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Who and What to Believe?
https://www.pick-up-artist-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=55696		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Ryan Black SashaPUA [ Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Who and What to Believe?
A persistent and burning question for me is this:

When you get advice from a mPUA or even a friend/wing who's a natural, how do you know whether what they say works BECAUSE they do it a certain way, or DESPITE the fact that they do it.

For example, let's say you have a natural friend who's also quite good looking, and his game works by doing a super direct opener.

Now if he gives you the advice to approach and just say "I'd be kicking myself all day if I didn't come over and say hi" then that might very well work for him, but if you're not super hot and you don't have his level of body language and confidence, then this opener will not work for you. You are probably better off learning a more indirect method of approach, for example.

How do you separate the elements of a PUA's game so that you can cut away the stuff they just kind of "get away with" because of all their other positive attributes, and learn just the things they do that are actually grounded in psychological theory and can be replicated by anyone, regardless of their looks or whatever?
Author:  Ezo [ Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
The point of PUA is really in the end to get enough positive attributes to get away with anything.

When I started I had the approach to try every advice a few times and if it did not work with my personal style I would exclude it from my game. Trust in yourself and what the experiments give you in field. And if you feel uncomfortable saying something try to understand why and just wait until you feel comfortable, or just skip it. There is no right or wrong man. Stuff that works like a charm for me does not work at all for my wong because we have different attitudes, differences in inner game.
Author:  Jav [ Fri Nov 13, 2009 2:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
I remember a quote that went a little like this

"stay away from the ones that claim to have found the truth, follow those who seek it"

I think it was confucius or something.


Anyway, that one is pretty accurate.

Hobbit is making a valid point.
Author:  Angelz [ Fri Nov 13, 2009 4:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
erm you test it....no theory is 100% true....until you proof it yourself....watch The Blueprint Decoded...you'll understand more.
Author:  Tenmagnet [ Fri Nov 13, 2009 8:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
I agree with what the guys above said - try everything, and see what works for you. Learning pickup is a process of experimentation, exercise and practice.

The two things that can stop that process are a) continuing to do stuff that doesn't work because some guru told you it should and b) refusing to do stuff that DOES work, because you think (without reason) that it won't work for you. Either mistake can hold you back for a long time.
Author:  Ezo [ Sat Nov 14, 2009 1:53 am ]
Post subject: 
Hey I didnt know that Tenmagnet was here on this forum! Happy happy joy joy! A great addition to our community!!!

Ezo
Author:  frankcat [ Mon Nov 16, 2009 4:53 am ]
Post subject: 
This is the most interesting post I'v read so far I Love it, I love it, I love it. I believe you should always keep it indirect, why show her your interested in such a direct way when you can keep her guessing. Even if you are good looking why show her your interested, because if you show her your interested she has the power to play games with you (even if shes interested in you also, we all know that girls love playing games just to see how we'll respond and giving us shit tests and putting up bitch shields just to see if we can break through them) where as if you can make her interested in you and your acting like your not interested in her all her energy will be spent trying to win you over and her mind will have no time to generate bitch shields and shit tests because it will be working to win you over.

So to some it all up I believe that even though going direct is a good strategy sometimes, going indirect is a good strategy all the time (good looking or not).

And to add on I think to figure out what really works as opposed to what works some of the time you should find some one who is similar to or less good looking than you who gets a lot of action and hangout with them and see what works for them because then you will know that whatever works for them can work for you and it has nothing to do with you not being physically attractive enough. If it does not work for you it now has something to do with your delivery of body language, voice tonality, congruency or ability to deliver the canned material with out is sounding canned etc..... Because the physical attractiveness variable has been taken out of the equation and now you know that it must be something else
Author:  Temur/Jeskai [ Mon Nov 16, 2009 7:50 am ]
Post subject: 
I heard Kajun once say that physically attractive dudes can get away with a bit more. So, I suppose gaming with somebody as or worse looking than you would be a good idea, granted they are more experienced than you, and are willing to teach you. Makes sense. However, I think that the line seperating what physically attractive guys can do and what physically less attractive guys can do is really thin. I less attractive guy with Gibraltar-like inner game will get much farther than than male model who acts like a puss. Oh, and I wonder whether not going direct is limiting your desires as a man. Seriously, there may be some women, who just want a dude to stand up and say "Yes goddamnit, this is what I am looking for, and if you are down, great, if not whatever." Don't deny yourself, fucking go caveman.

OBTW, Indirect Game is just fine but I feel that inner game can equate to weaker inner game, however that is just my experience. Someone who is really good at Indirect stuff, like Mystery, just needs a lot of practice and lots of time spent on outer game. However, something that could be a stumbling block for Ind. Game is that eventually you do have to push the interaction into something more sexual and failure to do so could lead to serious awkwardness. THis is one of Chief's biggest concerns and rightfully so. Eventually you must have sex with the HB or you really can't say you are doing much.
Author:  expat_of_love [ Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
1) If someone offers you advice with a name like "Full House" or "Mystical" you might want to think twice. What's wrong with being a Doug or a Mark?
2) If they offer a "special opportunity" you might want to think twice.
3) If they want your credit card number you might want to think twice.
4) If they were born after "The Wall" came down you might want to think twice.
Author:  Ezo [ Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
Isnt your name "Expat of love"? ;)
Author:  Marc [ Sun Dec 06, 2009 5:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Who and What to Believe?
Quote:
A persistent and burning question for me is this:

When you get advice from a mPUA or even a friend/wing who's a natural, how do you know whether what they say works BECAUSE they do it a certain way, or DESPITE the fact that they do it.

For example, let's say you have a natural friend who's also quite good looking, and his game works by doing a super direct opener.

Now if he gives you the advice to approach and just say "I'd be kicking myself all day if I didn't come over and say hi" then that might very well work for him, but if you're not super hot and you don't have his level of body language and confidence, then this opener will not work for you. You are probably better off learning a more indirect method of approach, for example.

How do you separate the elements of a PUA's game so that you can cut away the stuff they just kind of "get away with" because of all their other positive attributes, and learn just the things they do that are actually grounded in psychological theory and can be replicated by anyone, regardless of their looks or whatever?
You are missing the point. An opener is just to initiate a chat but your body language, voice etc. telegraphs your personality. So your friend can use certain 'pick up lines' because he completely believes that it would work and says it with conviction. Since he believes in his lines he says it confidently and his body language displays that. You on the other hand dont think thos elines would work and hence subconsiously telegraph that with your body language.

Someone brings up another good point, the age old question about good looks. Good looks is very subjective. What may be good looking for one girl may not be considered good looking for the other ! Let me try this again, mPUA Mystery's look is different from that of David Deangelo, some girls may find Mystery terrible looking and not go for him others may not get attracted to David D but get attracted to Mystery. The only way to find out is to approach the girl and she would telegraph whether thats the look that she is attracted to or not. I hope I'm doing a good job of explaining. Others are welcome to jump in !

Believe me when I say this buddy: ANY LINE WORKS, ANY THING WORKS !!
Author:  T0RNAD0 [ Sat Dec 12, 2009 3:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
In field experience gives you the final answer. When I first started I tried openers and routines that I srtrongly thought would never work but they do. So Going out seeing it your self is the best measure of effectiveness.
Author:  Johnny B. [ Sat Dec 12, 2009 3:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the wise. Seek what they sought. ~Matsuo Basho
[ Johnny B ]
Author:  StreetLight [ Sat Dec 12, 2009 4:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
as most of the guys here said,experience in the the field is what important, try everything and after a time you develop youre personality, OR you can learn not from the advice but from what actually works (for example, if he looks good, look at what he wears, and think about youre style, if you think his body language helps him mimic it)
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