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| Freezing out? https://www.pick-up-artist-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=130531 |
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| Author: | omegaflx [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Freezing out? |
New to the forums here, but catching on quick so hopefully you guys could help a brother out. I'll try and make this as short and entertaining as possible: Been about 6 months since I've been in a relationship/really talked to any HB's. Just been real busy with my own life and haven't cared to much. So about a month ago this HB9 starts working at the front desk of my gym. Interested, I start chatting her up every time I see her(About 2-3 times/wk depending on when shes working). My skills were pretty rusty but I did alright. About 2 weeks ago I #closed her. Was texting her for a couple days, then we went out for coffee. She's EXTREMELY shy. Took a while to warm her up, but deff saw some IOI's. After coffee we hugged and were about to go our ways, but I turned around and kissed her, It was prob too short (she seemed into it tho). Followed up with a text saying "had an awesome time, maybe we can do it again sometime." she replied "yeah me too" but nothing about setting up a second date. Here's where I fawk up. She told me on the first date she hadn't been in a relationship in a long time (always moving/busy life/etc.) I started to really like her. She seemed pretty easy, so I got off my game and was getting complacent. Big Mistake. Last Saturday(day after coffe date) text convo went like this: Me: So I was thinking either tomorrow or monday night we could cuddle up next to a fire and watch a movie together. (I know wtf was I thinking?) HB: I can't either of those days :/ Me: So when are you free? HB: The next day I have free is next saturday. Me: How about you come over and I'll cook up a vegetarian dinner(Shes a Veg) (And prob way to soon to ask over) HB: Aw I'm excited In hindsight that didn't go nearly as well as I thought. But it gets better... Instead of a short Freeze Out until our date on saturday, like I should have done to keep the attraction there, I was smothering her with attention when I saw her at the gym and with texts. So Friday comes along and I shoot her a confirmation text: Me: Hey, How's 6:00 sound tomorrow for dinner? HB: (8 hrs later) Heyy, srry just got off work and I have some bad news I have a drill tomorrow. Normally I would have just played it cool and been like "oohh okay no problem, enjoy your drill" But I was reading some of David DeAngelo's Philosophy and decided to take a different route: Me: Well thanks for the last minute notice. What are you going to do to make this up to me? HB: I'm sorry I forgot Me: (4 hrs later) Oh ok no sweat I don't know if that was the right way to handle that, I mean do I look like an angry asshole who can't handle rejection now? Anyways, If you've read this far THANK YOU! Wtf do I do now?? I really like this chick, shes good gf material. I started a freeze out immediately following her flaking on me. Problem is, like I mentioned earlier, I inevitably see her 2-3 times a week so I can't completely ignore her. I saw her today as I was leaving and smiled and said hi, so did she. Didn't seem awkward or anything. I also #closed a couple HBs at my college to get my mind off of her. So Is this farked? If not when do I try and ask her to hang out again? Should I try and chat her up when I see her in person or just stick to the friendly Hi/Bye? Any help you guys could give me would be MUCH appreciated, just getting back into the game, but I'm trying! |
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| Author: | Imar [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Freeze out & friendly hi/bye until you notice that she's trying to make contact. I'm pretty sure that you are on her mind. |
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| Author: | omegaflx [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: Freeze out & friendly hi/bye until you notice that she's trying to make contact. I'm pretty sure that you are on her mind.
What exactly do you mean by her trying to make contact? Texting me? talking more than usual when we exchange hi/bye's? She's very shy so I'm not sure how to gauge interest at this point.
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| Author: | Cognizant1 [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
She's in complete control, you're in her frame. Step back, don't contact her much but dont complete freeze her out. Go meet other girls, go about your business when she realizes you aren't playing into her frame/script that she's the prize she'll be curious to know what's monopolizing your time (e.g. another girl, perhaps?). She will contact you guaranteed, you just gotta be strong and refrain from engaging her as much. The places she sees you are social I presume such as the gym. Start engaging other people there, particularly girls (cute ones, not fat ugly ones) she'll get jealous guaranteed and in process who knows you may make some new friends to fuck! |
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| Author: | omegaflx [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: She's in complete control, you're in her frame.
Step back, don't contact her much but dont complete freeze her out. Go meet other girls, go about your business when she realizes you aren't playing into her frame/script that she's the prize she'll be curious to know what's monopolizing your time (e.g. another girl, perhaps?). She will contact you guaranteed, you just gotta be strong and refrain from engaging her as much. The places she sees you are social I presume such as the gym. Start engaging other people there, particularly girls (cute ones, not fat ugly ones) she'll get jealous guaranteed and in process who knows you may make some new friends to fuck! Thanks bro. You think DHV'ing is the key here? Its hard not to cave sometimes, I've been talking to a lot of chicks lately to get my confidence up. Seems like having multiple HB's at one time is the key to playing it cool with one of them. tried to rep...guess i dont have enough? |
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| Author: | AmazingArt [ Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
The way to become good with girls is the same way to become good with anything. It's called practice. But not just practice, but rather practice a lot. Look at pickup like sports. You can read all day about football you can ask hundreds of people on the forums about football, you can know every little science detail of how football works and the mechanics behind it but if you don't actually go out and play football you will never be a good football player. And practice is not only about winning this one game the same way being good with girls is not only about winning this one girl. It's rather winning in the long term. Do you know which football players are the best? Not the ones that read about football all day and not even the ones that practice football all day but rather the ones that are ambitious and practice to achieve their goals. Now imagine you combine all the three together 1)knowledge 2)practice and 3)ambition you will be unstoppable. So go out there into the FIELD and get ready for Superbowl because Superbowl is reserved for the ambitious and the hard working. Good luck! |
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| Author: | Hakuna [ Thu Mar 08, 2012 6:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
You fucked it up pretty bad in the beginning, but possibly not beyond salvaging. I'll try and be brief as it sounds like you have some grasp over basic game concepts. In your whole exchange with her, besides the beginning, you were way too engaged. It is true that men are supposed to aggressively pursue the women they want, but in a very COUNTER-INTUITIVE WAY. Take this quote by Robert Greene to heart: "The most perfect seduction is the one where the seduced thinks they are doing the seducing." After you CREATE that spark of attraction and rapport, your job is to then back off a bit, draw up some competitive anxiety (make sure she knows that other women want you), and they to lay back as she chases you. Near the end the way you handled it was wrong, it was only "text book right." You executed the right way; but you have to remember one thing no matter what type of game you're running. Frame control is everything. Mystery said it perfectly, "with the right frame, you can say or do ANYTHING." And the contra is true - under the WRONG frame, almost ANYTHING can come off the wrong way. So in your case, your frame control was weak and your entire dynamic with her functions under the subtle assumption that SHE IS THE PRIZE. That's a losing mentality, YOU need to be the challenge. Other women need to want you, you need to be busy, you need to have other passions, you need to show her that you're a high value male who can't be tied down easily. So when you told her "when are you going to make it up to me?" it immediatley got filtered down through that SAME FRAME; which means it comes off as MORE SUPPLICATION. You're being MORE DESPERATE for her attention. When DD was referring to that line, he meant it from a cocky/funny standpoint; one where YOU ARE ALREADY DOMINANT, so it comes off as flirtatious. From THAT perspective, "when are you going to make it up to me?" is just another cocky/funny retort (the already embedded assumption that she WILL make it up to you, and has to for that matter because she has offended you). And lastly, your reaction to this whole thing needs to be indifference. Not because it'll get her back, but because you're treading on Oneitis waters. I can already tell from your post that you're thinking about her too much; go fuck ten other girls just as hot and your predilection for this girl will fade away. And don't overdo the ignorance. A freeze-out will ONLY work with PREVIOUSLY ESTABLISHED ATTRACTION. If a girl isn't interested in you enough, a freeze out will only push her further away. And if a girl is VERY interested in you, and you freeze her out too often; she will become resentful. The key is to understand that game is an organic concept, and can be MUCH more dynamic than most people think. At this point, act Disinterested. Not like you're trying hard to forget it, but rather that you just also lost interest in her. Hit on other girls, preferably ones hotter than her and let her see you close them. And finally, neg her/ DHV heavily. And don't ever say "I think I'm going to cave in." As you think, you shall become. |
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| Author: | Cognizant1 [ Thu Mar 08, 2012 8:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Kahanu is spot on but I'd avoid negging, it's counter productive |
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| Author: | omegaflx [ Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: You fucked it up pretty bad in the beginning, but possibly not beyond salvaging. I'll try and be brief as it sounds like you have some grasp over basic game concepts.
Awesome advice Hakuna, thanks! You seem very knowledgeable, so I would also like to make a couple points that maybe you could comment on.In your whole exchange with her, besides the beginning, you were way too engaged. It is true that men are supposed to aggressively pursue the women they want, but in a very COUNTER-INTUITIVE WAY. Take this quote by Robert Greene to heart: "The most perfect seduction is the one where the seduced thinks they are doing the seducing." After you CREATE that spark of attraction and rapport, your job is to then back off a bit, draw up some competitive anxiety (make sure she knows that other women want you), and they to lay back as she chases you. Near the end the way you handled it was wrong, it was only "text book right." You executed the right way; but you have to remember one thing no matter what type of game you're running. Frame control is everything. Mystery said it perfectly, "with the right frame, you can say or do ANYTHING." And the contra is true - under the WRONG frame, almost ANYTHING can come off the wrong way. So in your case, your frame control was weak and your entire dynamic with her functions under the subtle assumption that SHE IS THE PRIZE. That's a losing mentality, YOU need to be the challenge. Other women need to want you, you need to be busy, you need to have other passions, you need to show her that you're a high value male who can't be tied down easily. So when you told her "when are you going to make it up to me?" it immediatley got filtered down through that SAME FRAME; which means it comes off as MORE SUPPLICATION. You're being MORE DESPERATE for her attention. When DD was referring to that line, he meant it from a cocky/funny standpoint; one where YOU ARE ALREADY DOMINANT, so it comes off as flirtatious. From THAT perspective, "when are you going to make it up to me?" is just another cocky/funny retort (the already embedded assumption that she WILL make it up to you, and has to for that matter because she has offended you). And lastly, your reaction to this whole thing needs to be indifference. Not because it'll get her back, but because you're treading on Oneitis waters. I can already tell from your post that you're thinking about her too much; go fuck ten other girls just as hot and your predilection for this girl will fade away. And don't overdo the ignorance. A freeze-out will ONLY work with PREVIOUSLY ESTABLISHED ATTRACTION. If a girl isn't interested in you enough, a freeze out will only push her further away. And if a girl is VERY interested in you, and you freeze her out too often; she will become resentful. The key is to understand that game is an organic concept, and can be MUCH more dynamic than most people think. At this point, act Disinterested. Not like you're trying hard to forget it, but rather that you just also lost interest in her. Hit on other girls, preferably ones hotter than her and let her see you close them. And finally, neg her/ DHV heavily. And don't ever say "I think I'm going to cave in." As you think, you shall become. You were dead on with the one-itis observation. This has actually happened to me multiple times before. I am an above average looking guy and attraction has never been a problem for me. I generally don't have any issues with AA if i see a chick im interested in, sometimes I even get opened by chicks. Where I falter is in maintaining attraction/escalation. I pretty much always play it cool up until she starts showing me affection and I dive right in and become over enthusiastic. I'm 20 years old and I'll be real honest in saying I don't have a lot of experience with chicks, only slept with three different ones! It's only the last couple of years I've come out of my shell and really grown a set and gotten myself out there. So I think lack of experience has subconsciously been causing my to project needyness. Also fear of rejection is a big thing for me, not in the approach per se, but in loosing a girl after i have her, which makes me cling even harder. Fuckin classic Push/Pull. Looking back on the interaction with this girl and taking into consideration the fact that shes extremely shy (had a hard time maintaining eye contact because she was so nervous) and hasn't been in a relationship since she was in high school (shes also 20) I think I came off as way to aggressive. Probably thought I was trying to fuck her right off the bat by inviting her over for dinner. Been challenging myself to talk to one new chick a day at my college, so I already feel like I'm moving on. So with that being said I'm going to pull this girl off the table and take it as a lesson learned. Can you elaborate a little bit on frame control? There seem to be a lot of interpretations on the idea... I've been reading soooo much on here its like a fuckin religious awakening i cant even tell you, definitely realized how much i DONT know. |
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| Author: | omegaflx [ Fri Mar 09, 2012 9:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Update on HB9: Well it's definitely absolutely not fucked! So its been 7 days since I've had any contact with this girl aside from one hi/bye. I went to the gym today like normal. After my workout I changed into a nice slim-fit dress shirt and pants, looking pretty fly. Was going out to eat with a friend. So on my way out I stop by the front desk and ask HB9 to make me a shake. I was greeted with a huge smile and a "Heyyy how've you been? Haven't seen you in a while.." I replied "Oh yeah my schedules been crazy how've you been?" Threw a couple light negs at her and she starts going on "Yeah I'm doing a half marathon this weekend and blabbing about what shes doing this weeekend. I continued talking to her for about 15 minutes, she was keeping really strong eye contact, COMPLETELY in my frame. Told her I got a new job "Ohh is that why your all dressed up? I replied "Nahh I'm going out to dinner with someone tonight" trying to make her wonder who. Was about to leave when I spilled my shake on the floor for the third time not on purpose, I'm just clumsy. She comes rushing over with paper towels trying to help me clean it up. Again, completely in my frame. Was thinking of shooting a text tomorrow saying " Kick some ass tomorrow, If you don't loose I might let you kiss me." Still talking to other chicks but this is definitely on the backburner again. |
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| Author: | AnthonyFreedom12 [ Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Carry on |
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