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"Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedback n
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Author:  Xafc [ Sat Nov 13, 2010 6:36 pm ]
Post subject:  "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedback n
I'm fine-tuning an opener and would love feedback. Seems like there are three basic classes of openers, which I call the three O's: obvious statements ("This place is packed"), out-of-the-ordinary statements ("Whoa, there was a huge fight outside"), and opinion requests ("Got this situation and need an opinion").

I'm working on an out-of-the-ordinary opener that stacks into a consistency technique. I learned about consistency techniques from the outstanding book Influence, a classic of general game (game not specific to pickup). Basically, the goal is to get the target to commit to a view or position, and then make her act consistent with it. So here is the opener, which I call "two oddest things."

Two Oddest Things
-----------------

[Walk up to multi-set, over the shoulder]
Me: Man, I just saw the oddest thing I've seen all month. Actually, the SECOND oddest thing. [Hook]
Girls: [hopefully] What? Tell us.
Me: Gotta go in a second. [Body rock] So, I parked my car in the lot. I'm in a good mood, got a nice raise today [DHV]. So I'm walking up the sidewalk to the club ...
Girls [hopefully rivited]
Me: Wait, I gotta find Jill and her friends [DHV]. She said to meet at the couches, wherever that is.
Girls: Oh, the couches are over there. [hooked by the story, want me to go back to it]
Me: I can stay another sec. Jill never complains about waiting [DHV].
Girls: [hopefully throwing IOIs, want the story]
Me: So, I'm walking up the sidewalk, chilling. I look up and there are two guys standing there smoking cigars. [pause] In clown suits. You guys must've seen 'em. They're probably still out there.
Girls: [hopefully laughing]
Me: I kid you not. Big noses, bozo hair, yellow pants, the whole bit. What the hell are they doing there? What is this--the clown bar? Is this where clowns go to hang out after the circus?
Girls: [hopefully there are some IOIs by this point]
Me: So I walk past them an nod, you know. And this one clown looks at me deadpan and says, "Want to trade shoes?" I look down and he's got these HUGE Ronald McDonald shoes on. So I look at him deadpan and say, "No way, man. But I'll take your nose." The clowns bust up laughing.
Girls: [hopefully hooked]
Me: Bizarre, man. And that's not even the ODDEST thing I saw this month.
Girls: [hopefully begging to hear it]
Me: [looking them over] I gotta go in sec, and I'm not sure you all can HANDLE this story. I have no problem telling this story to a bunch of guys, and would feel OK about telling it to bad girls ... but you look like good girls.
[OK, this is the crucial point. Hopefully one of the girls says she is a bad girl, or "I don't know, I'm not so good." At which point I say, "So you're a bad girl, huh. Kiss me on the lips then." This is the consistency tactic. She made a claim, now she has to back it up. If she balks, say "What I thought. All talk. You girls aren't ready for this story." If she complies, a kiss-close and social proof out the ass. The set could go a bunch of ways at this point. In the best case, I have a target who has been IOI'ing me, and I can say, "You might be ready for this story. I'll tell YOU--over by the couches," and lead her away. So now to the second story.]
Me: I'm driving down [whatever street in town]. It's around noon. I'm driving over to my ex-girlfriend's place [DHV], listening to my CDs. There's a lot of traffic. So I happen to look over, and coming the other way is a black sedan--a Honda, I think. Anyway, I glance over right as the car passes, and in the driver's seat is this beautiful, well-endowed blonde. She's got this big smile on her face. Only thing, she isn't wearing a SHIRT. I mean no bra, nothing. Just the seatbelt.
Girls: [laughing]
Me: So I drive past thinking "What?" I figured I must not have seen right. Then I look in my rear-view and there are all these guys honking like crazy and shouting out their windows. The woman just tools down the road. [shake head] Never HAVE found a plausible explanation of that one.
Girls: [hopefully throw out their theories]
Me: Hey, let's go find those clowns. See if they want to party.

Anyway, any thoughts or constructive criticism?
Author:  jazz25 [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:20 am ]
Post subject: 
you should try this out

EDIT:
I advise a cheat sheet with keywords, or cue cards.
This could be a difficult one to memorize. *
Having a friend mouth the routine to you, behind the girl / set could also be a good option.
Author:  Ryan Black SashaPUA [ Mon Nov 15, 2010 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:
Me: Gotta go in a second. [Body rock]

Me: Wait, I gotta find Jill and her friends [DHV]. She said to meet at the couches, wherever that is.

"So you're a bad girl, huh. Kiss me on the lips then."
Saying you gotta go in a sec only need be done once, early in the interaction, you don't need to body rock here, in fact it's quite odd to do so.

You don't need to interrupt your story again for the Jill thing, again it's weird.

There is NO WAY a girl will give you this much compliance unless she is incredibly attracted to you, and in front of her friends will activate ASD hardcore. Saying that ppl aren't ready for a story, or the bad girls thing, is great, but the k-close thing won't work 99 times out of 100.

Did any of this actually happen to you? If not, this is pretty weird shit to think up. Anyway, we can all offer our opinions on what needs work, but you'll learn more by simply trying it out and seeing for yourself what you need to work on. I wouldn't necessarily expect quite as much enthusiasm as you seem to have built into their responses, but if you open with a smile and tell it enthusiastically, they could well warm up to you.
Author:  jazz25 [ Tue Nov 16, 2010 1:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:
Quote:
Me: Gotta go in a second. [Body rock]

Me: Wait, I gotta find Jill and her friends [DHV]. She said to meet at the couches, wherever that is.

"So you're a bad girl, huh. Kiss me on the lips then."
Saying you gotta go in a sec only need be done once, early in the interaction, you don't need to body rock here, in fact it's quite odd to do so.

You don't need to interrupt your story again for the Jill thing, again it's weird.

There is NO WAY a girl will give you this much compliance unless she is incredibly attracted to you, and in front of her friends will activate ASD hardcore. Saying that ppl aren't ready for a story, or the bad girls thing, is great, but the k-close thing won't work 99 times out of 100.

Did any of this actually happen to you? If not, this is pretty weird shit to think up. Anyway, we can all offer our opinions on what needs work, but you'll learn more by simply trying it out and seeing for yourself what you need to work on. I wouldn't necessarily expect quite as much enthusiasm as you seem to have built into their responses, but if you open with a smile and tell it enthusiastically, they could well warm up to you.
You are jealous that his routine will get him laid ten fold. I have seen people like you before.
Author:  antivenin [ Tue Nov 16, 2010 3:49 am ]
Post subject: 
I like it. I would take the clowns offsite. Say you saw them at the gas station. Two thugs smoking stogies with no business at a place dressed in clown suits sounds like a robbery about to go down.
Author:  greasy [ Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:00 am ]
Post subject: 
This is very clever.

Another good one would be to say you saw aliens. They should be green of course because who would believe you saw red aliens? Although E.T. broke the stereotype with his gray skin and telescoping neck, he is a Hollywood actor and not the real thing. When they say, "No way." You can tell them, "You calling me a liar?"

Then they will believe you because nobody wants to be rude. This will be the most incredible story that the girls ever heard. Get ready for sex 12 fold.
Author:  Ryan Black SashaPUA [ Tue Nov 16, 2010 11:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Me: Gotta go in a second. [Body rock]

Me: Wait, I gotta find Jill and her friends [DHV]. She said to meet at the couches, wherever that is.

"So you're a bad girl, huh. Kiss me on the lips then."
Saying you gotta go in a sec only need be done once, early in the interaction, you don't need to body rock here, in fact it's quite odd to do so.

You don't need to interrupt your story again for the Jill thing, again it's weird.

There is NO WAY a girl will give you this much compliance unless she is incredibly attracted to you, and in front of her friends will activate ASD hardcore. Saying that ppl aren't ready for a story, or the bad girls thing, is great, but the k-close thing won't work 99 times out of 100.

Did any of this actually happen to you? If not, this is pretty weird shit to think up. Anyway, we can all offer our opinions on what needs work, but you'll learn more by simply trying it out and seeing for yourself what you need to work on. I wouldn't necessarily expect quite as much enthusiasm as you seem to have built into their responses, but if you open with a smile and tell it enthusiastically, they could well warm up to you.
You are jealous that his routine will get him laid ten fold. I have seen people like you before.
I'm simply offering him the best advice I can give from my experience. I also encouraged him to actually field test the stuff out, so he can see for himself what works and what doesn't.

I would invite you to field test the idea of using an indirect opener about clowns and then attempting to use the theory of cognitive dissonance to essentially logically convince a girl she should kiss you, within 2 minutes, in front of her friends. There are ways of getting a 2-minute k-close, but to my knowledge this is not one of them.

For the record, the advice I've seen you give so far mainly involves telling guys who are having trouble escalating that they might be gay. Rather than attacking me for "being jealous"??? why don't you actually put your effort towards offering your considered opinion, or asking questions, or reading material, or going out and actually gaming women.

As a final point, I used to do a lot of outrageously involved, detailed, and hilarious openers. Having girls standing around you laughing is a great feeling when you're starting out. But, you know what? The opener doesn't actually get you laid, it just gets your foot in the door. As soon as you've got attraction from your target, drop the jokes and the negs, and isolate, qualify, comfort build and get back to your place ;-)
Author:  jazz25 [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Saying you gotta go in a sec only need be done once, early in the interaction, you don't need to body rock here, in fact it's quite odd to do so.

You don't need to interrupt your story again for the Jill thing, again it's weird.

There is NO WAY a girl will give you this much compliance unless she is incredibly attracted to you, and in front of her friends will activate ASD hardcore. Saying that ppl aren't ready for a story, or the bad girls thing, is great, but the k-close thing won't work 99 times out of 100.

Did any of this actually happen to you? If not, this is pretty weird shit to think up. Anyway, we can all offer our opinions on what needs work, but you'll learn more by simply trying it out and seeing for yourself what you need to work on. I wouldn't necessarily expect quite as much enthusiasm as you seem to have built into their responses, but if you open with a smile and tell it enthusiastically, they could well warm up to you.
You are jealous that his routine will get him laid ten fold. I have seen people like you before.
I'm simply offering him the best advice I can give from my experience. I also encouraged him to actually field test the stuff out, so he can see for himself what works and what doesn't.

I would invite you to field test the idea of using an indirect opener about clowns and then attempting to use the theory of cognitive dissonance to essentially logically convince a girl she should kiss you, within 2 minutes, in front of her friends. There are ways of getting a 2-minute k-close, but to my knowledge this is not one of them.

For the record, the advice I've seen you give so far mainly involves telling guys who are having trouble escalating that they might be gay. Rather than attacking me for "being jealous"??? why don't you actually put your effort towards offering your considered opinion, or asking questions, or reading material, or going out and actually gaming women.

As a final point, I used to do a lot of outrageously involved, detailed, and hilarious openers. Having girls standing around you laughing is a great feeling when you're starting out. But, you know what? The opener doesn't actually get you laid, it just gets your foot in the door. As soon as you've got attraction from your target, drop the jokes and the negs, and isolate, qualify, comfort build and get back to your place ;-)
well if you dont experiment you wnt know if your gay or not?
Ok, you sound like you really know your stuff!! but why do you speak like talking to girls is a video game. Thats kinda wierd..

How do i know when she is attracted?
Author:  jcgurango [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
"What the hell are they doing there? What is this--the clown bar? Is this where clowns go to hang out after the circus?" - Just kinda sounds dick-ish there. You're just being an ass to the clowns, it's not even funny... Also, you said "You know," which is a filler. Don't use it.
Author:  Diego1234567 [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
You are jealous that his routine will get him laid ten fold. I have seen people like you before.
I'm simply offering him the best advice I can give from my experience. I also encouraged him to actually field test the stuff out, so he can see for himself what works and what doesn't.

I would invite you to field test the idea of using an indirect opener about clowns and then attempting to use the theory of cognitive dissonance to essentially logically convince a girl she should kiss you, within 2 minutes, in front of her friends. There are ways of getting a 2-minute k-close, but to my knowledge this is not one of them.

For the record, the advice I've seen you give so far mainly involves telling guys who are having trouble escalating that they might be gay. Rather than attacking me for "being jealous"??? why don't you actually put your effort towards offering your considered opinion, or asking questions, or reading material, or going out and actually gaming women.

As a final point, I used to do a lot of outrageously involved, detailed, and hilarious openers. Having girls standing around you laughing is a great feeling when you're starting out. But, you know what? The opener doesn't actually get you laid, it just gets your foot in the door. As soon as you've got attraction from your target, drop the jokes and the negs, and isolate, qualify, comfort build and get back to your place ;-)
well if you dont experiment you wnt know if your gay or not?
Ok, you sound like you really know your stuff!! but why do you speak like talking to girls is a video game. Thats kinda wierd..

How do i know when she is attracted?

Jazz start asking normal questions and speak to someone that isnt through a computer before you think youre better than everybody.

im with Blondguy; It needs to be believable and expect less compliance.

its good that you're trying though, for sure. go out experiment with it but have a few simple, tried and tested openers for back up.

if the girls arent taking it, just tell them your talking shit and needed an excuse to speak to her. itll be something to laugh about ;)

and the 'jil on the couches' is cool and paints a good picture of you in her mind but unless you are with Jil on the couches, its not the best thing to say as she may look over or even want to meet Jil.

try making it more vague like "oh my friend, shes around here somewhere but we keep losing each other", she might even be like "oh yeah me and my friends always lose each other".

on a last note, you dont want to follow this whole thing all the way through, you want to find some 'hook' words that you can make a conversation or parts of it you can talk about.

i.e. "he wanted to borrow my shoes!!",her-"haha what!" "i know girls lend each other shoes as if it was a bank loan". she might contribute to your conversation that way :D

introduce your name during the high parts as well. Im trying to be constructive not criticise it (if i have im sorry). so in short; make it so she HAS to contribute to the conversation and get some rapport going (the handshake and name exchange is the simplest).


peace and love,

Shah
Author:  Xafc [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:
Quote:
Me: Gotta go in a second. [Body rock]

Me: Wait, I gotta find Jill and her friends [DHV]. She said to meet at the couches, wherever that is.

"So you're a bad girl, huh. Kiss me on the lips then."
Saying you gotta go in a sec only need be done once, early in the interaction, you don't need to body rock here, in fact it's quite odd to do so.

You don't need to interrupt your story again for the Jill thing, again it's weird.

There is NO WAY a girl will give you this much compliance unless she is incredibly attracted to you, and in front of her friends will activate ASD hardcore. Saying that ppl aren't ready for a story, or the bad girls thing, is great, but the k-close thing won't work 99 times out of 100.

Did any of this actually happen to you? If not, this is pretty weird shit to think up. Anyway, we can all offer our opinions on what needs work, but you'll learn more by simply trying it out and seeing for yourself what you need to work on. I wouldn't necessarily expect quite as much enthusiasm as you seem to have built into their responses, but if you open with a smile and tell it enthusiastically, they could well warm up to you.
Thanks for the responses! It didn't happen to me--I just have a really fertile imagination. It is weird shit, but here is the way I see it. There are three basic types of openers: ordinary (nice weather), out-of-the-ordinary (fight outside), and opinion. I figured why not go as out-of-the-ordinary as I could get away with? So, what's a really bizarre thing you could see outside the club? I came up with clowns. And the topless chick in the car--I don't know where that came from. I could see the whole thing playing out in a mind.

For sure I presented the *best case* of HB responses. I mainly hoped you guys would tell me whether it was too weird to work.
Author:  Xafc [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I like it. I would take the clowns offsite. Say you saw them at the gas station. Two thugs smoking stogies with no business at a place dressed in clown suits sounds like a robbery about to go down.
Yeah, that sounds better:

1. If some HB rushed outside to see the clowns and they weren't there (which they won't be), then the story gets challenged. "You made it up."
2. The clown suits at a gas station poses a possible but debatable explanation: a robbery.
Author:  Diego1234567 [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:25 pm ]
Post subject: 
have you done any opening in field yet? knowing roughly where you are would help me and others help you about your opener :D
Author:  Xafc [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:

im with Blondguy; It needs to be believable and expect less compliance.

its good that you're trying though, for sure. go out experiment with it but have a few simple, tried and tested openers for back up.

if the girls arent taking it, just tell them your talking shit and needed an excuse to speak to her. itll be something to laugh about ;)

and the 'jil on the couches' is cool and paints a good picture of you in her mind but unless you are with Jil on the couches, its not the best thing to say as she may look over or even want to meet Jil.

try making it more vague like "oh my friend, shes around here somewhere but we keep losing each other", she might even be like "oh yeah me and my friends always lose each other".

on a last note, you dont want to follow this whole thing all the way through, you want to find some 'hook' words that you can make a conversation or parts of it you can talk about.

i.e. "he wanted to borrow my shoes!!",her-"haha what!" "i know girls lend each other shoes as if it was a bank loan". she might contribute to your conversation that way :D

introduce your name during the high parts as well. Im trying to be constructive not criticise it (if i have im sorry). so in short; make it so she HAS to contribute to the conversation and get some rapport going (the handshake and name exchange is the simplest).
Thanks for the feedback! Sounds like the takeaways are:

1. Make it believable. Any of those things could happen and probably have happened, but make them as plausible as possible. Maybe putting the clown-thugs at the gas station would suggest a reason for their existence.
2. Add hook points (the listeners want to go back to this event in the story) that are also launch points (girls lend shoes).
3. Stay vague so I don't get nailed in a lie.

One question offering you name. I read somewhere that it was better to reward an HB with your name after she asks for it, rather than announce it.
Author:  Xafc [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "Two Oddest Things" opener (untested) - feedba
Quote:

I would invite you to field test the idea of using an indirect opener about clowns and then attempting to use the theory of cognitive dissonance to essentially logically convince a girl she should kiss you, within 2 minutes, in front of her friends. There are ways of getting a 2-minute k-close, but to my knowledge this is not one of them.

As a final point, I used to do a lot of outrageously involved, detailed, and hilarious openers. Having girls standing around you laughing is a great feeling when you're starting out. But, you know what? The opener doesn't actually get you laid, it just gets your foot in the door. As soon as you've got attraction from your target, drop the jokes and the negs, and isolate, qualify, comfort build and get back to your place ;-)
OK, thanks for the feedback! A couple of good points here:

1. The kiss was best-case fantasy. You're right that it is pretty damn unlikely.
2. I see what you mean about "drop the jokes and the negs," but I see the clowns and blonde as out-of-the-ordinary stories. The idea I want to convey is that there are a whole lot more stories where they came from. Throw out some teasers for those stories.

Mystery says you have to get in a talkative frame of mind. Talk, talk, talk, talk, talk. If I have a seemingly inexhaustible supply of interesting stories, that seems better than talking about how the weather has sucked lately etc.
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