

In regards to NLP, some of the examples of it you gave[its uses], sounds like a lot of stuff I do naturally, and in general, most Game stuff is, just reading about it makes me aware of how/when/why it works, so it could be useful for me to look into NLP.

There was a stuff I was gonna quote but thats a bit long winded. [+I've probably forgot what I wanted to quote.]

But yeah, man, gooood posts.

I'll catch you in the chat sometime, when I have something to ask. [If its relevant to one of these posts, then i'll post in here as the response may prove useful to peeps.]

'til then, take it easy, my man.

~Blend

This is probably the smartest thing posted on the entire site. It also doesn't stop with pick ups. In general all people love to talk about themselves. Men even more so. Watch the next time you're in a group and someone asks a guy, "what do you do?" He won't shut the fuck up.

The more you can probe and get a woman to open up to you the more connected she will feel. You know you're doing good if she starts to share details about her family and friends. But the real score is if she tells you about her daddy. subconsciously all women will seek out men who have traits similar to their dads. If she brings this up on her own, well then good for you. Otherwise it's not a hard topic to get to in casual conversation.

This is probably the smartest thing posted on the entire site. It also doesn't stop with pick ups. In general all people love to talk about themselves. Men even more so. Watch the next time you're in a group and someone asks a guy, "what do you do?" He won't shut the fuck up.

The more you can probe and get a woman to open up to you the more connected she will feel. You know you're doing good if she starts to share details about her family and friends. But the real score is if she tells you about her daddy. subconsciously all women will seek out men who have traits similar to their dads. If she brings this up on her own, well then good for you. Otherwise it's not a hard topic to get to in casual conversation.

Hey! So I have read all days now up to eight and I want to throw in how helpful this has been to my game. I'm reletively new and just picked up "The Game" which I descovered is the newbie book of pick-up. I love your posts Sly and I use the knowledge everyday. I work in a boardshop and I love to pick at people heads to talk because we are world wide and I talk to people all over the world.
(Realizing that men talking about themselves and not "shutting the fuck up" is in effect here)

Thanks again Sly man

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Stay Sic lml

Day9. Let's talk looks!

First of all I want to thank you guys for all the feedback and positive responses, it motivates me to keep this up and I'm glad that things from my personal experience that helped me can be at help for you too!

"Looks" is another very debated topic in the community. Some PUAs say that it doesn't matter if you are bald fat and wear a shirt with rests of yesterdays bolognese on it.
And then there are guys like Mystery... If you haven't seen his show the Pick up Artist you should at least look up some you tube clip where Mystery is peacocking his nerds.
It is very amusing to see how they go all out, and they all end up looking the same, pierced eyebrows, a streak of color in their hair, sunglasses indoors, female tops, torned jeans etc.
And it is all based on Mysterys peacocking method, I've seen Mystery in several TV interviews, last one I saw was when he was on Chelsea lately (its on youtube) which was very intertaining, but the one thing he keeps saying is, have at least one special peacocking item, one thing that the girls can use as an excuse to approach you!

To me this is brilliant, personally I usually dress like Im some sort of rockstar, that's just my style, it doesn't really have anything to do with pick up, but I'm usually wearing clothes that are everthing but mainstream, I wear necklaces, wrist bands, a watch, sunglasses (if it's sunny) and girls approach me a lot and comment on different things I wear, honestly not so much in public but in bars all the time!

Then there are guys like Ross Jeffries and David X, they dress and look like douchebags but they are still masters in the field of pick up.
Adam Lyons and David DeAngelo usually just dress in nice respectable clothes that will look good everywhere, it is up to you what you feel comfortable in.
I have seen everything work, everything from Mysterys outrages clothing to David X.

So looks doesn't matter then? Probably not that much actually!
However, let me tell you a bit about how I got started. Some guys talk about being naturals, being able to pull women from any situation, lost their virginity when they were 12 and just kept racking up women after that. Some "naturals" are what you can call ugly but they just have an ability to pull women.

Me.. I'm an unnatural, I look pretty good, but I used to be horrible with women, I got a flirty look from a girl from a distance but as I approached and opened my mouth she would leave. Sometimes even before I came up to her because my posture and clothing style just screamed inexperience and low self esteem, this is why I started practicing pick up about way back in 2002, and in 2003 I felt comfortable enough to call myself a PUA, I became able to point out all my areas of difficulty and started to improve them one by one. Summer of 2003 I was the shit! So it took me about a year to turn from a retarded and scared little boy to a charming ladies man. But like I have said before, I still have MUCH to learn.

So in my experience, your looks matters a lot, not natural beauty that is less important, but the way you present and carry yourself!
Let's start with your body, first thing! Straighten up that spine and fix that posture! Take your hands out of your pockets and stop looking down in the ground, look up! Like YOU are superior!
You don't have to be a big muscle hunk to pull women, you should just try to avoid the two extremes, if you are way to skinny try to pack on a few pounds so that clothes look better on you! If you are a little too fat, try to make healthier choices and remove the most obvious fat. As long as you are fairly normal built, it won't be a problem. My issue was that I was way to skinny, but I little bit of food and working out buffed up my shoulders and suddenly I looked great in a suit.

When it comes to clothes.. I recommend you select your own style based on the music you listen to. It doesn't have to be as extreme as if you like elvis you don't have to dress like him. But maybe you could pick out the best of the late 50's and make a great modern style out of it?
I just feel that music as an inspiration to your clothes is great because you will always have a great explanation to why you dress the way you do and you will come off as a strong individual!

You can also vary your looks, when I first became a PUA I was always hanging at the same rockclub, it was a great place to pick up girls, and I adapted a real rebellious rock'n'rolla kinda style, now I still dress like some sort of rock star but in a fancier way, However I still have a lot of the outfits that I had back then so sometimes I switch and show up as the rock'n'rolla type again. It is a lot of fun!

I can also say without being the least ashamed that I'm a metrosexual, this is a boost for your pick up! It makes you more comfortable in your sexuality and more open, it also removes most barriers for how you can dress. I personally don't mind make up and nail polish although I usually don't wear it cause Im not artistic enough to apply it myself

When it comes to your grooming, Style said it doesn't really matter how you look as long as you are well groomed, there is a lot of truth to this but not completely.
For example, when I had my rock'n'rolla period, it would just look wrong if my hair was nicely combed and I was was perfectly shaved.
So my advice is that you should match your grooming to your style! And it will look like you care about your style, and this to many women is attractive!

Don't be afraid to experiment, try different extremes, see what type of reactions you get!

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Slywalker

10 things I wish someone taught me about Pick Up 10-things-i-wish-someone-taught-me-vt53087.html